First I'd comply with the authorities' every whim, sickening as I may find it. Then I'd do exactly the same as these people: attract public scrutiny to the absurdity of the status quo and hope to challenge it through legislation. What I absolutely would not do is go to jail behind it, or run farther away and hope the same thing doesn't happen twice. But none of this would disabuse me of the fact that it was only my own stupidity that brought government force to bear on my life and freedom.

I absolutely agree that government is hostile to most instances of individual freedom and will go to indefensible extremes, up to and including sending in the marines and bombers, to crush any who deviate into proscribed behaviours. I wouldn't be surprised at all if the authorities in this particular case are totally corrupt and at the whim of corporate interests who are eyeing the land for some future highway development or expensive condos.

But knowing this to be the situation, and distrusting government so completely, one ought not complain when it does what is in it's base nature to do. You don't go swimming with man-eating sharks then whinge when you lose a leg. If you want the sharks to go away, you stay on the beach and let them go hungry.

Likewise, one ought not provoke the ire of government by flaunting its regulations, particularly when conformity is entirely within one's power - be that situating your water tank according to certain arbitrary requirements, or vaping DMT in the privacy of your bedroom rather than in the middle of the local park. It costs very little to give the appearance of good behaviour, and if a person can't manage at least that much in the relative liberty afforded by western democratic society then they direly need a lesson in civics.

(Incidentally, in the UK a similar situation to this has befallen the last community of Irish Travellers. Their final site in the country is to be abolished due to complaints from local residents - surely worried only about the property-devaluing effect of such a nearby gypsy community. How could the travellers have avoided this loss? Maybe if the place didn't look such a fucking mess the locals wouldn't have had any basis for complaint, and they could have continued living there peacefully. The last vestige of their culture stolen, all because they couldn't be arsed to pick up their litter and keep a nice lawn.)

Thank you for the response and while I agree with it to some extent, I still don't think it fully embraces the essence of this situation.

You say it was their stupidity that caused this and I really don't believe that is the case.

Sure, they could have kept some of the places a little cleaner but considering most of them don't have any neighbors for 10+ miles, I don't see where that is really a big deal.

If it was just one person they were targeting, I could understand... but this is a LOT of people here. The government has their eye on that land and even if the people fully comply with all of their ridiculous demands (which are most likely outside the scope of their financial resources), the government would still find a way to eradicate them.

These people weren't swimming with sharks, they were living their lives, doing what they do.

I'm sorry that you don't have more compassion for these people. It really makes my heart hurt.

I do have compassion. Albeit about the same amount as I have for deer who skip in front of trucks. I just don't let it warp my politics.

I believe that structures need to be built such that they are safe to occupy; however, there are lots of crooked building departments that will look the other way when their favored builders are working a project. I've seen the evidence of shoddy workmanship being 'passed' during inspections, while much better workmanship is failed because the builder is not part of 'the good old boys' network.

Getting off the building topic a bit here is the fact that we in this supposedly free society are forced to comply with hundreds of thousands of laws if not millions of laws some of them conflicting the other. These laws are written at the federal, state, county, and municipal levels. Even brilliant lawyers having studied for decades DO NOT understand all of them and their ramifications.

How can a reasonably intelligent person comply with the laws never mind be an activist against the dark forces creating some of these very oppressive laws? To me this is the very definition of tyranny.
There is no way in hell for there to be true justice in this country in any arena weather it be building code, drug laws, or whatever topic is your fancy for your day with so much BULLSHIT being enacted into law by governing authorities. Take some recent legislation passed into law in a couple of months that consists of over 2000 pages of text. Not one congressman has read an entire document that sized in that time and understood it completely. That is not common sense, and that is not legal according to the constitution of the United States.

We live in a society that could best be called a 'corporcracy' in my opinion. If you are in control of mega millions and billions, then you can buy, bribe, or influence the president, judges, senators, or what ever official you need. Hire your army of lobbiests. Your vote then counts; otherwise, you are not to be listened to.

Otherwise, as I have seen stated in earlier posts, you are one of the slaves for a corporation. If you do things that get you noticed by the power crazed leaders of this society, you will be discredited, fined, jailed, folded, spindled and otherwise mutilated by the system. I think it is best to fly under the radar and not tempt the lion to eat you.

-I can totally understand their anger. If i was them, though...i'd have left the states a loong time ago. There are better places in the world to live off grid. Like Latin America, etc. Personally, i think that if you've a free spirit, that it doesn't belong in the states.There are too many laws and sorting anything out is complicated and nightmarish.

This is the key here. You can play the game correctly, dot your i's and cross your t's... kiss the ass of every petty tyrant who crosses your path. You can be smarmy, attempt to fit in, and even go to great lengths to look the part of a good, upstanding citizen... and still they will smash you like a bug if it benefits their interests or those of their friends even a little bit.

While I agree that it makes sense to not attract the attention of the gestapo, I think that defending the right of the fascists to gestapo you is too much to ask. Be smart. Keep your eyes open & cover your ass... but don't try and justify the right of corrupt people to be corrupt.

America was not founded to be a police state. It was not this model of government that immigrants came from all over the world to join. The "land of the free" was a place with frontiers and wilderness... a lawless place at times. For most of American history, if the government got too greedy or crossed too many lines, people would let them know.

