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'Kombuchahuasca' - Fermented Acacia+Rue Options
 
LibertyforAll
#1 Posted : 3/13/2016 2:45:13 AM

Claro in Vitam


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I'll actually refer to this drink as kombucha haoma, as I refer to acacia/rue brews as the latter.
A batch of 13g rue and 24g acacia was prepared, and then sweetened with 1/3 cup of sugar. Liquid volume approx 1L.
This was then added to a green tea fermenting with a SCOBY, which has been recently grown, and had then reached a sufficient size to begin fermentation of a larger batch of liquid, and needed the sugar addition to grow as well.
This is a normal phase in a SCOBY's lifespan; the second batch of brew added to a recently bloomed colony. However, any size or age SCOBY will work just fine.
The jar containing this was covered with a paper coffee filter and rubber banded.
This was left in a cool, dark place relatively undisturbed, and may be drank (only taste sampled!) along the next week and several days while it ferments to note the interesting different phases. Notable is about 3-4 days in the brew seemed to taste more alcoholic than acetic, as it is at finish.

Over time the acidity will increase, which adds to an astringency from the drink, however it is not terrible. The fresh brews, especially a sediment-y drink, or one done with vinegar added, would have this astringent effect moreso than here, with the addition the acetic acid that's created seems to add - based on my drinking experiences. Carbonation will build after bottling.

Edit - After 11 days the brew was declared finished, separated from the SCOBY and bottled. The final brew is very sour tasting, potent yet much more mellow and easy to drink than a 'young' brew. It has taken on characteristics completely uniquely its own, and I have not drank anything quite like this before; it is tasty, yet still bitter however much less so than when fresh; the vinegar tastes as distinct and strongly as if I had brewed with it originally. For this reason I did not filter the brew at all during any stage, believing the 'extras' in the sediment would be fully removed over time. The seeds and bark-mud add a sort of garnish to the bottle as it is Smile

The potency is very evident and drinking even a sip can show one the effects contained within and give a full bodied flavor experience as well(lol)
Overall the taste is much better, and the sparkling texture from the carbonation makes it taste almost juice-like, as if from a strange exotic vegetable, today while drinking it actually I said it 'tasted like dinosaurs'(perhaps had been drinking it for a moment already Smile )

Potency remains about the same, however, the batch may gain some potency if the material is allowed to remain with the brew, the acidity created by the fermentation to acetic acid may bring more alkaloids into solution in the tea, this may be negligible or notable. Perhaps adding fresh acacia bark in strips to the bottle would add more character. It'd be a nice garnish touch overall.

This brew is definitely one worth trying. As simple to make as it gets, and SCOBYs are cool to work with as well and I am glad I have; I got one just for this experiment and it went remarkably well. No clue how this idea even formed!

It makes the drink into a much more palatable sort of beast, ending with quite a fine wine-like bottle to pop at any occasion one may see fitting for a toppest top shelf drink. Literally pop, it's carbonated. Twisted Evil Love Thumbs up Cool Laughing try it! will add photos soon
I believe in freedom for everyone.
'movies are for people who lack real drugs.' -anne halonium
 

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LibertyforAll
#2 Posted : 3/13/2016 2:47:38 AM

Claro in Vitam


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concern has been voiced for the possibility of tyramine being created in this tea in the fermentation process, potentially other harmful substances may be created as well; there is little, if any, information to be found on the subject.
Ayahuasca brews are reported to be fermented, though not with SCOBY cultures.
Edit - drinking this has proved itself to be safe, though certain individuals may react differently; as with anything, start carefully if you do try this.
I believe in freedom for everyone.
'movies are for people who lack real drugs.' -anne halonium
 
dreamer042
#3 Posted : 3/13/2016 3:12:26 AM

Dreamoar

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I believe both rue and acacia are anti-fungal/anti-bacterial. I suspect a scoby won't perform too well in such a solution. I think the fermentation typical in the Amazon is simply letting the tea sit open to the air to become slightly alcoholic via the fermentation of the natural sugars present, but I'm not 100% on that.
Row, row, row your boat, Gently down the stream. Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily...

Visual diagram for the administration of dimethyltryptamine

Visual diagram for the administration of ayahuasca
 
thymamai
#4 Posted : 3/13/2016 3:14:16 AM

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If there was a tried and true kombucha tech written up I would not hesitate. Look forward to your findings. Happy fermenting.
 
LibertyforAll
#5 Posted : 3/13/2016 3:28:16 AM

Claro in Vitam


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dreamer042 wrote:
I believe both rue and acacia are anti-fungal/anti-bacterial. I suspect a scoby won't perform too well in such a solution. I think the fermentation typical in the Amazon is simply letting the tea sit open to the air to become slightly alcoholic via the fermentation of the natural sugars present, but I'm not 100% on that.

