Has any one on this site experienced any negative effects from dmt? derealization? depersonalization? even depression? Your answers would be very much appreciated.

people have smoked this day in and day out for weeks to apparently no ill effect. i would love to believe there are no negative effects, almost like if it is nootropic or something, but i doubt it. there needs to be more research done and no ones doing any because its illegal. we may never know.

In my friends expereince so far, he has smoked it no more than once a week he find the afterglow uplifting and the long term antidepressant in the days after.

One possible 'negative' effects : - finding it much more fun than watching TV and therefore making it an habit !

I think having such an intense way to escape from reality can cause issues for people. If you have strong willpower this is probably not an issue, but because the experience is so short but so intense the urge to keep going back can be overwhelming. Also once you start messing with neurotransmitters the body tries to compensate. I have seen horrible crashes in others experimenting with exctasy, etc.. Hopefully when the brain compensates for the excess neurotransmitters in the case of the spice the psychological letdown when you stop will not be an issue. SWIM went through 3 grams over the holidays (3.5 wks) and is now on a month long sabbatical. But swim is still thinking about it everyday (3 days into sabbatical and counting). Next time I plan on moderation.

obssesing about experience. I am not addicted to the substance, however I am preoccupied by thought of it. I find my self posting about it in online forums. It seems to be more signifigant than real life. It has not interfered with my life but I am sure into doing it again.

As with just about everything one can ingest, anything can be bad if taken in excess. Even water will kill you if you drink too much in too short of time. Generally, most things are fine if done in moderation. The trick is learning and knowing what the moderation level is. Even some of the most dangerous substances can be benificial if taken in moderate amounts and only occasionally.

I agree it is all about moderation like anything, the smoke can be quite harsh so that cant be great for you, im also obsessed with it thats a side effect

[quote:b8a4b2cd5d="ubik"]I think having such an intense way to escape from reality can cause issues for people.[/quote:b8a4b2cd5d] what is reality?

heh yeah obsessing about the experience is a for sure side effect. one physical effect swim has noticed is it seems to trigger the flight or fight response, in the body. sweating, heartrate spike and so fourth. so if you would be warry about the warning sign in front of a rollercoaster there might be some physical danger.

What is reality? You are right, this is impossible to answer, I was just using a shortcut to try to describe the world we see when not under the influence of anything mind altering (I know this is a lame description but I am trying). I remember a passage from a Robert Anton Wilson book about a student asking his guru "how does he know that the world he experiences is real?" The guru slapped the student upside the head and said something like "here is an example of a direct experience of reality. " I know I butchered the story but I can't find the passage. I remember lol when I first read it as a kid.

it seems whats bad to one could be good to another i think its how one travels between both polarity's is the way

I found this quote on the Brainsturbator website article about DMT ( the inner quote is from Rick Strassmans book about DMT, I double checked the reference) "A word of caution before we look deeper, and before the reader is tempted to romanticize this drug. As puts it on his superbly written site Rigorous Intuition: Strassman ended his clinical studies of the drug in part because he gave serious weight to the warning of a “highly intuitive” friend who told him she saw “evil spirits hovering around you. They want to come through this plane, using you and the drugs.” If that sounds superstitious or absurd, that merely means you don’t have friends who are capable of seeing like that. Some of us do, and we find your scoffing adorable. (I would refer the curious reader to the Barbara Brennan School of Healing.) What his friend pointed out is very true—DMT is fairly sinister stuff, once you get to know it. The drug is more accurately considered a death molecule than a spirit molecule. It’s hilarious that DMT is illegal, because it has to be the single least addictive drug in the known Universe. In fact, it can blow your face clean off. " Interesting, do you think Strassman may be right about evil entities using DMT users as a portal to reach this world? Sounds like a Lovecraft/P.K. Dick story to me.

[quote:19a8e65c85="ubik"]I found this quote on the Brainsturbator website article about DMT ( the inner quote is from Rick Strassmans book about DMT, I double checked the reference) "A word of caution before we look deeper, and before the reader is tempted to romanticize this psychoactive. As puts it on his superbly written site Rigorous Intuition: Strassman ended his clinical studies of the psychoactive in part because he gave serious weight to the warning of a “highly intuitive” friend who told him she saw “evil spirits hovering around you. They want to come through this plane, using you and the psychoactives.” If that sounds superstitious or absurd, that merely means you don’t have friends who are capable of seeing like that. Some of us do, and we find your scoffing adorable. (I would refer the curious reader to the Barbara Brennan School of Healing.) What his friend pointed out is very true—DMT is fairly sinister stuff, once you get to know it. The psychoactive is more accurately considered a death molecule than a spirit molecule. It’s hilarious that DMT is illegal, because it has to be the single least addictive psychoactive in the known Universe. In fact, it can blow your face clean off. " Interesting, [b:19a8e65c85]do you think Strassman may be right about evil entities using DMT users as a portal to reach this world? [/b:19a8e65c85]Sounds like a Lovecraft/P.K. Dick story to me.[/quote:19a8e65c85] In my opinion, no. IMO the entitities are a part of our subconcious ,they are you, a visual manifestation of different parts of your personality.

