hi everyone...

first - yes, i did search extensively and found very little if any definitive answer to this question. i did find one entry, but it wasn't too helpful.

simply put....

a friend recently returned from Mexico where he took part in ceremonies using collected and dried venom containing 5-meo-dmt, along with whatever else was in the material that occurs naturally.

he said that they were using between 50-100mgs depending on the experience desired and the amount of previous experience of the participant.

at first i was shocked; i had always heard 5-10mgs, but now realize this is a dose for purified extract containing only 5-meo.

has anyone had experience with the dried venom flakes, and what was the dose used/enjoyed/experienced?

and, obviously, would this form be suitable for a GVG? he had never heard of our favorite tool

really curious....

thanks

I think even if there is an exact response dont forget that due to it being an animal the "poison" or 5-MeO-DMT content will vary a lot because how stress and food affects poison strenght in animals.
Dont risk an OD on 5-MeO-DMT play it low first.

Dr Gerry used a dose of 100mg dried Bufo secretion for myself and others. The secretion is meant to be around 15% 5-MeO-DMT but it is likely to vary. Two separate sources...one a treatment provider in the US, another who uses secretions from his own captive toads in ceremonies, prefer a dose of 70mg (the latter claims the potency of his toads' venom is closer to the 20% mark, going on his own experiences with pure synthetic 5-MeO-DMT). Certainly my dosage of 100mg for my two experiences was very, very effective, and I don't think any higher a dosage would be necessary.

thank you both: this was extremely helpful.
cheers

I had release dose at 100mg.
So yes, you want to start maybe at 50mg.
Now I Wonder what your friend gives to his toads to make the venom stronger. I read they eat crickets, and in wild eat also venemous insects such as bees, wasps or scorpions. They do eat cockroach as well.
Am quite sure they'll produce stronger 5 Meo DMT Venom eating certain items like those venemous insects.
To me, the venom was way more meaningful than my other synthetic 5 MeO DMT experiences.

As for the GVG I had only experience with 5 MeO DMT and n,n DMT eLeaf, 5mg 5 meo and 20 mg n,n dose per 100mg leaf. Seemed to work but am not sure for the venom.
I did use little glass pipe, conduction heated ala glass bulb.
I would try again if I have Venom.

The bees and wasps of the Sonoran Desert conduct their activities during the day, while the toads are nocturnal, so their paths don't really cross.

Well, Just saying what I read. Now I think, do they never eat certain dead insects ? Or maybe they dont eat any of those insects at all. Maybe they eat those in captivity. I'll try do more research about their diet ( both on their native habitat and captive ).

^^^


They just sit in a good spot and wait for bugs to come along, so if it doesn't move, they don't eat it. Crickets are definitely part of their diet. I'm pretty skeptical about venomous bugs in their diet having anything to do with the toad's venom production and the 5-MeO content, though some people doing toad talks have offered such speculations.

Yeah I've heard similar speculations from others, apparently the toads ingest large amounts of darkling beetles in their wild Sonoran desert setting, and a potential link was hypothesised between ingestion of defensive compounds in the beetles and higher 5-MeO-DMT levels in the toads' defensive secretion. 5-MeO-DMT in the toads is very likely going to be derived enzymatically from the amino acid tryptophan, which is pretty abundant in a large number of both plant and animal derived food sources.

I would not use a GVG for the Venom as there is quite a bit of residue afterwards. Also to release the alkaloid from the venom, you need quite a bit more heat than you would use with a purified 5-MeO or n,n-DMT.

I have always seen "oil burner" pipes being used for the venom and they seem to work rather well.

As others have mentioned, the venom varies. I've read anywhere from 10%-25% by weight, with it usually being in the 15-20% area. 100mg was my first dose, and it was definitely enough. Although it is probably better to lean on the side of caution with this stuff, I'm glad I didn't start with a smaller dose as I might not been able to do it again, at least in the short to medium term.

And they Can eat mice.