Here is a decent small example of a salvia divinorum vision!

Maybe a hint..but it doesn't come close to capturing a salvia breakthough...

No offense, intended, I just think some things have more value being experienced than discussed.

This has the same problem as all the 'psychedelic vision drawings,' in that the visions are probably the least important part of the psychedelic experience. The magic is in how your thoughts change and the way your interpret the vision. The actual image is just the very very beginning.

Agreed, with this particular art, I find it difficult to interpret any relation with the effects of salvia. I tend to think of salvia art more in relation to SalviaDroid.

In a sense, yes, the drawings are depicted or reflected in their personal experience. The direct experience is always fascinating and holds incredible information within you. Visionary artists tend to have unusual capacity to illuminate their art exactly how they perceive/see it to be. Not always knowing what it may or may not appear as.

How can you explain your experience in relation to above art, starway6?

I find the visions very important.. because without them what would there be to interpret?
Shamans often talk of their visions because thats what guides them ..in many ways..

It's really hard for me to say what I want to right now in words but I'll try. These are only my opinions and should be taken with a grain of salt:

That image does display some of the Salvia properties and characteristics. I would say that repetition is common in the visual aspect, but beyond that its more so something that is occuring in that very moment on a physical level. It could be you sensing more or tapping directly into the mainframe of the cybernetic core of existenial being.

I think I'm starting to pick up on some of the reocurring patterns that are echoed through out not only the psychedelic experience, but also in our everday lives. When you begin to study and learn how these patterns function it becomes clear that this so called "reality" and the higher states of multi dimensional conscious are intertwined and follow a sacred set of patterns and physics.

Everything is energy. Different vibrations form unique energy patterns in the form of what we call geometric shapes. A lot of the visuals I have seen have been comprised using the properties of these as the building blocks. But what's more important is the manner in which they can be pieced together in repetition and form an entirely new image. Take for instance the kaleidoscope. It has symmetrical sides of 4, 6, or 8 etc. They mirror each other on each side and in doing so are able to fit together to make a whole new image. Same goes with what people refer to as sacred geometry:

Here is an example of a single circle repeated many times to form a flower or sun. I believe this to be the building block of how a kaleidoscope with many many mirrored sides would look. Where the circles overlap each other is where the mirroring occurs.
http://th06.deviantart.n..._mariapopy94-d3rqfkg.jpg

A lot of the motifs or reoccuring themes played out in Salvia Land such as: the fibonacci spiral, spiraling staircase, unfolding, stacking, conveyor belt, accordion motion etc might all be built upon unique geometry or patterns of physics.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that there might be an exact formula to breaking or yet better understanding the Salvinorin, as well as the other psychedelic experiences in a mathematical equation that some day can be fully rendered or generated by a computer. Mandelbulb and other softwares are a great start. We already know from experience that this code has been planted in our minds, now if we could just bring back not only a piece but a whole new image to show others as proof of what exists.

And by this picture I mean to say, "Try coming up with an exact formula for this!

I think the Salvia intelligence is way too complex and mysterious to warrant any kind of "formula," be it blackboards long.

Perhaps everything isn't as complex as we make it. What if we don't fall into ahwe or distraction from the Salvia experience as a whole, but rather simply focus on the reoccuring patterns that it's built upon.

That image for example. You look at it and say "Wow, thats a very complex system of spiraling teeth." But then you look closer at the pattern and realize. That's it's one single animated tooth copy pasted and repeated over. *Each descending tooth starts with a slight delayed time interval of somewhere between 0.5-0.1 seconds. It follows the idea I had of many replicated shapes or objects repeating together to make a whole new image.

Props to the artist who made that. It looks so trippy.

I find salvia extract [atleast 7x or higher] imagry to be very dream like..like the imagry that surrounds your dream body durring a lucid dream or [out of body] experiance..

In fact i have only used my 7x once in last 8 months because of the respect i have for its awesome mind bending powers..

Salvia even has the ability to transport the user to diferent dementions or times past or future...

I find salvia visions more grounded to mother earth and the ancients that lived long before us..

DMT experiances seem more alien or

After a salvia journey i often ask myself why do i need anything else..?

why do i keep trying with DMT ..when salvias more gentle
[but still strong] effect gives me in [instant Open eye imagry!]within seconds.. after one or two tokes overlaing what my open eyes see..and even more with them shut!

DMT often feels like its pushing my blood pressure much higher than salvia feels on the come up..

Visuals on dmt are not guarenteed every time.. when salvia comes through every time!...

DMT on higher doses seems to angrly grab one by the throat on the come up before it subsides to a slower pace..

On higher doses..Its like DMT is saying..[ok you little insect so you want to see the other side!..ive got you now!]

When salvias come up is more gentle [but still strong] it seems to be saying just relax you will be fine?

One thing i like about DMT is how it doesnt cloud my memory as much as salvia can..

I like them booth.. but i think DMT pushes the body harder than salvia that seems to be more mind effect oriented?

Salvia doesnt deserve tne negative hype its been getting over the past few years..with right attitude it can be a nice experiance..

On the subject of salvia images. I see salvia often repeats an image dozens or hundreds of times in minds eye or slices or splits one mental being before it regroups..
There is also a lucid dream like clarity to salvia imagry that produces often ultra clear images of things where the subject can experiance simple common things seen in life with an apreciation only experianced by the mind of a young child...
I could go on but out of time..

starway6, I feel almost entirely opposite about each point you've made about salvia compared with DMT, but that's just me.

This is exactly how I feel... I was going to ask if anyone else felt their blood pressure sky rocket so intensely when smoking DMT. It almost feels like my heart's gonna give out for a second... I think all of these compounds are sacred in their own respect. They just offer us different slices of the higher conscious spectrum.

So SalviaDroid has finally done DMT! yay! hahah

Maybe that's partly why your recent work is so incredible o.o

Generally speaking, after some time working with changa a lot (especially meditating/yoga on low doses and working your way up) the heart rate can become more calm when going 'there'. Especially if I go a few times in one session. Really deep slow breathing for a period of time just before smoking a breakthrough dose helps a lot, as do harmalas i find.

Thats ok ...I guess it just the way it affects me...
Not everyone is the same...