Perhaps, and maybe the SCOBY dies at worst, or maybe the brew becomes naturally acidic as the acetic acid is made Smile
It doesn't look unhappy or unusual, seems natural and well suited to each other, but time will tell.

I've also unintentionally fermented ayahuasca in the manner of just letting it sit out, and it definitely changes a lot over weeks time, noticeably, it even appeared to develop a culture on top, and it develop a fermented smell that was very distinct and sort of nice, I didn't drink this though, I painted with it. Need to experiment more.
I believe in freedom for everyone.
'movies are for people who lack real drugs.' -anne halonium
 
LibertyforAll
#6 Posted : 3/14/2016 7:38:03 PM

Claro in Vitam


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I've just made a carbonated dmt brew
The taste is good, much better than I expected; the harshness of the 'young' brew is all gone, and the taste is palatable, definitely bubbly, the green tea starter is apparent, but the activity is also still there in taste, as my tongue detects the acacia and rue still.
There is a sourness, likely due to the vinegar being created by the colony.
I certainly will now store my brews underneath a SCOBY in such a way, it's very natural, and the colony looks pleased. I haven't photographed it but this is almost due to my nature ... perhaps I will but it is an ugly creature lol
I believe in freedom for everyone.
'movies are for people who lack real drugs.' -anne halonium
 
RhythmSpring
#7 Posted : 3/15/2016 2:30:20 PM

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In some native Amazonian tribes, they actually let the ayahuasca brew ferment on its own (without the addition of cultures), sometimes quite purposefully. They believe this to change the quality of the ayahuasca, to make it ¡más fuerte! I'm not sure of the validity of this claim, but that's what they do and believe.

In this case, there is no SCOBY, but there is definitely a carbonation/acidification that goes on. I've tasted it. Since I've tasted ayahuasca that has seemed quite sweet, I wouldn't be surprised if there were fermentable sugars present in the vine. Inadvertantly add some airborne bacteria, and you've got yourself an ayahuasca soda!
From the unspoken
Grows the once broken
 
LibertyforAll
#8 Posted : 3/16/2016 2:45:19 AM

Claro in Vitam


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Ayahuasca brew seems very prone to fermentation, in a more watery and not too concentrated form. I imagine the syrupy sort of thick brew would react differently to time.
I believe in freedom for everyone.
'movies are for people who lack real drugs.' -anne halonium
 
LibertyforAll
#9 Posted : 3/17/2016 7:35:28 AM

Claro in Vitam


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I have updated the original post after bottling the finished brew today
I believe in freedom for everyone.
'movies are for people who lack real drugs.' -anne halonium
 
RhythmSpring
#10 Posted : 3/17/2016 8:55:05 AM

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I'd imagine that the acidity and carbonation make it more rapidly absorbed by the mucus membranes, but overall potency would not be affected.

Although, I read somewhere that subjective perception of potency is a function of how rapidly a chemical is introduced into the bloodstream--rather than how much there is present at a given time. I'd be hard pressed to find a source for that, though. Rick Doblin maybe?
From the unspoken
Grows the once broken
 
LibertyforAll
#11 Posted : 3/17/2016 6:18:38 PM

Claro in Vitam


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A photo of the finished, bottled brew
LibertyforAll attached the following image(s):
IMAG0001.jpg (1,305kb) downloaded 248 time(s).
I believe in freedom for everyone.
'movies are for people who lack real drugs.' -anne halonium
 
LibertyforAll
#12 Posted : 3/17/2016 10:15:46 PM

Claro in Vitam


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I left a glass with a small amount of the liquid left in it overnight, in the morning there was a noticeable bloom of whatever is responsible for this blob. It sinks and rises back up when moved, looks like I've formed a 'haoma specific' fermentation culture. I will feed it fresh sweetened acacia+rue tomorrow and see if it flourishes and creates fermentation... Funny thing, when I let ayahuasca ferment itself, it formed a blob that looked just like this, but aya colored, green from the chacruna. Awesome stuff, dunno if this will grow and create a SCOBY or not but it looks that way.
I believe in freedom for everyone.
'movies are for people who lack real drugs.' -anne halonium
 
LibertyforAll
#13 Posted : 3/17/2016 10:17:38 PM

Claro in Vitam


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I left a glass with a small amount of the liquid left in it overnight, in the morning there was a noticeable bloom of whatever is responsible for this blob. It sinks and rises back up when moved, looks like I've formed a 'haoma specific' fermentation culture. I will feed it fresh sweetened acacia+rue tomorrow and see if it flourishes and creates fermentation... Funny thing, when I let ayahuasca ferment itself, it formed a blob that looked just like this, but aya colored, green from the chacruna. Awesome stuff, dunno if this will grow and create a SCOBY or not but it looks that way.
LibertyforAll attached the following image(s):
IMAG0002.jpg (990kb) downloaded 236 time(s).
I believe in freedom for everyone.
'movies are for people who lack real drugs.' -anne halonium
 
paperjack
#14 Posted : 3/18/2016 6:42:46 PM

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Could you try to do a mimosa kombucha?
 
dreamer042
#15 Posted : 3/19/2016 12:32:11 AM

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Looks to me like a healthy culture forming.

