I thought it would be interesting to have a thread dedicated to this subject (I even thought there was one already but couldnt find....)
So for those that dont know, when one evaporates a harmaline/mine saturated alcohol, a red product called harmala red (or turkish red) forms. It is still a mystery what this product is. It could be active, it could be not-active.. It could be harmine/maline n-oxide, it could be something else. More tests are needed about it's general properties, and specially, whether its active or not (and if there are any differences from harmaline/mine or if its the same)
here's a good post from 69ron with a picture of it:
69ron wrote:There is such little information about harmala red out there.
SWIM has seen it form after evaporating harmala alkaloids in 99% IPA.
Here's a picture of it:
Harmala Red Forming from Harmaline HCl
SWIM saw this "harmala red" junk form in a matter of minutes after evaporation in IPA at 150 C. These were hydrochloride salts.
SWIM never saw that happen after evaporating in water.
Heat may play a role in forming "harmala red". SWIM never tried evaporating in IPA without heat.
The structure of “harmala red” is not published anywhere. It is said to be inactive, but I really don’t know if it is or not.
This “harmala red” coloring is used in making old Persian carpets, and maybe it’s responsible for the “Magic Carpet” concept. Maybe it’s active, and maybe it soaks into your skin and makes you high if you sit on a red carpet nude.
I’m partially joking, and partially serious. Harmaline is known for giving people the feeling they are flying or moving if enough is taken. That’s exactly what a “Magic Carpet” is supposed to do. Maybe such a thing is real and caused by too much “harmala red” in the carpet?
Could harmala red be harmaline N-Oxide or harmine N-Oxide? Oxides are often reddish.
If anybody has any more information about it or makes bioassays or solubility tests or whatever, please post here.
SWIM thought of 2 ways of testing whether it is harmaline/mine n-oxide.
First would be to dissolve it in acidified water, mix with zinc dust, basify, re-extract. Maybe it turns back into the parent compounds, and would be a proof it was indeed an n-oxide.
Another way would be to add some hydrogen peroxide (a highly oxidizing agent) to pure harmala alkaloids, and see if they turn into harmala red.
Right now SWIM has only very little alkaloids and will be moving soon so has no time for it. If anybody wants to try any of these, would be interesting to know the results