There is also this atomizer I recently became aware of, also for honey/hash oil. I have one but have not been able to get it to work properly with either of my two batteries. I like the design though, and it apperas capable of holding quite a bit of material. They recommend either a 900 mah battery or one that is capable of 5.5V. Mine heats up but not hot enough to vape the honey oil. I guess I need to buy another e-gig battery that will work with this atomizer. Since whatever you put in this one is only touching metal and not a heating coil directly it might work better and not clog the atomizer as easily. Just another option out there. I have no connection to any of these retailers. http://www.wackywillyswe...roddetail.php?prod=WPA-1

Instead of using E-cigs, has anyone here tried using a dry herb vaporizer pen with a strong changa mix? I assume it would give the same effects as desired from the e-cig, unless you are trying to be super discreet and smoke it in a public place (who wants that with DMT though?).

Any thoughts?

Yes, but it didn't work too well. I used the Atmos Raw and was never able to get a proper hit... let alone anything near a breakthrough hit.

I feel the only way to get a proper DMT dose is using a quality e-cig and a concentrated PG solution with a modified atomizer. I recently picked up a nebulizer but haven't tried it with DMT... yet... just a honey oil MJ solution and it worked great.

I have always heard nothing but bad reviews about Atmos Raw to begin with. I am thinking of one that could easily have the temp adjusted.

I was doing some research on pen vapes over at FC and came across this
http://fuckcombustion.com/threads/the-zenpen.9952/

I dont believe it has come out yet, but once it does this seems very possible to use with changa, doesnt it? It seems like these guys know what they are doing when it comes to eliminating the issue of combustion and too high of a heat. There is a dial to adjust how hot it gets.

Plus, it looks exactly like a pen!

I can't say enough bad things about it. It was well constructed, which is why I spent nearly $200 on it, but didn't work for MJ either. If anyone is considering this device, think twice.

It would be great to find something similar that works for changa... so my ears are open to suggestions!

Check out the link in my other post A1pha. I believe this may be the one for changa.

It has a max temp of 410F, which I believe would burn the spice. But there is a dial to raise and lower the temp, so depending on how low the temp actually goes, this could be THE ONE. Their claims about materials used all seem very good as well, they put a lot of thought into making this.

They also claim that the pen checks the internal chambers temp 100's of times a second, adjusting itself as needed. If this claim is true as well, then this will truly be an amazing product in the world of small, portable vaporizers.

I think someone should give this a try when it comes out. Im sure the first generation ones will not be as good as later made ones, but its still worth a shot. If you donate $99 to their kickstarter program, you get one of the first generations when they are produced.

Someone should test it out.

I have pretty much everything I need in front of me to try this out now.

Main difference is I have approx 5ml of 70/30 pg/vg blueberry blend that is 8mg nicotine (not ideal but I found it and figured is better than waiting a week or two for pure PG if I can at least try something now)

My main issue is if I want to use 0.4ml of total combined liquid (juice+dmt) how much spice should I try to dissolve into how much juice (tank is a CE4 @ 2.4 Ohms and holds 1.6ml of juice total but I don't want to use a lot of spice on this attempt).

I still cannot find anything reliable on an average amount of e-juice vaped in a single decent hit. I reckon 0.4ml would be enough for at least 15-20 pulls as is

Gonna ponder on it a while and hope maybe someone has some ideas

Edit: While hunting for the USB charger I found a spare Tidy 10 clearomizer kicking around. I reckon being a coil based adapter it might serve better than a wick system like the CE adapters have.

Nice one Zenspice.
You journey well my brother and we shall eagerly await news of your experimental success.
Initially i thought that having nicotine in the liquid might actually be beneficial. This is because tobacco smoke contains a MAOI, and I often put a small amount of tobacco in changa joints for this reason....however, i doubt that e-liquid mixtures will have this MAOI present as i think they just add pure pharmaceutical nicotine to the liquid....but as you say, my first experiment will use flavoured e-juice with nicotine, simply as i plan to use what resources I have to hand for the time being.

In terms of how much spice to dissolve into a solution.....i guess you want to dissolve as much as is possible....i.e until the solution is saturated. Its been a while since my chemistry lessons, but im sure there must be a way of calculating how much of a solid you can dissolve in a given volume of liquid no?

If anyone knows of such a calculation, it would be lovely to hear from you.
In the meantime, I shall see if google can offer any insight.

Not great news at the moment..

250mg dissolved into 0.5ml via a heat bath method. Interesting thing is the light yellow e-juice turned pink when the spice was added. When combined and added to the cartomizer the volume was near 1ml.

Gave it a few tokes to get it all moving then left it a while to sit.. Then took 6 big rips and felt the usual lowdose effects (slight grip, no visuals and feeling a bit more contemplative).

Am thinking that the mix needs to be a lot more concentrated and the type of e-juice I used today is not the best (as per my initial thought to get pure PG without flavoring or nicotine)

I wish my logic had overcome my eagerness to expend 250mg of spice on this particular day in all honesty.