Well done. Thumbs up
Row, row, row your boat, Gently down the stream. Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily...

Visual diagram for the administration of dimethyltryptamine

Visual diagram for the administration of ayahuasca
 
LibertyforAll
#16 Posted : 3/19/2016 1:57:19 AM

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paperjack wrote:
Could you try to do a mimosa kombucha?

I've never worked with mimosa once yet! Only Acacia and Chacruna so far
I believe in freedom for everyone.
'movies are for people who lack real drugs.' -anne halonium
 
LibertyforAll
#17 Posted : 3/19/2016 2:37:42 AM

Claro in Vitam


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dreamer042 wrote:
Looks to me like a healthy culture forming.

Well done. Thumbs up


Very unfortunately, it is now gone. Didn't make it to the jar. I will be able to make one grow again, I believe, anyways,...
As I have started a 2 new jars of SCOBY-acacia+rue, as well as a jar of cacao brew under a SCOBY.
Pictures show very little. I've added a tear of SCOBY to the new haoma jars, and used a blob from a green tea kombucha in the cacao. As before, the haoma was sweetened with sugar (which I do recommend, or honey is better, I must say) and the cacao was let ferment as is, I believe it naturally has enough sugar to be effective to grow the culture.
I believe in freedom for everyone.
'movies are for people who lack real drugs.' -anne halonium
 
dreamer042
#18 Posted : 3/21/2016 6:07:13 AM

Dreamoar

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LibertyforAll wrote:
dreamer042 wrote:
Looks to me like a healthy culture forming.

Well done. Thumbs up


Very unfortunately, it is now gone. Didn't make it to the jar. I will be able to make one grow again, I believe, anyways,...
As I have started a 2 new jars of SCOBY-acacia+rue, as well as a jar of cacao brew under a SCOBY.
Pictures show very little. I've added a tear of SCOBY to the new haoma jars, and used a blob from a green tea kombucha in the cacao. As before, the haoma was sweetened with sugar (which I do recommend, or honey is better, I must say) and the cacao was let ferment as is, I believe it naturally has enough sugar to be effective to grow the culture.

For what it's worth, what I found in many years of brewing the buch (and the Jun, we'll talk about this moar in a moment) is that best results are obtained by doing a "pure" brew of tea+sugar bucha, then adding the flavors (fruit, juice, herbs, roots, etc) to the already brewed buch in the sealed bottle for the secondary fermentation.

Now about the honey. IME pure honey will kill or at least harm a standard kombucha culture. I have seen people taper a bucha SCOBY from sugar to honey by mixing them and slowly lowering the sugar content, but they never looked as healthy as straight sugar fed culture. There is another type of SCOBY originating from Tibet (bucha is Chinese) that lives off of green tea and honey (vs black tea and sugar that is the buch's preferred food). That culture is called Jun, and is still fairly shrouded in mystery. It's only made it's way to public trade/sale in the last 5-10 years and creates a much lighter and moar gentle (and slightly moar alcoholic) brew than the standard buch. Jun is significantly moar cold hardy and takes slightly longer to brew than traditional bucha. It's traditionally stated that Jun has moar "Jing" than bucha.

One fun (but unverified) fact I've picked up over the years. Jun is a catch all term for any type of SCOBY ferment in many parts of Asia, and there are dozens, if not hundreds (thousands) of different Juns (kombucha's are included as varieties of Juns). This would be similar to the way we use beer in western culture (root beer, ginger beer, apple beer, etc...).

Just a bit of random info picked up along the way from an old buchhead. Big grin
Row, row, row your boat, Gently down the stream. Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily...

Visual diagram for the administration of dimethyltryptamine

Visual diagram for the administration of ayahuasca
 
LibertyforAll
#19 Posted : 3/21/2016 3:19:09 PM

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Thanks dreems its a new topic to me.
Noted about honey, I actually meant using it in a 'fresh' brew not for fermentation, but that wasn't clear
I believe in freedom for everyone.
'movies are for people who lack real drugs.' -anne halonium
 
skoobysnax
#20 Posted : 4/28/2016 5:43:53 AM

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I just poured off 3 gallons of buch tonight. I am very interested in how a bioassay works out. i have way more scobies than I need for standard brew.
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