Hey Now,

If God created the universe in all of it's diversity out of Godself or the mysterious Void, by a simple process of logical deduction... what then is not God? Some folks believe that the universe simply exists, period. Nor do they see any Omniself, hidden within each individual part of the totality. Each vision of existence is equally viable, so don't get me wrong. We all have some idea of what we believe is the "ultimate reality" or perhaps a supreme, eternal field of conscious awareness (or possibly, the lack therein). We may have different reference points, preferences or psychological frameworks by which we view this underlying spiritual essence but we each have a unique voice and a right to share our truths. I would love to have a chance to have a taste of your wine, figuratively speaking.

Ironically, even amongst "religious" human beings, we find philosophical differences and set up diverse camps which compete and debate their perspective and beliefs, the entire time, seeking to negate the soul inspirations of their fellow sentient beings. Even when similar regional areas share social and historical/cultural backgrounds, we find hair-splitting and endless rounds of debate. The Sufis, for example, feel that Allah (God) is present, immanent and literally alive within every fiber of existence. So do the Hindu yogis, regardless of the polytheistic panorama of their overall faith. While orthodox Muslim theology is far more extreme in emphasizing polarities, as it makes a clear demarcation between the physical universe and the spiritual universe. In a nutshell, the two are at war and certainly not one totality. This is a common thread throughout the Judeo-Christian-Islamic doctrine. As it is with the Parsi religion (Zoroastrianism). The Baha'i faith, as well, sees the world as entirely illusory and therefore, definitely not the incarnation and living embodiment of the Divine Light. The "world" is conceived of as quite evil and a barrier to realizing a conscious union with Allah. Meaning the physical universe and the organic activities which occupy it's ebb and flow.

This sentiment seems to be echoed in the many orthodox Christian theologies as well. So why is it that Sufism and Baha'i clash about semantics and conceptualizations, both being born in the same flame? Such a paradoxical comparison can be made about this philosophical wrinkle. Now, both religious sects are predominantly practiced in Iran (Persia), although Sufism has roots which reach back thousands of years, they are adamant about how different their faiths are. I read a book by Abdullah Baha (the eldest son of Baha'ullah, the founder of the Baha'i' movement) about 28 years ago and I was shocked how he spent so much time and effort in delineating the differences between Sufism and the Baha'i faith. Isn't that something else?

Why must there be such segregation amongst "spiritual" peoples? By in large, most humanoids share fundamentally similar religious values, regardless of denomination. Considering the vast ideological variegation between fundamental Islam, Hinduism or Buddhism... must there be such separation between those who either choose to faith or have had experiences which support a certainty of God's existence? Even beyond that, how is it that many of us arrive at a point where we awaken to find ourselves so in tune with this unified presence, that we realize that we ourselves, are God. It can appear that everything is Divine and therefore, nothing is not Divine. So there is no God that is divided from the creation of this universe. Why would religions place the Deity so far away and damn the world as disconnected from spirit? Hmmm... IMO, that's totally whack!

There is a point, and I speak from my own small experiences, that individuated self consciousness can be interphased with the Spirit. In so doing, the loss of an isolated self is supplanted by the indivisible Omniself. And then? Well, if a person is on a psychedelic voyage, the oneness naturally dissipates. As if the One Being awakens to see through the eyes of the many, only to be lost when the chemical wears off and the ego returns to seize the reigns. Certainly, there is a period of integration and I do believe we are able to carry much of the experience with us, on this side of the looking glass. Hey, practice makes perfect? A work in progress? Oh yeah...

Obviously, we are a community of psychonauts. We each respect the power of Sacred plants and their extractions. While we don't all have the same experiences or interpret them in the same way, we are all essentially in the same boat, which I feel is headed for unknown territory. Some would even say, towards unknowable territory. So, in conjunction with the imbibing of psychedelic substances or through many years of internal spiritual practice (or both), an attunement to subtler levels of awareness is born. Against the onslaught of self obliteration, somehow a central core of being survives the loss of subjectivity. Awareness being aware of itself? When all else is stripped away and thought is neutralized, we have an opening to unite with this pure awareness of being. We fall into rapturous union with such a frequency of transcendent consciousness, the same universal being residing within every iota of existence. The interrelationship within all of life.

