I don't usually report experiences with spice. for the most part they are beautiful and its though god just puke in my mouth. well not this one. about 20 minutes ago I smoked an unscaled amount (probably alot) - maybe 50-100 mg of newest extraction, just like normal.. lately i've gotten into the habit of taking one last toke or two as the effects begin to grab me, maybe thats where i went too far.. this was unlike any experience with dmt I have ever had. upon onset (which was extremely rapid) i saw red lines and crosses and heard aural hallucination, an alarm or something quite annoying. it felt like i had been caught shoplifting only I didn't know I was even there. these visuals were completely integrated into everything i looked at. very chaotic and didn't for a second feel like dmt. I closed my eyes, looked at my ceiling, I couldn't escape them. for a couple minutes I really felt close to death or I was pretty much fucked. my brain felt like it was about to crash or was sending me millions of error messages, recursively print themselves on my scene. all I know is one second everything looked normal, things were in their expected place around my room and then, complete madness. I'm rolling around on my bed, sitting up, trying to find something to fixate on and wait this horrible experience out. nothing. after a few minutes the horrible visuals subsided and there I was feeling completely insane. at the moment I really didn't feel like I was coming back from this. not much like a NDE, I just felt like I was in the void yet still experiencing what I was perceiving as reality. I was trying to make sense of it. the trick with bad salvia trips is trying to remember reality, small things first then work up till your back to understand yourself. I tried that here, no luck. my room felt completely alien yet at the same time I knew it was mine. have you every been playing a video game and you go into a room that doesn't load completely? yeah it was exactly like that. things are there or they're missing. nothing about it felt normal. I could not understand what was happening or why everything had changed so quickly. I had not forgot about the spice at the time, in fact I began to think about what I could of gone wrong. objects around my room had either tampered with or gone. the feeling was very reminiscent of a very heavy and immersive salvia experience, that feeling of being caught in a loop, like the very second I set the pipe down time to the moment then laid my head back. I experienced time in modulo.It finally occured to me that I needed to leave this room. something wasn't right here and I was more or less hoping that it would only limited to only this room. as I got up and went for the door everything still looked alien. all textures were smooth. my hallway felt weird too, then the bathroom but somehow i felt safer. i stood for a moment then sat on the bathroom mat and preceeded to lie down. staring at the pulsating moldy ceiling provided me with some refuge from the horrible void. I began to calm down. there was a light taste of vomit in my mouth (scary) and I kept asking myself what happened.

nuts huh? ring a bell for anyone? all i can say is it was like being caught in a indecipherable looping hell for about 5 minutes. nothing like what i've experienced before. spice never ceases to amaze me, for better or worse.

I know a lot of you guys say theres a certain point when smoked high doses of dmt just make you black out and not remember your trip at all but trips like this really make me wonder.... I really get the feeling that my mind shouldn't of gone there.. Maybe I was right before the blackout threshold. I really wish my mind had blocked his out. lol I probably could of done without it.. but then again I feel retrospectively good now, glad to be alive you know? even though I was likely no where near death to begin with. dmt really likes to screw with people.. hopefully the aftereffects pay off.

I think you just got a sub-breakthrough dose. Probably not by much, but the silly thing is that you're actually supposed to smoke more to get the full effect. The full effect, however, is even crazier than what you just had...

It gets easier as you get used to the feeling. I remember my first harrowing trips; where everything in me and around me was warped and twisted beyond recognition. You always come back though, and in like less than an hour. After my first trip I remember thinking, "Holy F@#$, that was the craziest thing ever!", but an hour later I was sitting in front of the tv thinking, "Yeah! Boobies!"

So don't give up! You just managed to extract the stuff so might as well make use of it!

That rings a solid bell for me.

This sounds like some of my bad experiences with the spice. I'm not sure what caused it, but mine were not because of sub-breakthough doses... Those type of experiences happen to me when I overdo it and/or are highly stressed out. Once it felt like I was hit with a psycadellic hammer...there was complete chaos in my mind, it was racing 10000 miles an hour, eyes involuntairly popped open and I was quite shaken for about an hour (this was on 65+ mgs of melted spice). I don't believe it is the spice, as I have had wonderful experieces and horrible ones off of the same batch. I keep my spice in amber vials tucked away in the freezer so I doubt it was due to degradation.

