The needlessly feared and misunderstood purge

The almighty and dreaded purge. we all here about it often with new comer's and those interested in exploring the amazing world of mother ayahuasca. Although my own personal thoughts on the purge were'nt negative they did give me concern in the days before I took the aya plunge. Lets put some positive light on this part of the aya experience as it deserves.

Before I came to Peru I wrote a step by step thread on tannin binding and methods to reduce or eliminate the purge. I now see that i didnt understand the purge and why its as important as the visions one see's while under the influence of ayahuasca. My first caapi only experience I welcomed the purge. In fact I actually ensured it by drinking one hundred grams of caapi sediment and all and might I add there was plenty of sludge. I purged for hours out of both ends and had a very powerful and psychedelic caapi only experience.(Pet peve side note- I often read in books and hear that caapi by its self will produce no visuals or little effects and i could not disagree more but thats another subject for another thread perhaps).

One thing that suprised me at my first ceremony here was the frequency that most of the three shamans here purge each night we drink. For some reason i just figured anyone with that much experience drinking ayahuasca surely doesnt purge but i was wrong. Its not that the shamans have to purge, they surely don't, its that the welcome and recognize the purge for what it is. A purification of body, mind, and spirit. Ayahuasca is most certainly medicinal first, visionary second. She pulls toxins from our bodys and some would say our spirits as well. If these toxins are not expelled from the body most noteably the stomach they are simply absorbed back into it. What a waste this would be, no?

My first ceremony here was a doozy. I drank 5 times that night and my belly was full of the medicine. After i went to my hut to try and come down to sleep i could feel the ayahuasca penetrating all my organs and even felt like it was entering my cells removing 5 months of greasy fried foods, too much booze, and some illict drugs along the way on my travels from Mexico to South America. In short i had a lot of crap to get out of me and i could feel it working. My whole body ached, ever muscle was in great pain as the ayahuasca pulled all the bad stuff out. i didnt purge much in ceremony so after a couple hours of feeling like shit i went outside with a large bottle of water and chugged. It didnt take long till i was puking my guts out! It felt great, liberating if you will and above all it felt healthy.

I woke the next day feeling free. I felt better than good i felt amazing. From the second ceremony till now i have also been purging great amounts of diahrea. Not to sound gross but it feels even better than vomitting the toxins for me. I feel totally cleansed the next day.
I also want to add that the purge is controlable. By that i mean i've learned with time and experience you have some say as to when you purge. If you drink ayahuasca with a somewhat empty stomach, particularly of fluids i have never purged during the ceremony other than the night i drank 5 cups, lol. on the fith cup as i was stumbling back to my mat i projectile vomitted right in the center of the moloko. How's that for making a good first impression? Since then I dont purge until im back at my room post ceremony. All i need to do is drink about a bottles worth of water and within 5 to 10 min im off to the races.

So in conclusion you may not always be in the mood or in the right setting to purge and thats fine. Thats why pharmauasca is so great or tannin binding your brew, but i feel its good to allow the purge and welcome it whenever possible for health reasons. Remember ayahuasca is medicine. Medicine for the body as well as the mind. The purge is there for a reason. Dont fear it, cheerish it!

Great post Olympus Mon! I too often try and explain to people how it is a cleansing thing and not too be feared or worse- held in and resisted.

Especially when deep into some nausea and you feel the stirring of a coming purge i simply have to get it out or else i'll continue to feel utterly horrible for a long time.. If you instead just let your body do its thing and purge then instantly that nausea can disappear a lot of the time, and if not then there is just more that needs to come out..for me at least. Its really interesting how on the way into the bathroom i've been almost unable to walk at all, but a few minutes later after the purge, i feel a million times better and can walk fine. Also i agree that ayahuasca vine alone is very very psychedelic at higher doses. MOAR VINE! <3

It sounds nasty but i should add that when i first started microdosing 5-10g of caapi vine a day i would smoke low to medium doses of changa shortly after drinking and always have to run into the bathroom to purge out the other end for the first 5 days or so of doing it.. It felt incredibly cleansing and still happens occasionally with changa. Welcome it :]

I agree that the purge is very cleansing and an important part of the experience. I've read that some people actually call caapi vine 'La Purga'

This is part of the reason why after a few pharma experiences I lost interest real quick in that ROA..I prefer a brew to an extraction. For some reason pharma will make me nauseated but does not really bring up a purge.

For the last 5 or 6 months I have been purging almost every single time I drink. I actaully want to purge when I drink. It does feel better than it would seem..alot of people ask about ayahuasca here and say they dont want to purge or hate puking etc..but it really is great. Especially if you purge from both ends alot..the way you feel after those ceremonies is just priceless.

In a maps conferance not long ago there was alot of ayahuasca talks and in one of them this guy stood up to talk in the Q and A part and said he is a doctor. He drinks ayahuasca at home I guess and did some experiments testing his blood ph after sessions where he had some heavy purging and he said that he could not believe it but his ph was sooo alkaline for a short period after and then would normalize..like around ph 10! He said he could barely believe it but thought it was due to alot of really acidic crap being pushed out of the body during the heavy periods of purging and that this might account for some of the deep healing that people experience after these sort of session.

thats pretty interesting about the PH levels. gotta love pioneers like this!

In my very limited experience purging does indeed feel very cleansing.

Could there be any possible negative effects caused by purging to the purger (the one who purges). For example effects on the esophagus or stomach?

(I told a friend about recent experiences that involved alot of purging and he said vomitting can reduce the stomach lining (he is very intelligent but i have my doubts about this one)..anyone have any info on this?)

I can honestly say, vomiting right into the face of a demon is probably one of the greatest and most psychologically cleansing things I've ever done.