[quote:3ebc7ea21c]If that sounds superstitious or absurd, that merely means you don’t have friends who are capable of seeing like that. [/quote:3ebc7ea21c] Bunch of craps ! Ah well, sorry for ranting, I just lose my self control when I read things like that. It's so stupid that its almost impossible to argue against : "Ah well you can not see that invisible things, so you are wrong"... What an argument ! Nobody can say anything against. You are just damned right. Ooops, should not use the word "damned"... Asylum are full of poor people seeing and hearing 'entities'. Some drugs may makes you hear and see things, so what? Even direct brain stimulation may cause that. Yes the brain is incredibly complicated and creative and this is where is the mystery, no need to believe in "entities" ! Check deeply you beliefs and you will see why you *need* to believe about the existence of immaterial entities. Check deeper and smoke some DMT.. and you will see there is no more needs for such beliefs . (note : I believed such stupid ideas when I was young... taking time to examine oneself mind is long, never ending story anyway, but some cleaning is possible)

The interesting thing I think is not whether Dr. Strassman's reasons for stopping DMT research are valid or "crap". The information is all there in his book "DMT The Spirit Molecule" but maybe some people picked it up and read the stuff which reinforced their interest in DMT and dismissed anything that did not fit their specific reality tunnel. I did not even read the chapter on why he quit doing the research until I tried DMT myself and now I am not sure. This stuff does feel like "swimming in the deep end of the pool" and not childsplay. But that is just my opinion.

[quote:73ca23d0c1]This stuff does feel like "swimming in the deep end of the pool" and not childsplay[/quote:73ca23d0c1] DMT is the most serious thing ones can experiment (along with other psychoactives but DMT has some 'advantages' amongs others IMO) Nobody here would say it is a childplay ! But I would say that imaginative entities are indeed childplays Thinking our inner imaginary is 'true' is at best a childplay, at worst something to worry about ones mind sanity OK, now one issue is to decide if what is "seen" under the DMT influence comes from 'our' mind or not. Exalted by some visions, ones may think that this is too strange and can not be created by ones mind... but that's ignoring our incredible abilities to create mind-worlds. You can create mind-worlds with nasty entities wanting to take control on you. If you believe it, you will *make* it. Not 'you' as the thinking ego of course. This 'you' has very few control and power (mostly enough to be a social vehicle), but the whole entity who is 'YOU' can create incredible worlds ! Back to topic : is it safe to see thoses entities ? Is it safe to have some 'out of body' experiences and meet some 'nasty entities' ? Same issue. Many, many people still think that this is possible...

n,n,dmt is released naturally in the brain during REM sleep.

so visa-vi; taking a hit of dmt would be the same on the brain as a very very long dream.

only ill effects i've noted in my research are a harshness in the throat from torching dmt in a special pipe.
and once noted chest congestion for a week or so afterwards.. but that was most likely due to it being flu season.

but there is a chance of panic attack. i've witnessed one in an ill informed user; and experienced one (but was in combination with 2cb and was badly timed)

but to the contrary, witnessed a user with absolutely no previous psychedelic usage have a glowing experience.

Im growing tired of hearing people quote Strassman as if he is the defacto source or all that is truth regarding DMT. And that his opinion is Fact.

im tired of people stating that DMT is released during normal sleep cycles in REM sleep. and therefor our dreams MUST be made of or related to the DMT compound or trip.

Yes, DMT is found in our bodies... yes it DOES occur during sleep, but in no way would a DMT trip be akin to a very long dream. Your dream is NOT a DMT trip how do I know?

simple.

Ask yourself this question

Have you ever had a dream so real scary emotional or funny that you awoke Frightened, Crying, or laughing. This is often the case for many people and happens to everyone at some time or another. We often awake from our dreams with a sort of "Dream Hangover" in which thoughts or and feelings from a dream carry over into normal reality apon waking. Actually this feeling can be very intense depending on the amount of nuerotransmitters like melatonin still being recieved at sites in the brain. The more saturated the brain is in Seratonin melatonin and so on, the more Happy, giddy or tired and washed out we feel, until our brain bind and fires or discards the transmitters present.

This is NORMAL

what is NOT NORMAL? and how does that relate to DMT and its release during REM SLEEP?
Where the hell am I going with this?

Im merely stating that recently there has been not only an increase it seems in the amount of people believing that DMT is why we dream or is essential for DREAMS
this is not true. and I gather this assumption from deductive logic as follows.

if DMT were the catalyst or reason for Dreams, premature waking from dreams would leave people still stuck in Hyperspace do to the heavy presence of DMT at receptor sites.
This never happens though... what I mean is... no one EVER wakes up from a Dream in hyperspace or tripping from DMT. not even if the Dream was about a DMT trip. I know from Exp. after your first breakthrough Experience of DMT it is possible to have a dream where you smoke dmt and you will begin to trip in the dream just like DMT but if you wake during the trip you dont find yourself inside a trip, but rather just back to normal in your bed with that groggy melatonin feeling we all know.

If in fact DMT was responsible for the trip and its preseance created the Dream then premature wakes would leave humans stuck in DMT land and utterly confused.
that could not and will not happen the brain doesent work like that.

thinking of it like this might help shed some light.
the brain in many ways is a big computer. and I think of Drugs DMT in this case, to be nothing more then a computer code. when you put in the DMT CD you can run the program but in the biological sense the code is a chemical compound rather then a stream or bits.
but it works the same regardless

the code gets input, smoked absorbed by the lungs and carried in the blood past the blood brain barrier "kinda like norton antivirus but you dont need updates" and if the chemical is a useable instruction set it is loaded into the Ram and run released into the synapse and then fired or activated by binding to appropriate recptor sites.

one the code is learned I believe it is stored forever in some sense and even though we only are able to re-run the program without DMT in DREAM sleep (just a fact of our untapped potential here) doesnt mean that it is the dream or that we cannot dream without it

Dog dream do they contain DMT? (not sure about this one but I would love to know)

but anyway I ramble way 2 much.... all im really tryin to say is that DMT cannot be compared to a LONG DREAM and in no way can we really guage what it is doing and how it is effecting our body in large doses. SWIM knows from personal experience with ALOT of DMT that he has been altered in someway that he cant quite put a finger on, but he is sure that he is experiencing HPD but anyway...



FLAME ON

And plus it's a complete theory or maybe you should say speculation that DMT is released during dreams. Completely not proven.