Hello all! Longime lurker but new member to the forum. I have been fermenting Amanita Muscaria for years now but I can't seem to find any information about it on here. I stumbled upon a scientific paper years ago when I was researching possible ingredients in soma and it spoke of muscimol production and no ibotenic acid in a fermentation broth in an identical process for making wine, except using amanita instead of yeast. Apparently the fungus also has a yeast like state and this is what prompted me to try it. The odor can be a little funky depending on your sugar source (I have been told my honey brew smells like vomit), but have had great results and experiences with this method. Grape and cherry juice have become my go tos for sugar sources lately but I was curious if anybody else out there is doing this? Also it was about 8 years ago I found the paper but I will see if I can find it again and post it on here.

Hi!

Are you sure it's the fungi that is acting as yeast and not just some wild yeast that rode along on the surface of the mushroom? Wild yeast is everywhere, and beer have been spontaneously fermented for centuries by just leaving the barrels sitting out. If Amanita Muscaria has the ability to break down sugar into alcohol, that would be amazingly cool.

It is producing muscimol not alcohol. I actually found a thread about it. https://www.dmt-nexus.me...aspx?g=posts&t=67932

I've made a little thread about it as well. You're very welcome to read and join the discussion.
link to the mentioned thread

I've done research in to the holy grail method some time ago. The core idea (according to my understanding) is indeed worth of pursuing and exploring. There are some flaws - because how the supposed author of the holy grail does it can easily bring many contaminants in. I've read long discussion about this approach on the web but I've never been able to find any conclusions about what actually happens, only some claims and stories and speculations.

There is actually a very simple way to do it, though I have not tried to perform it myself. What one should do IMO is to cultivate some mycelium from A. muscaria spores on agar plates. After achieving a clean culture on agar plates on would simply inoculate a nutrient rich solution with it via. liquid culture style. Basically it's the same as the holy grail idea with a major difference of starting the LC with clean inoculation material.

Holy crap! I'm greateful you are interested in this.
Amanita muscaria is a great entheogen. Really on of my favorites.
But!
Is really important that you prepare it properly.

It has iboteic acid.
It is assumed to be neurotoxic but from my experience I dont find it so.
The toxicity studies used very high doses and IV method of administration.
So this is by no means a well done study to determin that.
There exist the iboteic acid poisoning syndrom. That is basically you being into come till the effect wears off, along with nausea vomiting and so on.
But!
So

The usual method used to convert the iboteic acid to muscimol is decarboxilation.

Drying the amanita caps at 74ºC coverts roughly 30% of ibo to muscimol
Boiling it at low set coverts another 30% .
And finally letting it sit in a acidic medium for 2 days converts another 30%

So

Thats usually how i prepare it. And it grants you avoiding the nasty iboteic acid effects.
But i have to say that letting there be iboteic acid gives a different experience than getting rid of all of it.

So I like there to be some ibo in there. Thats merely personal preference.

When you convert all the ibo to muscimol the experience is more smooth.
Ibo is more stimulant like. Muscimol is more sleepish dreamy like.

Anyway

There is another method to converting all of the ibo to muscimol, and that is fermentation!
With lactobacilius.

I boil the amanitas with milk. I pass them throught a strainer and let the milk cool.
While it is still warm, I add greek yougurt. I make sure it has some lactobacilius bulgaricus in there. The original greek yougurt has it.

It needs to be added while it is warm so the bacteria can revive.

I let it then to be at room but rather warm temperature.

The studies say that this way 99% of the iboteic acid converts to muscimol.

I made a yougurt this way, and I have to say i felt 0 speediness related to iboteic acid.

Also amanita isnt usually a visual mushrom. But! When i took the yougurt, I went to sleep and saw a white bright light in the darkness. Barely noticeable but still there.
And pretty much didnt trip much.
It was really smooth.

Also i have to say that all the mushrooms i used for the yougurt were burnt while drying them, so they had decreased potency.

I want to repeat the experiment, but definitively the conversion is there, the difference in effects was there.

Great great mushroom.
Sleeping is great and vivid dreaming is present and enhanced.

Well, if you want to know all the details about this mushroom, there is a yt channel but because it was getting much censorship, the owner decided to make a site so she could upload all the content she wanted without any censor.
The channel is called amanita dreamer.
https://www.amanitadreamer.net/
Thats her site.
And she made a forum as well.
https://forum.amanitaresearch.com/

So there you will find all the info you need.

Enjoy!

Yes, thanks for correcting me. The fermentation methods I've seen for doing the conversion from iboteic acid to muscimol are using lactobacillus. If the fungi itself is able to operate as a yeast, that would be quite a discovery. I think Triglav's suggested approach is the best way of finding this out. Next time I come across some Amanitas I'm gonna give it a try myself!

Hello everybody! This is something I am interested in as well. I am quite fond of the Amanita Pantherina.