HEY, im sorry for your loss....but dont beat yourself up about it. Know that it is appreciated and that any failures are simply steps closer to success. However, i think your right in thinking that a pure PG solution would more likely produce results on account of less molecules of other "stuff" potentially interfering with the process on a molecular level.

I had a look at trying to work out solubility of a substance to calculate how much is require to saturate a given solution, but the chemistry terms and equations soon got the better of me. But one source said the best thing to do is to keep adding the substance gradually, until no more substance dissolves in the solution. Again, this is obviously something to try when ones spice levels are not an issue, but this is he way to get as much spice into solution as possible.

One idea i had, and will try when the day of experimentation arrives, is to heat up the charged cartomiser in a water bath of some sort, so that the e-liquid is at a slightly higher temperature. This way, not as much is heat will be required from the coil to deliver the energy required to vape the spice......in theory vaping more of it.

Just a thought.

Anyway, thanks again for your report man. All info is useful

Much appreciated

As-is (to avoid wasting 250mg spice) I might keep to hand as a "top-up" device for when using a Rue or Caapi precursor and an initial machine vape.

Definitely use pure PG, well thought. And you don't even have to heat it at all, just drop it in and watch it dissolve in a matter of minutes.

The biggest downside of experimenting with this method, is that there is no useful way to retrieve it after it's been dissolved.

My Vamo V2 showed up yesterday, yay! So far it works great for e-liquid, no surprise there really.

I haven't really given it a fair try with spice yet, however this morning I dissolved 20mg of spice into 4 drops (~0.2ml) of PEG-400 easily. I think I could get quite a bit more to dissolve but I had limited time to mess with it and that seemed like a good starting point. As you can imagine, with such a small amount of liquid to work with, I couldn't recover all of it with a dropper in the little vial that I mixed it in because some stuck to the sides or in the dropper that I was using. Only about three drops worth made it onto the coil. so that was probably somewhere between 10mg or 15mg worth of spice.

Anyway, I went ahead and gave it a shot. I really wasn't prepared for a serious journey this morning so I was cautious in-case it was very successful (it wasn't). The first puff was with the wattage set to about 5.5w. It produced quite a bit of vapor and there was no unpleasant taste. I felt it minimally which surprised me for the amount of vapor that I exhaled, but I was comparing that to what I'm used to using the machine and I suppose we can expect it to look like a lot of vapor due to the additional e-liquid. I waited a bit and the effects didn't progress any further than just barely noticeable. I took another, maybe a little longer drag, this time it ended with a warm, tingly feel, but not an awful burnt taste either. Still minimal effects. I reduced the wattage down to about 3.5w and took a couple more puffs, that warm, tingly flavor was milder yet it still produced a decent amount of vapor. All of this was spaced out over maybe 5 minutes and about 5 puffs total. So I really never got much of an effect beyond what ZenSpice described. But eh, 10mg, maybe 15mg spaced out that much, I wasn't too surprised or disappointed.

I'll try again soon and attempt to step up the concentration. This time I'll mix up a double dose so I can at least get one full dose out of it, and I'll be less conservative with my puffs.

Also, after the wax & thick oil atomizers were mentioned, I did some searching and found this (v-hit F5) and this (Vaped skillet) which *look* like they'd be good for this, but I haven't been able to find much in the way of reviews on either of them.

Might be worth experimenting in the same manner but with harmalas in your system. That would be interesting, and could even lead to a more visual level.

Kudos all round for the efforts

Orr you could just wait till you have more spice available and top up until the liquid is saturated!?!

Anyway, its great to have a bunch of determined people share the same vision, so keep up the good work guys.....i think its gonna be worth it

I actually got a chance to talk to someone who is working on the ZenPen, and they said the temp range at the moment is 300-410F. Would 300F burn the spice? They asked what ideal low temp would be needed for my needs, (I did not go into detail with them, just said that some people would buy it if it went lower temps, due to wanting to vape different herbs with different actives) and said that if I could provide them with the temp range needed, they would have no problem implementing that range into the pen.

I know this is not technically an E-Cig, but are we not just looking for portable vapes that work? If they do make it with the lower temp (which sounds like they are greatly considering it), then this could be what we are looking for...

Any thoughts?

My first try with the eGo-C e-cig was soo fun. I mixed about 150mg re-x spice
in ca. 0.7ml liquid (black currant). We were 3 people, one who never did dmt,(but mushrooms and
MDMA), me and another quite experienced traveler. The one who never smoalkd dmt has always difficulties
with smoking, inhaling and smell per se and for her the vapour of the e-cig is smooth with minor dmt taste and easy to hold.

For a breakthrough experience the dmt in the liquid must be way more concentrated.
But! It was such a funny psychedelic party! It was hilarious, 3 above their 40thies, whinning like mad donkeys,
on the floor like teenagers.
If it's possible to double or triple the conc./vol. this woul be a new and simple administration for traveling.
Just push the button....

Was the liquid plain PG with blackcurrant flavour?