DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 681 Joined: 11-Sep-2010 Last visit: 24-Dec-2011
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here is the full paper for anyone who wants to see it http://dl.dropbox.com/u/...imon-science.1197258.pdf
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 131 Joined: 11-Nov-2010 Last visit: 09-Apr-2014 Location: Midwest
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This is fascinating. I wonder what repercussions there are of substituting the significantly larger arsenic for phosphorous. My guess would be that the macro-molecules that were noted with the substitution would be less stable but I don't what that would mean for the organism itself. More mutations?
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analytical chemist
   
Posts: 7463 Joined: 21-May-2008 Last visit: 03-Mar-2024 Location: the lab
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not much difference same number of valence electrons, same number of bonds "Nothing is true, everything is permitted." ~ hassan i sabbah
"Experiments are the only means of attaining knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." -Max Planck
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 131 Joined: 11-Nov-2010 Last visit: 09-Apr-2014 Location: Midwest
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benzyme wrote:not much difference
same number of valence electrons, same number of bonds I do realize that, the substitution couldn't occur at all if As and P had different valence electrons. Quickly looking it up shows that the sizes aren't that different. P has an atomic radius of 100 pm when derived empirically while As has an atomic radius of 115 pm.
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 830 Joined: 20-Jan-2009 Last visit: 07-Jun-2017
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benzyme wrote:not much difference
same number of valence electrons, same number of bonds Why don't we see this in other biological life though? You lock the door, and throw away the key
There's someone in my head but it's not me
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analytical chemist
Posts: 7463 Joined: 21-May-2008 Last visit: 03-Mar-2024 Location: the lab
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aha that is the real question. the answer is... no. "Nothing is true, everything is permitted." ~ hassan i sabbah
"Experiments are the only means of attaining knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." -Max Planck
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 830 Joined: 20-Jan-2009 Last visit: 07-Jun-2017
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What? You lock the door, and throw away the key
There's someone in my head but it's not me
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analytical chemist
Posts: 7463 Joined: 21-May-2008 Last visit: 03-Mar-2024 Location: the lab
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ok. "Nothing is true, everything is permitted." ~ hassan i sabbah
"Experiments are the only means of attaining knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." -Max Planck
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 131 Joined: 11-Nov-2010 Last visit: 09-Apr-2014 Location: Midwest
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Are you kidding? VisualDistortion wrote:Why don't we see this in other biological life though? I'm not sure on this one either. According to the paper there are substitutions between other similar elements but not any of the "needed six." I guess another important question is why is arsenic poisonous at all? It seems to inhibit a few necessary enzymes but I don't know why it would if it and P are so similar.
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 830 Joined: 20-Jan-2009 Last visit: 07-Jun-2017
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There electronegativity is similar too. Similar atomic radius, electronegativity, same number of valence electrons. It is a pretty common water contaminant too so you thing there would be a lot of bacteria exploiting the Arcenic niche. Maybe there are, and this is only the first one scientist have discovered. Since I'm speculating, Maybe the orbitals hybridize differently than Phosphorous. Or the d shell electrons have something to do with it? You lock the door, and throw away the key
There's someone in my head but it's not me
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 4639 Joined: 16-May-2008 Last visit: 24-Dec-2012 Location: A speck of dust in endless space, like everyone else.
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VisualDistortion wrote:There electronegativity is similar too.
Similar atomic radius, electronegativity, same number of valence electrons. It is a pretty common water contaminant too so you thing there would be a lot of bacteria exploiting the Arcenic niche. Maybe there are, and this is only the first one scientist have discovered.
Since I'm speculating, Maybe the orbitals hybridize differently than Phosphorous. Or the d shell electrons have something to do with it? That's the reason why it's poisonous...because it is so simmilar. But not simmilar enough. It will take the place of phosphor in any organism, but then the cell appears not to function like it should anymore.
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 830 Joined: 20-Jan-2009 Last visit: 07-Jun-2017
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Hmmm You lock the door, and throw away the key
There's someone in my head but it's not me
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 830 Joined: 20-Jan-2009 Last visit: 07-Jun-2017
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Finding caught amid a fire storm
LINKYou lock the door, and throw away the key
There's someone in my head but it's not me
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