I have several thoughts/ questions.

1) Does anybody know what the neurotoxic level is for Ibotenic acid? I read through some research and it seems that the IBA is directly injected into the brains to lesion them. This is obviously not what is happening in humans lol. But that leads me to the next question:

2) Is Ibotenic Acid permeable to the blood brain barrier? If so, then considering the neurotoxicity may be important.

3) I am interested in making a resin that is then gel-capped and swallowed, hopefully bypassing the any off-tastes and nausea related with the mushroom. This would also making preparation and dosing much more convenient. There are several thoughts branching off of this:


RESIN PRODUCED WITH COMPLETE CONVERSION OF IBA TO MUSCIMOL:

Briefly, the idea here would be to do a 24 hour cold water soak of Pantherinas in the fridge, filter, and add to a fermenting culture. After letting the fermenting culture complete the conversion, it would again be strained, the liquid reduced to a resin with gentle heat, and the resin encapsulated. Now to the discussion:

- I am unsure of the stability of the final product of a Pantherina resin using a yogurt culture by storage at room temperature for fear contamination over time. Storing dairy products are room temperature for a long time just seems intuitively like it is not a good idea. (I recognize, however, that this could be prevented by freezing the encapsulated resin product.)

- Sourdough cultures use a mixture of lactobacilli and yeast. Perhaps this would be a good medium to ferment the product since it wouldn't contain any dairy product and could be considered more stable at room temperature for storage.



RESIN PRODUCED WITHOUT CONVERSION OF IBA TO MUSCIMOL:

- If indeed the neurotoxic effects of IBA are insignificant, then I would create a resin using vodka soaking the Pantherina, poured into a 9x13 pan, and evaporated with fans/ gentle heat.



4) While not a resin, this is an additional idea I had: making Kombucha with the the mushrooms present during the fermentation process. This is likely the closest replica to a non-alcoholic beer you could probably ever re-create. It would have the mouth-feel, fizziness, fermented flavor, and GABA binding properties just like beer.


5) Finally, my own input on Ibotenic Acid - I am hesitant to consume Ibotenic acid. I have heard anecdotal reports of people developing seizures after single heavy uses of this, which could be withdrawal from the high doses of GABA agonism, similar to an alcohol withdrawal. However, it seems unusual to me that a single high dose would cause this, just like a single binge doesn't cause alcoholic seizures.

Furthermore, in my own personal experience - I am not 100% certain if I developed some neurotoxic effect, or if I just became much more aware of a new dimension that I was not previously aware of. After the use of an ounce of Amanita Muscaria and an ounce of Amanita Pantherina (all were simmered with lemon juice) over the course of 2 months, I noticed trace visual effects while meditating for a couple months afterwards, similar but not as vivid to the some of the closed-eyed visuals when dosing the Amanitas. After about 4 months of abstinence, the effects seemed to have resolved.

Both of the above comments have additional explanations for their long-term effects as mentioned, but I still cannot rule out the possibility of Ibotenic Acid being the culprit for the undesired neurotoxic effects. I would appreciate any insights the community may provide.


Hopefully these 5 points of discussion generate some food for thought. I'd love to hear what you guys think!

There is a group (organization) that teaches people how to do this Amanita Wine tek, they call it Ambrosia, but it appears to have many names. Here is a video showing the tek with grape juice.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kj6d-UOeG24

Here is a link to their site for more info and a downloadable PDF. There appears to be a lot of info on the site.
http://ambrosiasociety.org/

hallo everyone
I'll like to start do Lacto Fermentation with yogurt of Amanita Muscaria, and i need any help, recipes ,methods ect.
Can anyone help me here ?

Try reading this post carefully:
https://www.dmt-nexus.me...mp;m=1100433#post1100433

If fermentation converts practically all the ibotenic acid, then there is also no need to dry the mushrooms, and fresh mushrooms can be used. I am considering this because perhaps the resulting yoghurt will be more active.

Yes. Also, if you boil the mushrooms in water in order to extract the ibotenic acid you're making a little bit of conversion to muscimol already - though the big majority is converted via fermentation.

Yoghurt culture is very much warmth loving therefore make sure to ferment warm. One could also use sour milk cultures for a 'room temperature' fermentation. In my experiment I used a bit of sauerkraut juice. It fermented nicely and besides the lactobacillus there was yeast also present in the fermentation.

Please report on your experiments dithyramb, I would love to hear about it!

Have a great day!

I don't know if I will be able to do the experiment in the near future, Triglav.

I am also curious from the perspective that fermentation of entheogenic brews normally results in a "spoiling of the spirit" for me. It is expected to be more sedative from being pure muscimol anyways. I would expect a heavier energy for sure. And yoghurt itself can be highly sedative for me. Perhaps it would be very good for sleep. As long as it does not bring fogginess to the afterglow, it is acceptable.

Let the microbes do the work.

What about an Amanita kombucha?