My point? Well, if two such regional faiths have such ideological conflicts and obvious separation, how about the rest of the planets organized religions? Isn't it blatantly obvious that there is only One unified field of all-knowing consciousness? Apparently not... still, I am all ears to hear what other Nexians believe, in regards to our interconnectedness and our vision of the Divine. Even atheistic humanoids accept that everything in the universe is created out of the same cosmic stuff (waves & particles) and is connected to every other thing, as in String Theory quantum physics. Whether they have the experience of seeing the whole/oneness, seeing the Light of infinity or hearing the Word of God (Aum the primordial spiritual vibration which is believed to have initiated the Big Bang and the unfoldment of the physical universe).

I would like to emphatically stress just one request within this little thread, please do not approach the table with a counterpoint to someone else's belief system. There is enough room in this universe for all of our convictions. I respect each of you and wish to hear any and all vantage points expressed but I fear that for some unsettling reason or another, we might have a resurfacing of the same one upmanship game that often arises, when these ideas are brought into open discussion. Please, for the sake of unity and mutual respect, let us pull out all the stops and freely share our own unique perspectives. I ask this in advance, as I would like to draw many of the gentle folk out to play. Frankly, many of the kindest souls are afraid to speak their minds for fear that they will be assaulted intellectually. This is not good. In other words, let us dance without reservation, delight in the free exchange of heartfelt communication. Shall we? Lend me your voices, my friends.

Peace, love & Light

I believe that there is eternal movement. An eternal unfolding or opening. An eternal revealing.

This means there is eternal mystery. There are forever things that are yet to be revealed.

There is no “ultimate” reality.

Rising that was pretty spot on with I believe as well. I try to see the reflection of the Divine within every creation. After all, we are all echoes and reflections coming from an infinite source of Love and understanding. When you learn to accept that everything happens for a reason, you can ride life's pulsing, changing, cosmic rhythm in constant bliss. Eternally dancing through life, death, and birth as well learn, together, to understand the Source. Art is trying to create IT. Religion is trying to explain IT. And government is trying to control IT (always unsucessfully in my opinion). IT being the whole cosmic bang. The Universal truth that lies within each of you can't even explain with words but you FEEL IT. Kundalini rising, egoless death, time compression.

Anyway I want to write more but I think that sums it up. Plus I'm getting interrupted. I am not sure which belief this aligns with besides perhaps pure spirituality. I try not to attach religion words as they can create boxes and boundaries to understanding the Truth.

~Peace and Love

everything is not-god

(everything that exists is a manifestation of god. therefore god does not exist.)

I think it's very difficult or impossible to really understand what is god, if it would be, it certainly would be impossible to put into english language.

I'm All in for it.

interesting!!

i personaly like to think of everyone and everything in all of creation as a god force/divine energy.....and we are like tuning rods to it, reaching out of the great womb of life experiancing itself, expanding the fountain of all knowledge...

ultimatly WE ARE ONE

I'm soooooo not going to tell you what's God and what's not, You have to figure that out yourself hehe

for me, the truth is....i don't know what i beleive anymore. It changes from day to day it seems. In the past i always saw god as the supreme being. Now i see god as a creator, maybe a civilization that created us or simply each human who creates their own universe but is connected to everybody elses universe through energy and that in itself creates another universe and so on. The thought goes for ever.
I think a higher power put religion on earth many many years ago for a reason. The stripped down message is basically how live the best way and become the best person you can be, and to prepare yourself for the eternal exsistance. Why is it called the B.I.B.L.E.? Basic Instructions Before Leaving Earth?(coincidence) Our life here is preparing us for our real life for eternity? I think mans ego has gotten in the way of true reigion and now spirituality is the most real religion there is today, no relious denomination.
Whats crazy to me though. Is I can see everybodies point of view in just about every thread i read hear on the nexus. Everything makes sense in some sort of way to me. Thats why i enjoy reading threads so much, though i dont post that much because my experience is limited for now

So fascinating seeing people talk so much about god and chemistry in the same place.

