So, I was sitting around the other night and decided to nibble on an A. Colubrina seed just to see what it tasted like. The taste was shockingly familiar, but that's another topic all together. About 40 to 60 minutes after ingesting a half a seed I noticed some very mild CEV's. Like white capillaries "wiggling" out from an imperfect circular center. It kind of looked like a bloodshot sclera (white part of the eye) with a photo-negative effect on it, and in motion.

I didn't feel much physically or mentally, but this mild CEV seemed to last for a couple of hours. Is it at all possible for A. Colubrina to have any effects at this small of a dose? Maybe it was just placebo, or something else entirely...?

Peace
-idt

Some seeds are potent enough to give minor effects orally at the dosage you mentioned.

There's a native tradition of using 3 seeds orally in wine for psychoactive purposes. The wine acts as a vasodilator and counteracts the vasoconstriction of the seeds. Its said to be a very pleasant combination. SWIM never tried alcohol with the seeds though, so he can't comment on that personally.

Wow! That's great to know! So maybe it wasn't just placebo after all. I really felt it was real, but didn't realize the seeds could be that strong. These seeds seem very fresh and taste quite strong, the taste is quite reminiscent of high grade cocaine. Has anyone else noticed this? FYI - I don't do cocaine any more (thank god), but will never forget that taste.

I'm going to try the wine and seeds combo then. I assume just a glass of wine would be the standard amount to ingest with 3 seeds?

Peace
-idt

I believe that's right from what I recall. SWIM has never tried it with wine personally though.

let us know how it goes,I would imagine nausea would be intense like this unless you take 3 seeds of datura stramonium along with this combo.

I thought about 3 d. stramonium seeds along with it as well. I certainly didn't feel any discomfort from a 1/2 seed, so I don't know how much worse it might get at a higher dose. Not sure if I'll do the datura with it or not, but regardless I'll give a full report if I get any sort of active effects. I'm excited. I might postpone some things and try it today!

Peace
-idt

OK, so I couldn't wait to try the A. Colubrina again, so tonight I decided to eat just one whole seed, with some beer (I didn't have wine at home). It's been about 40 minutes now. At about 20 min I felt a distinct release of serotonin surge through my body, tickling my jaw muscles and racing through the "nerves" in my head. At this point I'm feeling a significant buzz and pressure throughout my entire body. My head feels like a balloon filled with helium. I'm tingling all over and feel absolutely in a state of peaceful bliss. No OEV's, however the TV, and colors on this computer screen, are RICH and DEEP, and quite beautiful. The CEV's are similar to before, but much more chaotic and appear with depth (before it was just 2 dimensional).

This is great! Energizing yet calm and euphoric. Thanks 69ron for the feedback on this. The 3 seed experience is soon to come, but I'm feeling GREAT right now!!

I will report back if it gets more intense.

EDIT: Method of ingestion. I pealed the casing off the seed and chewed the medium-soft white seed completely with my front teeth. I kind of like the taste. Nutty but bitter and earthy at the same time. Again very reminiscent of that evil white bitch Once fully chewed to mush I chased it down with a beer.

Peace peace peace and love!!
-idt

SWIM loves those seeds!!!!

At some point he'll have to try it orally with alcohol. That's a classic combination. There must be a good reason for it.

I would highly recommend the combo! I think I was back down to baseline after about two hours or less. The body high definitely faded first, but the enhanced perception of digital media continued the longest. Stretched out to a good 2hrs maybe...

Although this experience was mild in psychedelic terms, I would say it was a surprising step up from the half seed dose. I can easily see how a larger dose could take you on a really cool trip all together. I will take my next dose of two seeds, and a glass of good red wine. I think this will kick in at least minor OEV's, stronger CEV's, and at a minimum, a supercharged feeling of what I experienced tonight! It was like a crazy blend of light mushrooms, light extacy, and very light mental DMT like challenges popping in and out.

SWIM got these seeds to make an extraction, but gave a few to me for my own experimentation. I'm sure SWIM will do a botanical extraction for study on most of these, but finding out this pleasant surprise of how they work raw, orally is certainly nice to know!

So, do you think this effect is purely from the bufo, or are there other alkaloids that are adding to this effect? Any thoughts on this?

No nausea or dysphoria at all, just happy floaty semi-psychedelic joy. No weird comedown either. Just smooth back to baseline.

I'm gonna keep testing these for a bit I must say!

Sorry for the typos - I'm falling asleep now...

Peace and love
-idt

Very interested. I'm having a party and my friends are all experimental. I'll make a bottle of special wine and see how it goes! Hopefully my Stramonium Seeds will come in the mail today! :@

Yeah, it’s the bufotenine. There are other alkaloids present in the seeds that are active orally, but they are only present in traces. A low oral dose of bufotenine is very pleasant, maybe even more so with alcohol. Higher doses cause nausea. But if mixed with alcohol, I’m not sure. SWIM has used bufotenine orally many times. At 50 mg it’s very pleasant. At 100 mg it starts causing nausea in some people. It’s not like ayahuasca nausea either; it lasts through the whole trip. Datura stramonium seeds can very effectively block the nausea if enough is taken. Usually 2-5 seeds will work for that purpose. But maybe if combined with alcohol there’s no nausea? I’m not sure.

