So it the potency of the "diamond crystal" form higher simply because more DMT molecules can be packed into a given amount of space (like more carbon atoms in diamonds than in coal), or because something else (some kind of electromagnetism or something out of hyperspace we don't understand) is going on? Maybe the explanation is simply that we're taking a larger dose.

Or maybe the molecule itself has been changed, so by the time it's inhaled we're no longer taking "regular" DMT?

Interesting, indeed!

Hmm, some frozen aya ziplocked up in my fridge is knocking on the freezer door, perhaps it has an answer.

Hi pau,

Not that I know the difference between a quark and a finely feathered blue jay... but it struck me with a profound impact, that when geometry is near perfect (from a completely subjective stance), perhaps the degree of saturation is diametrically expanded by the very virtue of the perfection of the geometry involved. If this is the case, by Jesus, we've got revolutionary data ,which may be a gateway into new levels of crystallography. Ain't we got fun? Thank you, once more CaptainFuture for your breakthrough findings. You're the man!

Perfect "geometry" has nothing to do with a drugs effects. It may effect the initial pharmacokinetics but once dmt has been put in the gas phase and enters the blood stream its the EXACT same every time. The only difference is the dose and how much got in you and how fast it got in you.

You can't use analogies about quartz crystals here because they do not apply. Crystals are used in all kinds of devices to transmit very specific kinds of energy. But this has nothing to do with drugs.

The final little diamond crystals. They look more like squares and already beginning to turn cloudy.
I'll see if I re-grow them again to further purify them. I have to see how much DMT was lost.

Maybe we start at the point that I don't see DMT as a drug. It is what our spirit is made of.
I found it's the transmitter between our real existence and the world of matter. We, when we created the material world, brought it into being to always have a connection to our real self, pure energy, which we all are part of. Therefore DMT is the bridge to birth and death, to spiritual experiences and surely to the dream state, which connects us every night with our source and lets us loose our material existence.
And I believe we're not even really matter, because our molecules (and I mean all molecules) have only a tiny part matter in it, and 99,9% of a molecule is Biophotons(light energy)
And to interact with everything there are energy waves. And in geometric structure those waves are concentrated. And besides the chemical activity of 'the drug' Dimethyltryptamin the energy which builds up by geometry of the DMT crystals interacts with you, too. This energy is not lost when you heat the DMT.
This is all my experience, so don't be offended if you see it different.


Again, maybe we're on a different approach to it. I don't see DMT as a drug. And the crystal energy is all about geometry. Look at the pyramids, they were built like that, especially like that to build up energy inside due to their geometry.


And once again about the weight/dosage point. I use a 0,001gr. scale and am pretty sure about the dosages I use. I melt the crystals into the machine bubbler wire and then light the thing typically every time the same. And from my experience I found the diamond crystals way more powerful, more spiritual and with an intense magic. And the most interesting thing is when I do a large dosage (above 100mg) with the other crystals I can't remember what I experienced, with the diamonds I still know so clearly what had happened, although the experience seemed to be far more intense, and lasted twice as long.

I really encourage others to purify their crystals (its so easy, only bad thing is a bid of lost of DMT) and do research on it. This would get things moving forward.
I will dissolve the new crystals again later to further purify them. The naphta they came from is very slightly yellow, so this time they will be much more pure.

And thank you, Rising Spirit, for your kind words. Feels good to know I am not alone with this. I really would love to hear what others think of it all.

You were naturally very excited by the "diamond" DMT crystals. You were thrilled and had great anticipation before vaping them: your "set" changed. Not surprising it affected the experience. I would be more surprised if your giddiness and expectations HADN'T affected it!

But to jump to the conclusion that it must be due the the shape of the crystals is just that: a rather large jump!

Trips vary so radically that a conclusion arrived at from a one time use (or even several) is a faulty conclusion, whether you believe in crystal "energies" or not. But hey, if it makes your trips better, by all means!

Excellent work on growing those crystals BTW. Gives me the desire to start "crystalling" (crystallifying, chrysalising...?)!!

JBArk

CaptainFuture

Those crystals are so damn beautiful its really hard to even believe that they are real...


Much Peace and Sunshine

cough cough...crystallising...cough cough

This makes little sense to me... Perhaps DMT molecules have different ways of joining in certain conditions? Either way, I always get big needles.

twere a joke mr. Inf!! I am always with cheek and tongue buried, whether wise, wizened or wearied!

JBArk

Thats funny, because I did vape them a few days after growing them, thinking nothing about their different appearance- and therefore expecting nothing special.
At first hand I thought I did something wrong on them, because I never saw crystals like that.
After that extreme experience and after one from a friend with those particular crystals the thought about crystal geometry & how to re-grow the 'diamonds' came up.