The fact is that in a democracy, what the people want should generally be what happens. Sadly this is not the case in the US or the EU anymore. Major decisions about how people can live are made without any thought to public opinion. Nobody voted for the drug laws that terrorize everyone. Nobody voted to bail out the banks. Nobody will get a vote as they take away school lunches for poor people, or force elderly off medicare.

As for these building codes... were they ever submitted for public approval? Are they applied equally to all constructions? No. This whole business about connecting to the power grid is insane. There is no law that says you need to run high voltage cables onto your land. What, it is okay to have solar panels or tap a stream if you feed your power back to their grid... but you can't just make electricity for yourself?

This is not how America started. This is not how America grew up. And it is certainly not the America that most Americans want to live in. The philosophy advocated by Laban Shrewsbury III above, while clearly intelligent and shrewd, is callous to the fact that people are suffering. If they are not as smart about hiding their bullshit as I am, then they deserve it? Please. This is the old apologetics for evil that allowed the Nazis to cart away people's neighbors. After all, they only want the Jews & Gypsies, right?

I am not advocating being stupid and making an example of yourself. But if we can't at least agree that the current system is flawed, rotten, and destructive what hope is there of changing it? Instead of feeling smug that you can vape DMT at home without ramifications because you wear a suit, pay your taxes, look normal enough, and live in the right neighborhood... how about acknowledging that DMT being illegal is an insult to our collective intelligence and a farce. An endogenous chemical being outlawed? How can anyone take that seriously?

I'm sure that someone wants those people off their land for some reason. The eyesore issue seems unlikely if they live 10 miles away from the nearest neighbor. Besides if everyone's opinion were equal, the number of registered voters in the community of people being evicted certainly outnumbers the number of people who could conceivably have complained. It is probably a corporation or developer who wants them gone. If it was the government itself, they wouldn't have to play these games. They already have the power of Emminent Domain. They could just take the land if it was a highway they wanted to build.

Fact is, you can never really own anything in the US.

Why always when I hear something messed up that has something to do with the government I feel like posting "only in america(US)"?
Their government is acting like obsessed schizophrenic

This, fucking this.

This.

Uh oh. I've been Godwinned.

For the last time: I am not defending the actions of government. I am highlighting the probable laziness of these residents in not handing the government pretext to persecute them.

Yes it's fucked up and a travesty that people must submit to absurd laws, whether that be complex building codes or prohibition of certain substances, but there are ways to avoid falling prey to government and working to change laws through positive advocacy, of which being locked up or killed, neither running away or hiding are any part.

what does it mean to have quality of life. Is it true freedom??... And is not belonging to the grid true freedom, or is it anarchy as far as the government are concerned??.... Are you really free, or is that a lie....WHAT IS REAL???...

Most old buildings are in violation of modern building codes. If building codes where that serious, the government of the UK should tear down st pauls cathedral in london immediately: It even collapsed twice during it's construction.
St peter's in rome should also be torn down then. The structure of it's dome was mostly improvised during construction.

You can chat about this forever, but what's going on here can be explained in 3 words:
Grand Theft Property.

Make money where you live, and spend it somewhere else where it's cheaper and better, like latin America-SIMPLZ!

the whole comparing the situation to a different but similar in a broad sense thing doesnt really work ie. phonehenge, and a hobo dump or slumlord? they are clearly vastly different scenarios. it just isnt really simular enough to apply the same logic to in my opinion, beyond that lisbonshrewsburyIII seems to compare living the middle of nowhere to selling dmt on your porch???...there just seems to be some serious logic gaps here to me personally

I dont really see the relevence either and feel it sort of is derailing the thread personally.

As a person that has constant run ins with 'the system' I've thought about this a lot. What is better, fight it and make things hard for yourself? or just submit and make things easy on yourself?

I think the answer to this question will vary depending on how bad your getting screwed over, if A cop told me to stop speeding or I'll get a ticket sure, I'll comply.

But if they told me I had to serve 20 years in jail for my crime of speeding I would rather go out in a hail of bullets than comply even if complying would still be the logical thing to do.

edit~ the situation here is absurd and depending on my mood I might actually end up making an example of myself. but I'm not the most logical person in the world by any means

What we are getting at is that you do not NEED to give the government pretext to persecute you in this day and age. Anyone and everyone is a potential victim. This is about realizing that WE ARE ALL ONE and the issues that affect these people affect ALL OF US.

I find it incomprehensible on how indifferent you are where these people are concerned. You just don't get it.

I really hope that you evolve soon Mr. Shrewdbury. I can't speak on behalf of the Nexus, I can only speak for myself in this regard, but I really feel that your general cold hearted attitude does not jive with the general vibe of this wonderful and LOVING community we have here.

Haven't psychedelics taught you anything? For God's sake man, where the fuck is the Love?!?!?!

Newsflash, swami: not everyone agrees with you, no matter how much weaselly, passive aggressive love-vibe you send their way. Nor was I aware that I had to 'jive' with what you see as your special little cult. The internet is not your personal echo chamber.

I'll leave it at that, aware that I am being unconsciously trolled into a dispiriting flamewar.

World is fucked up, taken over by idiots with guns and more idiots following them