1. So they say to take 250mg of rue extract for the MAOI properties if you were gonna take some DMT, but how much should you take if you wanted to have some kind of experience with just the rue itself. How much should/could you take to "feel" something?

2. Also, when taking caapi/rue/harmine/harmanline, once you swallow it, how long before the MAOI properties actually take effect and how long does the MAOI actually stay active in your system?

3. How often can you take harmalas? Can you take it once or twice a week safely? Any tolerance build up?


Thanks.

ive taken harmalas daily for more than a year. You become more sensitive to it IME..no tolerance at all.

250mg is enough for even a harmala experience without any DMT. WIth rue harmalas I would not go above 250mg to start..maybe start with 150-200mg even.

thanks man...that is what I was looking for.

how do you prefer to take it? mix it in some juice? or capsule it?

yea 200mg would be good. i would just meditate in the dark. if you get nausea simply slowing your breath and laying still in the dark helps

i just drink rue now usually. but when i take harmalas i usually put a bit of water or juice in my mouth, throw the harmalas in (they'd be on a small dish thing i use on my scale that made that easy), then quickly swallow it all as i take another sip of water

thanks...gonna try this tomorrow night

anyone know the answer to #2 on my original post?

You should start to feel effects in about 30-45mins.

thanks man

I had to learn my Ayahuasca lesson the hard way and it was an extremely traumatic and terrifying lesson.....

That lesson was to never, ever try to take any Pharmahuasca or Ayahuasca-like mixture involving DMT and Harmalas WITHOUT either Caapi or at the very least some THH to go with it...

The Caapi is what makes the magic...without the magic you are basically just spinning your psychedelic wheels.

RUE by itself doesn't do anything that I would consider worth experiencing considering the dietary restrictions that you have to go through.

MY magic mixture is

100 grams of vine
40-50mg of Harmine
25mg of harmaline
and if I have it....50mg of THH.

This mixture has given me the Best visuals and most nurturing trips of my whole life
I have also had great success with using Amanita to increase the effects DMT...
The thing is though I only used Amanita's that have been sun dried...The ones I picked are so incredibly potent that I only need to take less than quarter of a gram for it to work.
Any more than that and it gives me stomach problems(cramps) the next day..it also puts a dark spin on the trip if you do to much.

I dunno man I think this is all self suggestion..everyone is different though.

I have drunk ayahuasca freaken hundreds of times and for a long time I bought into this rue is inferior stuff also..until I started to work with it. Rue is easily equal to caapi IMO..rue does not cause any more sickness than caapi IME..rue is not less euphoric and the afterglow of rue matches that of caapi and it is every bit as magical. It is a very psychedelic plant all on it's own well worth exploring.

Sometimes I even prefer rue..

Not saying you are wrong, just that IME none of this stuff about rue vs caapi people are always talking about is true for me..I love rue and think it gets an undeserved bad reputation.

Where did you get this "THH" you speak of? You did not happen to get it from FV did you?..cus that stuff was found to not even be THH and was actaully harmine..everyone was raving about this "THH" though and how adding it to rue or taking it with harmine made the trip so much better and euphoric and the afterglow was better..becasue people believed that was going to happen I guess even though they were just eating regular harmine.

"RUE by itself doesn't do anything that I would consider worth experiencing considering the dietary restrictions that you have to go through"

Harmalas are RIMA's. The dietary restriction you refer to are largely based on old outdated data that was based on pharma MAOI's..while at very very large doses there may be some maoB inhibition in some people, it does not seem to be the norm. If you are one of those people than sure if you are taking like 5-10g of rue than be careful, but still the worse thing to happen is probly a headache when it comes to RIMA's, unless you are taking other drugs that are contraindicated..

Personally I have never observed dietary resrtictions other than to avoid stimulants, and I have never had a problem or witnessed promlems in others I have had come and drink with me.

good stuff there Jamie...very interesting....hundreds of times huh? wow.