Usually after an initial phase of trips I can now pretty good recall why things are happening during the DMT influence. And usually they do not necessary differ so much from each other, because if the dose is high enough I reach the 'energy realm', like swimming in energy. Or below that I have things which are on my mind personalized into 'beings' or entities (often women or children, sometimes my oldest daughter) talking to me about it. (at first I thought that there are real entities but thats not the case, they are created by my subconsciousness, like in a dream.)

Anyway, I am going on with my work.
The 1st re-x of my stock I talked about is finished. I let them grow for 12hours and poured the Naphta out (and freeze precipitated the rest) to keep them as clear as possible.
Thats 4,5grs (the rest from the freezer is drying but it looks like I haven't lost that much)



Looks quite clear, but a slight yellow is still visible. We'll see..
Its dissolved again, also the diamonds from today, so again waiting for the miracle to perform...



I am absolutely sure its the purity which causes the diamond shape to grow. Try to clean your crystals, you'll see. (if you wish)

Hey Now burnt,

You forgot to qualify your thought process with the preface, IMHO. As it has been pointed out to several folks making speculative comments within the Nexus, what we actually know for an absolute certainty, COLLECTIVELY, compared to what we do not know for an absolute certainly, is infinitesimally small. It's fine to have a completely rational stance about this issue but I think it behooves any of us to discount another's direct experience. It is amusing that both, you and the Captain have based your belief on your capacity to comprehend the same idea from opposite angles. Until a larger volume of research is actually done, the jury is still out.

What is held as scientific law today, is yesterday's speculative nonsense. How can you be so certain that CaptainFuture is incorrect in his conclusions about his own research? Because you THINK so? Right or wrong, in terms of our subjective assessments of the differences between fact and fiction, we all have the choice of what we deem as true or false. While you logic is sound and reasonable, it defiantly brushes off a potentially significant discovery about how the external degree of geometry may or may not influence the trip of the user. How can anyone be so sure in their rationale, that they flatly proclaim such investigation as foundation-less? The last time I looked, we exist in a universe free of boundaries, save those we create ourselves. All the information exists, already, it is we who have yet to unraveled the mysteries, personally. This is our birthright, no? :idea:

I may be off base here, I freely admit, but I feel that any breakthroughs we have had in our understanding of the physical universe and the undeniable structure of material reality, are collectively achieved. CaptainFuture is opening a dialog and sharing both, the outcome of his research and the content of is personal experience of their effects. Nobody can have such an empirical belief system, that it excludes areas which are completely unknown. I see this thread as an invitation to the Nexian community to embrace a new region of exploration. This is most commendable and should not be reduced to an overly active imagination or completely speculative. I might point out that every new discovery is by it's very definition, pushing the boundaries of the known, in search for greater understanding. It is both reasonable and inspiring to open the door to new possibilities. Like Galileo didn't have naysayers undermining his research? In other words, as the late Jimi Hendrix wrote, "lay back and groove".

I am one small voice speaking out, in the infinitude of possibilities in subjective perception, and I simply do not know. I know less than I do not know, like most humans. I am eager to find out though, and do question how we can be so closed-minded about this seemingly new development, in the growth of DMT geometries. Let's say we let the Captain proceed with our support and encouragement? He's surely got mine. Anyone who can create such artistically perfect "diamonds" is to be admired and applauded for a job well done. I agree that until we know more we should suspend our final decree and not state factually what we are yet to prove conclusively. I am on the fence. But that's just me. It will take further work to prove or disprove what this geometry may do to the dreamer.

You certainly have the right to discount any validity to any and all ideas your intelligence judges as fantasy. So, as jbark replied, positive expectation does indeed shape our perception. I suggest that the opposite is true, as well. Ultimately , until a considerable amount of objective research is done, this whole phenomenon is an open ended question. Thus, others are needed to do just what the Captain has done and compare results and ideas. This is where I believe our friend is heading and what he is asking his compatriots to do. He has the right to believe his own experience and seek to clarify the results. In this regard, I salute his fine accomplishments and admirable ambitions. Go for it Capitano Futuro!!!

Burnt is right on this. You may very well see different rates of solvation..heck I've seen some crystals never go back into solvent, but once the crystals break apart they are just individual molecules of DMT and they are governed by the laws of statistical mechanics. This isn't one of the areas that science is going to "rewrite".

...now if you want to talk about the ability of different crystal forms to store informations/energy then I'd step of the speculation cliff with you!

I don't believe in promoting myths about psychedelic drugs. The idea that crystal geometry has an any considerable role in the drugs effects is exactly such a myth. Its not as dangerous as myths like "dmt makes you see aliens and then you go craaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaazy". But its still a myth.