I personally like the conventional (non-pantheistic) Islamic perpective on God which lists 99 names and attributes which God has informed us humans about in the Quran.God, as the Creator, is distinct from His creation and I believe therefore that the world we know (and the ones we dont know) reflect His Majesty without being a part of Him.

One of His attributes, for example, is The All-Seeing but that doesnt mean He has eyes as we know the term 'eyes' to mean;I believe that He 'sees' in a way that befits His magnificence and knowledge of how He sees is not required for an upright life that He wishes for us, for our benefit rather than His.

Great thread BTW!!

Thank you all for your comments, Folks.

I've been doing a lot of silent meditation lately and some soul-stirring Sacred Voyages, in conjunction with quite a bit of contemplation (some of it pertinent to this very discussion). One thing recently surfaced in my mind and I would like to share it with you guys. I am not going to extrapolate any philosophy to it, rather, present the vision as it directly occurred before my mind's eye.

I was, at the time of the vision, still shimmering in a post Salvia Divinorum state of effervescence. I was re-entering my habitual thought patterning, when a lucid vision literally popped into my head. It was a highly detailed, symbolic image of a multi-layered holographic transparency, on the surface of the design was that of a human face. This transparency had three distinct interior layers to it's overall composition, almost as an onion does, interiors within interiors.

The external layer was the humanoid face and familiar features to the The Watcher of my subjective perception. I speculate that where I a dolphin or an elephant, I would have the vision of the eternal layer in an morphication mirrored by species identification. So, was this the face the visage of humanity, as a symbolic form or my own inner face?

So as this design lingered before my mind's eye, I observed the interiors within the anthropomorphic exterior. Beneath this exterior layer existed an interior self, which appeared similar to the exterior layer, yet, was oscillating between holographic semi-solidity and a shimmering formless translucency. It pulsed into and out of recognizable form, as it seemed to be in two places at one time. It was more illuminated than the exterior layer and was an intermediary type of being. One part in the manifesting phase and one part in the unmanifested state... so to speak.

The central interior of this onion-scape, was completely formless radiance. It did not pulse or vibrate, although it did seem to evenly radiate it's current through the secondary, intermediary layer, betwixt the outer/exterior and central/interior of the still, formless radiance. The central core was an expanse of emptiness (of sorts), whose blinding light had within it's essence, an indivisibility of being. Such a degree of unity that it is void of feature. By 'feature', I mean any recognizable reference our subjectivity is able to conceive of or understand through logic. From my ordinary rationale, I speculate that it's insubstantiality, it is limitlessly unbound and indivisible in it's transcendent nature. :idea:

So, it became evident to my mind's interpretative faculty, that perhaps this was a fourth interior layer? A layer which is actually a non-layer or anti-layer? A vacuum in which potentiality is as of yet, immaterial and essentially unreal, in the ordinary sense of the idea of potentiality and reality?

As thoughts began to form in my mind, the fourth interior core began to be absolutely inaccessible to my subjectivity. I still saw the light of the central layer and the secondary and primary layers of the holograph. When I committed to a rational assessment of the core void... I had un-immersed myself from the ego-shattering of my subjective field of awareness and regained familiar reference points and self identification (normal consciousness).

Upon further reflection, it occurred to me that perhaps my organic self, my 'real self', was the outermost crust of the of this internal vision and it's holographic, onion layered design? Could my 3 dimensional, personal ego be the polarity of the Void contained within the formless interior light or just the outermost orbit of this universal awareness? This holographic symbol would seem to have a deep meaning to it. Maybe even a map of perceptual layering? A curious symbol indeed!