In ICD-10 (and I believe in DSM V too), classic schizophrenia/delusional disorders and drug induced mental/behavioral disorders have a different classification status, so no, they are not the same even by the standard diagnostic manuals. Even in the section dealing with drug induce disorders, they clearly specify that to fit the classification the symptoms should not be ¨explained on the basis of acute intoxication alone¨ , which means (if I understand correctly) most transient psychotic-like symptoms in a psychedelic state would NOT fit the definition for those disorders.

Plus, of course, we can still criticise those diagnostic tools in the first place, but that´s a separate discussion.


But yes I definitely do think that psychedelics can induce experiences that have similarities to the schizo/psychotic experience. Like a venn diagram, they overlap in some areas but are not the same. Its imo innacurate and a disservice for both the psychedelic community as well as for those suffering from mental conditions to equate them completely without realizing the clear differences (but its also a disservice to look at psychedelics `romantically` and think it`s all `rosy flowers` without realizing the possibility of delusional experiences)

It´s important to know we could have delusional experiences with these substances, have temporary psychotic-like mental patterns and behaviors, and do stupid things, like run around screaming while having one`s door open with the DMT extraction equipment in plain sight. Or it could all be wonderful. Either way, be careful folks

Well said, endless. I know if someone were to watch me on pharma night without knowing what I was on, I'd be exhibiting all kinds of classic psychotic signs; uncontrollable laughing and crying and dancing, or the shouting and carrying on (I'm a basement troll far from neighbors so I can really cut loose if the spirit moves me).

But I'm back to "normal" the next day . . . except that goofy grin that lasts a few days.

I agree that shamanism practice is different from schizophrenia... but that does not mean it's not psychotic - schizophrenia just happens to fall under the same umbrella "psychosis" as a DMT experience.

Personally... I don't like using the umbrella word "psychosis", as I think it's about as meaningful as distinguishing MMA from table-tennis using the umbrella word "sport"

No, you hear about the efficiency apartment and dorm room "lab" busts in the news from time to time.

What's a DMT lab without a screaming naked guy around though?

endlessness - Very true. The overlap is a profound reminder of how shimmering of an illusion our often day to day absolute sense of reality really is; it's often little more than a hop, skip and a jump between the supposedly "sane" and the certifiably "insane". The somewhat recent study classifying many large scale corporate CEOS as sociopaths might ring some bells here.