I don't want to crowd the thread with this discussion because the point is to discuss crystallization. If someone wants to discuss why crystal shape barely matters in this case I'd be happy to in another thread.

fantastic thread... very gud job.... there was such a thread before i think i forgot whos was it but may be Phlux's , he was also mentioning about the difference in the trips... and the reason in change of crystal shapes should be related with few things; type of solvent, saturation of dmt in it, temperature and probably pressure... but i am no xtal expert. The ones i always yield are like the ones in your first picture "The needle with geometric tip". Good job keep us informed about your further experiments

Well "Joe Burnt"
I still say- thats your opinion. The whole field is something far above science or something explainable.
I'd say compare my tries to explain this to you with the ones you had explaining the DMT experience to others. Its something which one can only fail in.

Agreed. Neither mythology, nor science fiction has any place in legitimate research and I do not believe anyone was mythologising these crystallographic geometries. Questions are being raised, that's all. My point was about whether or not, the external geometry would or would not facilitate a greater effect in the imbiber of the vaporization. I was never any question about re-writing the laws of statistical mechanics. We all know that each molecule exists in a pristine state, microscopically.

Where I find the Captain's exploration intriguing is in that interrelationship between the geometry of the external crystal, in it's transformation to vapor, and how this may or may not enhance the potency of the experience, during the symbiosis. The quantification of various colors and forms of extractions are frequently discussed here, and there is a consensus that jungle spice is not a high a trip as that from more purely extracted DMT crystals. Much discussion takes place about the color of these crystals and how this may directly influence the experience. It is only natural to extend this type of discussion over towards the actual geometry of these splendid crystals. It is not purely speculative, because people may have more enhanced experiences form certain external forms of DMT, as with the above mentioned variations. It just remains unproven rationally, due to a lack of objective exploration. :idea:

Nobody ever tried to deny that the interior molecular structure of the DMT molecule/the Spirit Molecule, is the primary causative force in the actual high experienced (in the comments and replies within this thread). In fact, what has been stated by the creator/parent himself, of these crystalline beauties, CaptainFuture. He honestly proclaims that despite his objectivity in interpreting his conscious reaction to the "diamonds", he noted a marked increase in their potency. The point I raised was HOW are we to be so certain that the geometry has no effect upon the inter-dynamics at play, involved with the vaporized DMT molecules and the human lungs? Not a radical or fantastical idea, rather, a questioning of our absolute certainty, without supplying the dates and locations of such completed experimentation. If this has been done, I am all ears.

For a clear example, I might offer this analogy? We are experiencing dehydration. We become thirsty for a glass of water. We all know that distilled water would be the closest external variation of the H2O molecule. Unfortunately, we only have access to swamp water. The H2O molecule is present in both examples as a core essence of water, itself. Sadly, the swamp water gives the organism quite a rough ride through the intestines. It could be hypothesized that the distilled water gave the experience of pure H2O in a more enhanced manner, although when the body breaks down the component parts of the glass of liquid... H2O is still H2O.

So where I am going with this line of though and this admitted speculation is this, can the purity of the DMT content be greater or less great, based solely on it's external geometric form, prior to vaporization? Sometimes it's good to question if we have missed any data or some tiny details of our cognition of this perceived data, as we cannot know if our assumptions are legitimate without cross referencing them with others and conducting experimentation. Can we? Now, if you and joedirt had written that you have done repeated experiments with a multiplicity of DMT crystallographic variations in geometries, with a large group of sane subjects involved, I would accept you statement as having more factual weight and validity. Your intelligence alone is not sufficient to convince me otherwise, as I have had one experience which corroborates the Capitano's subjective findings about enhanced potency. Not because I expected it to be more enhanced or potent, because I really didn't... but just because I lived through the experiment and believe that there is something to the idea, based solely on my experience.

Say joedirt, now as far as mineral crystals being able to "store informations/energy", nothing could be more a case of pure speculation. This doesn't make it untrue, rather, it simply needs specific clarification. What do you mean when you say, different crystal forms store energy and/or information? I know what you are implying, I just want to be clear as to exactly what you are getting at, given the nature of this discussion? I have been using various crystallized minerals for both, regular sitting meditation and internal psychedelic explorations, since that late 1970's. This is by far the most speculative area of modern interpretations of the laws of statistical mechanics. Transduction of energy through certain crystals is easily to measure and prove scientifically. I personally do believe in certain mineral crystals capacity to amplify and increase the flow of electromagnetic energy. There is definitely something special about any kind of crystal, in this regard. But when folks start talking about the encoded knowledge from ancient Lemuria and Atlantis, then the whole issue becomes a circus act and smacks of a bizarre carnival show.