Is the "dietary restriction" thing kind of a myth with rue and caapi? Considering you take it every day, I figure there is no way you are eating a perfect diet every day.

**EDIT**


I hit "post" on my reply...and your message was there were you were talking about diet.. lol

So basically NO caffeine huh?

yes, I do most ofen drink a small dose of ayahuasca every day. These doses will only last for an hour or less usually and I dont follow any tyramine free diet aily or weekly when I drink full doses of the tea. I just eat basically a raw vegan diet so my diet is clean but I eat cultured foods without problems. You must avoid certain other drugs though like stimulants..caffine you will want to like have no more than 1/4 you normal ammount cus it will be potentiated etc...edit, this is more an issue after, you can have caffine like hours before hand and it wont be potentiated when you drink.

I have had nights where I drank extremely strong vine and ended up going all night long and still having mild tracers and nausea through the entire next day, but that is very rare..but harmalas can sometimes go that long so you must be careful with stimulants the next day even sometimes.

Could you give me an idea of what a "small" dose is? Just curious because I might want to try it.

How much caapi and how much dmt?

an approximately standard dose is 500g caapi with 85g of viridis


imagine rue to be coffee.. taking 10g of coffee is gonna make you pretty crook, but a small dose will let you feel what happens when you take it. if you have no experience i'd say boil some water, add 1-2 grams, leave it for 5 minutes, and just feel what's happening, the only bad reports you see from rue are from people that take internet found recommendations at face value and just go for it. if you familiarise yourself with what Esphand does you will be rewarded, it's a beautiful plant in its own right

500g? seriously? I guess your probably joking, but i don't see the point in messing with people who don't know whether your serious or not

behindthelight- a low dose of caapi/dmt (your just using freebase/fumerates then?) would be different for everyone but i guess around 50g vine and 20mg dmt..for some more, for some less. Eat something light like a piece of fruit after dosing to get digestion going.

Even that dose not be enough to kick the trip off for some people though. The more vine you drink the less dmt you'll need as well.. i would just take a high dose of the vine alone first to see how strong it is and how you react to it..just to get a feel for the experience. High doses of vine are the way to go IME. Its a very different experience and you'll need much less dmt/admixture to get where you want to go




i disagree..a small dose of rue really isn't comparable to a large dose of rue, in my experience.

Got it...thanks man.

when I say I drink a light dose daily I am talking like maybe 1g of rue with .5g mimosa or something like that..just enough to get into a deep meditation state. I brew like 40g of rue at a time and maybe 10g mimosa..for a full dose I have anywhere from 2.5-5g of the rue and however much mimosa is in there..if I need more mimosa I have a seperate brew of only mimosa and I drink some of that as well.

If we are talking caapi maybe 10g a day of most vine..the caapi I have now though maybe 2-3g..

These are more like meditational microdoses though..not like just a medium level "trip"...I work with these meditational sort of doses every night before I go to sleep, sometimes with melatonin as well. I drink full doses 1 or 2 days a week..sometimes I will take a break altogether for a few days or whatever I feel cus this sort of dosing can stack up upon itself and things can get very strange a times.

careful pushing the envelope with rue only experiences, at a certain level it becomes extremely unpleasant. when i first discovered rue+mimosa, i had 200G of a 3X Rue extract and a bunch of mimosa. The first 5 or 6 tries i underdosed the rue, taking only a gram or two thinking it would be enough to activate the DMT. when i finally got up to a high enough level of rue to get the full ride, i probably redosed 3-4 times that night. fantastic evening! I probably consumed 15-20 grams of the rue. The next day, i took another large dose and planned to play some more with my new interdimensional toy, but not 5 minutes after i drank the rue i had my head in the toilet, and spent the next 30 minutes vomiting violently. The remainder of the day was spent in bed with constant motion sickness, nausea, and overall feeling miserable. It seems the rue was still in my system from the night before, and the big dose in the morning after led to a rue over load, and i paid dearly.