Try doing a little meditation, a relaxing bath, or something else calming right before you blast off. I have found that this limits the frequency of this type of experience. Ritualizing the experience a little bit has seemed to help me with the experience in general. A little insence, a few minutes of introspection, a blessing to the spirits, and off to outer shpongolia!

man, same thing here! I definately wont give up, especially now that I see the experience as being so temporary. i mean one second I was frightened out of my mind and having a cold sweat on the floor of my bathroom and then I was completely back to normal, not at all ruined by the experience. yet the scariest thing about this experience was that it seriously did not feel like dmt at all and I've smoked it hundreds of times, in probably higher doses than this too. honestly i've had similar experiences before, definately not as frightening as this but certainly just as unnerving, i'm willing to bet the doses were similar. my experiences with much higher doses has either caused breakthroughs or complete pyschic blackouts. whats so amazing about spice is that it never gets dull and can always send the user for a loop.



wow that sounds pretty frightening! for me it was an inability to shake the intense visuals. I'm not sure If ever closed my eyes during the experience either. i feel like I must of but they were so integrated into the world around me that I wasn't able to see them as being detached from the world as I normal am able to.



well it is finals week, but I don't feel particularly stressed out. naturally there is a lot on my mind but not at all overwhelming stuff.. I just think I overdid it, you know tried too hard to breakthrough. Your ideas about ritual and meditation sound good. I definately don't try too hard when it comes to creating a serene setting for my trips. of course I lie on my bed, a place I feel extremely comfortable and sometimes I play music, I've always approached it from a minimalist point of view. maybe I will try to ritualize it more in the future.

dmt can be like getting your ego waxed off ... or like a poly-srippa of the soul, you get 'peeled' and sliced sometimes - very weird to have this as a psychic experience!

It's probably good to have a trusted guide to give reassurance, maybe ? That's my plan - I try to not smoke it alone, although I will eat it alone - just to keep all the purging to myself etc etc .. !

I bet there is a biochemical explanation as part of the reasons thes trips happen - weird MAO activity or another neurotransmitter interfereing.

Describing it as 'bad' as getting sliced, dimembered and lanced by 100's of spears and arrows is a well documented phase of the shamanic journey - as the shaman enters the otherworld he/she has to transform into an animal or a 'vehicle' so this means you better drop the flesh-based-you really quick, or it's gonna get diced !

I have had 'looping' experiences, a looping set of peaks, or thoughts-with-tracers of themselves - 1000 thoughts are where there ought to be one, all slightly delayed in presentation... But this I had on >100mg dmt / 3.5g Rue seed extracted - pharmahuasca, so I attributed the loopiness to the MAOI .. but who knows, I thought I had hit a 'overdose' level of the experience at 150 mg dmt with 3.5g Rue.

When this has happened to me after smoking dmt - the rough-ride - I recall thinking "there's been an accident ?!" .. and I'm picking up the pieces trying to recollect .. "oh yeah .. my bong .!" ...... but then, if you did it right, a second rush hits, and I go 'up' another level

35 mg in one lungful - held as long as possible - gets me there. Sometimes it's got two 'levels' ... Sometimes you might say first it's the 'playpen' room, the ante-chamber you can remember, and then the second rush hits and into the great 'beyond' ...

Yeah, totally agree with all that. Same happened few times here also. Same batch, somehow same usual settings but for unknown psychological/biological reasons the beginning is different and then "ooooohhhh NNNNnnnnooooo..." !

Here is an hypothesis : whatever the amount, there is always few (very few) seconds of fractal/kaleidoscops imagery during wich we are still in normal state, but also during which we can evaluate the intensity or weirdness of what will happen. Then there is a kind of 'switch' and the ride really start. If the dose is 'serious', there might be a very short time of loss of awareness (very short, like few milliseconds), I feel it is like when you fall deeply asleep and wake up immediatly not knowing who, what, where you are.

Beeing in a frightened state just before that switch, ones may 'wake up' in the DMT land in a pure terror state. But because ones mind can be totally fucked up at this time, it is nearly impossible to gather reassuring element and you just have to do with it until some of the sub-system start to work properly (like short term memory)
In that case it is quite nice to have a sitter... althought anyway that state will fade after few minutes... but it seems lasting way too long

Wait until you actually die...

I've never experienced ego death like this, not with dmitri. salvia yes. I was being hunted. with salvia at least I could this however, i couldn't move and although it was brief it was absolutely frightening... my last frightening experience was with entities. this was completely emotional. I was thinking, maybe I blacked out for a second then came back midtrip? sounds possible...

Yo usay DMT, you say salvia, you say rue. I say nitrous oxide.

Totally possible, go through 20 cartriges in a few minutes, you'll be far gone in the sense that you have no idea what the hell day it is. I mean, you do, you're just so far gone from it. I guess all I can explain it by is saying ego death. Ego death.

Luckily, nitrous is quick like DMT, and everything is back to normal, but I think there is a bit more fog afterwards with N2O. The experience I am referring to was I believe N2O and DMT, alternating, more N2O because I am against DMT at night. It was my birthday, the 22nd, and I remembered I had work the next day. It was just a very busy few weeks for me, and its good to take a weird ass trip out of things.