This is certainly a mythologising of a possible science of energy transference and/or magnification. It is clouded by the "psychics" and New Age preacher wannabes in disgraceful abundance. In this light, I wouldn't want CaptianFuteres research to gain a crazy-ass group of fanatics who would spontaneously craft a new religion based upon such geometries. So let's be open minded without being nutso, eh? Please don't feel I am being skeptical about the idea of the whole crystal energy thing. I have felt something going on for decades but I believe there are laws at play and while I do get an amplification of my intent, while utilizing the lens or focal point of the crystals, it is quite subtle. It necessitates the interaction and symbiosis with an individuated consciousness, to have any value to the witness of said meditation. An observer, if you will, as is the case with experiments in String Theory.

While I hesitate to say mineral crystals aid to a dramatic degree,within the parameters of a meditative state of mind, I cannot decree that they are fully without effect with said meditations and concentration exercises. Why? Because I have done the experimentation, numerous times in various states of mind. Now, what it clear from my research, is that the methodology of the meditation practice was by far, the only significant factor. It was the technique of consciously altering my brain wave patterns which brought about the greatest change in awareness. Let's face it, an agitated mind will not access altered levels of consciousness, regardless of being surrounded with the most perfect geometric examples of crystalline formations. Simply sitting in a full lotus posture upon a mountain of pure quarts will not make you enlightened if you are not already moving in that direction. Could it help? I believe it potentially could.

Could it hurt? I don't think it could possibly hurt, unless one was seated on top of some very sharp, pointed crystal terminations. That would be like sitting on a bed of nails. It can be learned through gradual practice and application but it is fairly useless for transforming the mind of the perceiver. It does generate an income for the practitioner, so who am I to criticize? IMHO. Perhaps I think this because I have not learned to sit on bed of nails? I can flatly state that I will never find out. Ouch! On the other hand, as per crystal energy, I do feel something interesting is happening when I use these crystals, so I am open to the possibility that they have a notable impact upon our consciousness (if used as an amplifying lens of sorts).

Still, I believe that the more perfect the mineral crystal's external geometry, the more it does aid to it's limited degree. I just wonder sometimes how much we take for granted about the known and how it may be an incorrect final assessment, if and only if new information comes along to alter this consensus. That's all.

burnt, I know what I experienced and your logical insistence cannot change what I have experienced, anymore than my illogical insistence can change yours. Where I have a small problem, is when individuals insist that their spin on things is a concrete law. As String theory suggests, observation does alter the laws of material reality, when said observation occurs. I don't know for certain if all the accepted laws we hold as truth and irrefutable. They are potentially flawed by our limited comprehension of this material plane we find ourselves existing within.

Wouldn't if be lovely to be part of a group experiment where we were able to inhale numerous form and variations of DMT substances, including multiple crystallographic geometries? Other than the great high, it would be most illuminating if we were to compare, cross reference the data and share our findings with impartiality. Just saying...

Well if you guys think there is a difference in crystals, why not show it so with a blind test ?

Great idea endlessness. This hypothesis should be put through any number and series of tests. Sounds like a grand time!!! Maybe CaptainFuture is already underway with such a blind test? Say, can we get the talented chemists who frequent this wonderful oasis in cyberspace, planet Nexus, to join in with this investigative experimentation? I could be off target here, but I believe that's exactly what this thread is implying?

Hey Capitano Futuro, what sayest thou?

Peace, love & light

Ähm, while having a break from our sauna, I've just read your last long one, Spirit. You're really getting into this Love it.

Well, for me the FIRST important thing is to grow the crystals as perfect as can be. If one know my mushroom grows, its clear this is important for me. I am always trying to do the not possible things. I am not saying I want to grow a crystal like this 'fairy tale one' on the linked Erowid picture, but I want to go as far as I can without wasting too much molecules. The second re-x of the bulk stuff (above), which is already heavily crystallizing, is still needle w/ square plates shaped. And for the solvent skeptics I used Hexan this time. There's still nothing visible in the diamond bowl, though- we'll see tomorrow if there will be diamonds growing even with Hexan.

I just had a talk with my wife about the "energy still stays in the DMT after melting/vaping thing". I think the energy aka. information which builds up through the geometry is stored within the molecules and therefore will still be present in the molecules from the geometric crystal. There are many different DMT molecules and they do remember the information which is stored in them. I see it the same like with water molecules.

And the blind test has to wait till I get more into 'testing' the geometric crystals- once they are final. I built a 2nd machine bubbler today, to be sure to separately smoke the crystals...