There must be a good reason the natives take it orally with alcohol and not with caapi. From what I’ve head, it can be very unpleasant orally with caapi, causing lots of nausea. SWIM has not tried bufotenine orally with caapi, rue, or any of the isolated harmala alkaloids. He’s tried it alone and with up to 3 Datura stramonium seeds. It’s better with the Datura stramonium seeds than alone. The Datura stramonium seeds don’t alter the effects much really. They add a little more euphoria, make it slightly more visual, and block the nausea mostly.

SWIM experienced very mild nausea when he took 115mg bufotenine and 3 datura s. seeds...it was just on the edge of nausea...SWIM will have to try this out osmetime

If you had taken 115 mg of bufotenine without the seeds, you would probably have had quite a bit of nausea and gas. I'm sure the 3 seeds helped a lot. You might try taking maybe 1 or 2 more Datura stramonium seeds. They will get rid of the nausea altogether if enough is taken.

Nice badge Jorkest!

If I continue to get these kind of effects, I may tell SWIM to just not bother with an extraction. Also, when I bump the dose up to 3 or more seeds I think I will definitely take 3 d. stramonium seeds before hand as a precaution.

Let us know when you guys try this. I'd really like to hear your feedback on how it compares to a pure bufo extraction.

Peace
-idt

Hmm... got to try this. I can't do any extractions for a while but I'm sooo curious about bufotenine right now. Have tried extracting 3 times and only got something smokable the 3rd time, but that was nowhere near potent enough and just delivered some mild CEV's.

Nice to her about this.

Can anyone say in detail how the oral route differs from vapourising?

For SWIM, if the bufotenine is pure white powdered freebase (not the amber or brown stuff most people get from most extractions) then vaporizing gives a very clean experience. There's no nausea, but sometimes there's a little bit of tension for the first few minutes before it peaks.

Here's a rundown of the differences SWIM has noticed (V = vaporized, O = oral):

V Onset: 2-5 minutes
O Onset: 15-30 minutes
V Peak: 10-15 minutes
O Peak: 45-90 minutes
V Duration: 2-3 hours
O Duration: 2-3 hours
V Mild visuals: 2-5 mg
O Mild visuals: 75-100 mg
V Strong visuals: 10-30 mg
O Strong visuals: unknown (SWIM only took up to 100 mg orally)
V Nausea: not present, or only present for a few minutes
O Nausea: 100 mg and up, nausea is present for the whole trip
V Euphoria: 2 mg and up
O Euphoria: 50 mg and up
V Tingling: 5 mg and up, quite intense for the first 2 minutes, almost a prickling sensation, and then it becomes pleasant after about 5-10 minutes
O Tingling: 50 mg and up, mild, more pleasant

There are more bodily effects when it's taken orally. The nausea is more pronounced, but can be alleviated with a few Datura stramonium seeds (2-6 seeds usually is enough).

For SWIM, with the smoked route, the visuals are much more intense, but it's really hard to gauge because SWIM has not taken an oral dose that approximates a 10 mg dose of vaporized DMT. The potency of vaporized bufotenine is about 25 times that of oral bufotenine. So a 10 mg vaporized dose would be equivalent to a maybe a 250 mg oral dose. The most SWIM has taken orally was 100 mg if I recall correctly. He's taken it with and without Datura stramonium seeds. Without the seeds he gets nausea and gas after about 30 minutes and it lasts until the trip ends. It's mild nausea though. With the 3 Datura stramonium seeds the visuals are slightly stronger and the euphoria is stronger, and the nausea is gone.

The characteristics of the visuals are different when taken orally. It's more psilocybin like, not as electric and sharp as vaporized bufotenine. SWIM has only had visions of people, places, etc., from 10 mg and up of vaporized bufotenine. With the oral route, he's only had mild visual effects, no actual visions of things. But again, he's never taken a very large dose of bufotenine orally.

I have a feeling that oral bufotenine is going to get very uncomfortable as the dose is raised. The side effects are much stronger when it's taken orally. The main side effect would be nausea and at a dose like 250 mg, I imagine you would be quite sick with nausea for a few hours. But maybe with something like a few Datura stramonium seeds, it might be possible to take 250 mg orally without much side effects.

Oral bufotenine is something very few people have experimented with. On this forum, Jorkest reported the highest dose used so far which was 115 mg orally.

Sublingually, 115 mg would be quite a bit. It should be enough for very good visual effects. If snorted that would be a very intense trip.

Jorkest, what's the most you tried sublingually?

well thats what SWIM did 115mg sublingually and then swallowed the mess after 10 minutes..with nausea creeping in..around 30 minutes

Oh...ok...I didn't realize that. I thought it was just oral. That helps explain the nausea then. It's much stronger when taken sublingually.

When SWIM says oral, he means in a capsule so that none can be absorbed sublingually.

yeah that makes sense...there was no purge..just the slight feeling like if he wanted to he could easily puke

What were the visuals like for SWIY at that dose sublingually? Was it held long under the tongue?