I've never noticed a feeling a being physically cleansed, but when I'm at that stage where purging feels inevitable, I concerntrate on my fears and negativity. I then focus all the energy built up from those thoughts and emotions and concerntrate them down to my stomach.

Symbolism is a beautiful thing


I have a friend who's a bit of a purgaphobe and frankly, I find it to be an extremely annoying trait.

Greasy foods are bad for you because they satisfy your calorie necessities by only supplying you with saturated fats. Ayahuasca purging can't take away your body's lack of good oils.

Alcohol and "quick high" drugs just damage your brain in different areas, depending on what drugs you take. You could say that Ayahuasca recovers some of those cell groups; I agree with you here that purging can help, if only because it is a "warrior-like" activity. Drinking and doing blow (or ketamine, for that matter) are generally the opposite of "warrior-like," because you are helping no one by doing them.

By doing Aya you help out your family and countless others because you subject yourself to pain and the will of our Lord, Flying Spaghetti Monster. FSM knows you should continue to try to go against the grain. Except on one point, I might add: whole grains. Do it for the kids.

I haven't tried aya yet, but I am actually looking forward to a good purge. I must ask though, how often does a rear-end purge happen? Is that generally included when the term "purge" is used. If it happens, it happens but It might be helpful to know what to fully expect when the reckoning comes.

it depends. but its definitely not as common as puking, although they can go hand in hand. i wouldn't worry about it, you feel amazing afterwards

and IME its easier to 'control' than puking..by that i mean i've never heard of anyone soiling they're trousers before they made it to the bathroom

I only experienced people getting the rear purge when using acacia c. That plant gave me the most powerful projectile vomit with the least warning. Very unfortunate. My two friends however...

Shame there was only one bathroom.

Ayahuasca always gives me fair warning.

What universe said is spot on, you'll make it to the bathroom before you soil yourself.
I think the deification purge tends to happen to the user who has a LOT of toxins. For me I know I had a ton of crap in me, (no pun intended) to get out both physically and emotionally so i wasn't surprised when this began to become the norm after my 3rd ceremony. But as aya heals me its becoming less and less. As the toxins get pulled out it will eventually stop. For me years and years of opiate addiction from my past made for a tremendous amount of toxins to be flushed out. Opiate toxins tend to linger in your body for a very long time as ive been told by the shaman's here. He has worked with many opiate addicts and he told me its one of the hardest thing to get out of the body and spirit. So like i said i wasn't surprised.

It really does feel amazing though not to sound gross. It cleanses you more than the oral purge imo. I've noticed here that the people with the most toxins tend to be the ones that get the runs.

hope that helps. cheers

Purging is not something I avoid at all on any substance. Heck, I have purged after Changa even I also found that purging was not an issue on my only Pharma journey so far, vomiting played a fairly central role, and I certainly felt clean afterwards. I wonder how it's going to be at higher dosages

LOL. Only at the Nexus would you find someone saying this!

This brightened my day.

Peace

Literally still laughing my ass off. Good stuff.

good info thanks oly i'm sure it was a blast learning all this . hopefully my rue and acacia c. will come in the mail tomorrow. i read here

https://www.dmt-nexus.me...aspx?g=posts&t=32559

that tannins actually bind to toxins for later excretion via purging. anyone have any further data on this matter?

I dunno, I never purge out of the mouth. I put it down to being very used to heroin nausea, in my younger, more foolish days. (I feel sick sometimes, but never quite sick enough to puke. Maybe more water is needed. Stomach could be too empty to purge.)

The other end, on the other hand...

Its pretty much the only time that the loosest bowel ever feels like a blessing.

Purging is like having your soul take a shower.
Chaos starts encroaching in an uncomfortable manner, everything gets louder, and you purge....
You stand up and it is another morning, everything is peaceful and you feel the fresh winds.

I need to get some caapi just for this reason, Syrian rue does not promote healthy cleansing for me. For whatever reason it just bubbles around in there.

Nicely put.

My desire not to puke comes from my experience with Morning Glory seeds. With MGS you have to endure horrible stomach pain for a few hours before the trip finally sets in. I don't know how this compares to Ayahuasca. My experience is that if you throw up the MGS, you won't feel a thing, and that sometimes means you've endured an hour or more of pain for nothing, and that's been enough to turn off a few people I know from trying to use them again. I've read reports on the Nexus where throwing up pharmahuasca didn't mean you don't trip. I've read reports where throwing up Ayahuasca over and over again means you have to drink more Ayahuasca over and over again. My concern is only that MGS are a lot easier to get than the materials for Ayahuasca, so it seems that, with Ayahuasca, throwing up could be pretty costly. Then again, there's a lot I don't know about Ayahuasca such as how much you actually need to drink, so I have a lot more research to do.

P.S.: I always thought that the pain of MGS always made the following trip extra special, but when I discovered LSD, I realized that I would probably never use MGS again. My point is that, as valuable as you claim the purge to be as a part of the ayahuasca experience, if a drug is ever found that produces the same experience without the purge, we may very well see Ayahuasca fall off the map. I'm not saying that's right, I just can't imagine it going any other way. It's hard to convince people that purging is what they need, and it will be even harder when there is an alternative.

Ayahuasca will never go away, its not meant to be as "fun" activity, if you dont want to purge dont do Aya, simple.

i for one would choose traditional Aya over a non purging Aya everytime, infact i purposefully avoid egg white teks ect. Im not sure i would want to convince someone to do Aya and if they had a problem with purging then i would think that the experience was not for them.
I feel that if you want to start removing parts of the process, such as purging, then you are almost missing the point, thin end of the wedge and all that.

but hey who am i to say how it should be done, i just think that if your gonna do it, do it properly.