I thought this was a relevant read and I'm curious to hear what the Nexus thinks about it.

The Shipibo

The article goes well beyond the role the shipibo play in the ayahuasca universe, and the current surge of interest from the west. It paints a portrait of the shipibo and their psychology, and discusses the interaction between western and indigenous cultures. Nice food for thought.

Some quotes:

Having spent 3 months living amongs and with Shipibo I would say the blog is fairly accurate but also selective persecuting. Each sentence that can clearly be seen as slander starting out with "The Shipibo blah blah blah", could and should be replaced by the words ," peoples of impoverished and exploited areas across the world..."

Its not just Shipibo doing these things its the vast majority of culture clashed indigenous groups. I don't think its fair to single out the Shipibo the way the writer has.

Its always pretty easy to point the finger from the safety of your country of origin and skin color in this world. Whats the saying? Walk a mile in another persons shoes? Sure comes to mind after reading this. Maybe walk a mile in an other cultures shoes would be even better.

I didn't really feel he was being selective persecuting. He's talking about the shipibo in particular but he extrapolates to the whole indigenous culture, particularly in the end. I don't recall seeing any claims that the shipibo are an exception. They are used as an example.

Actually this article increased my sympathy for the shipibo since it made me understand a little better indigenous peoples in general.

..thank you for the article Vodsel..

people are people (whatever race, tribe etc) complete with faults..

the thing about Shipibo (and other indigenous) cultures is the knowledge and ethics that are preserved within their culture..even if not all individuals uphold this..
our modern culture has become very distant from the direct plant teacher connection, and we are the poorer for it..hence many seek what they can from cultures with older unbroken traditions..
.

It's fairly accurate but I felt its a bit general. The author says that shipibos lie and that's a big generalization. It's not a bad blog nor wrong just felt the wording should be improved to firstly be more accurate and secondly less offensive. If you were shipibo his do you imagine you would feel after reading this?

^..there is a touch of the condescending about it...
but most anthropological works are like that unless someone really goes and lives with and becomes a part of the tribe..

and 'prone and back-stabbing' are part of all cultures...
so, yeah, the author does come from a fairly distanced perspective..

I wonder what this author would have to say going to any other tribe... Great insight but this makes me think of something.

perspective

There is an old story about two dogs. They both go into the same room. The first dog comes out of the room wagging it's tale, happy as can be. The second dog comes out snarling, tail between it's legs and looking very mean. An old elder see's this from outside and is drawn to the mystery of what was inside this room that could give off such a different reaction.

The room was full of mirrors. Where the first dog who was happy going into the room, saw only other happy dogs making him even happier. The other dog was in a bad mood and only saw other angry dogs when he entered the same room making him more and more angry.

perspective is everything

I don't believe it is possible for us to truly understand tribal people who still have strong ties to their ancestral culture/ways/beliefs etc. I use the word tribal because "indigenous" is a stupid and divisive term really for this context. If any human is indigenous than we are all indigenous, obviously.

..but for us to actually understand to the point where we see through they're eyes..well it would require some kind of reset button, which I don't think exists. We just don't understand. Anything said in the wake of that (failed) attempt to fully understand is just outside interpretation. We all know how outside interpretation goes..just look at the bible.

There is no reset button for us. The best we can do is try to see something different today. Power plants can help us with that..and IMO are essential. There is no yoga..no meditation etc in my view that can take that place. We need to speak to the planet again..and we need to do it from the context of our own creation, so we can truly own it. Only then can we stand beside these other peoples as equals and understand the importance of the vision they hold, reguardless of weather or not we can see it. When our own vision speaks truth than we will understand why such things as personal and subjective as they may be are worth protecting..even if you have to lie to do so.

A culture based around an economy like this is based on lies. Of course anyone who is forced to exist within in's rules is going to learn how you nagivate within it. Most people do it, reguardless of how often they like to think they don't. Ever shopped at walmart? Where do you think all that crap that sustains us comes from? It's all based on lies and exploitation..and we like other people have just been colonized and forced into it. We just set ourselves aside from that fact and pretend we are somehow different.

I don't know if the author's perspective is really that "distanced". Sure, maybe a lot of what he said could apply to other tribal cultures...but he's not writing about those. If I write an article on a certain group of musical composers, one could argue that much of what I would write could extend to many other groups of composers, but they wouldn't be the subject of my article, just as the other tribes were not the subject of this one.

Does he? He mentions in his blog he lives and works in the peruvian Amazon, having spent a long time in Iquitos and moving to Pucallpa two years ago. You hardly can ask a non-native to spend a longer time in the place as a requirement to write about the native people.

But the author himself said the blog entry would be controversial, never mind the links he threw in as a reminder of her knowledge and utmost respect and sympathy for the amazonian people.

Edit: Regardless, I was not interested about any judgement to the shipibo per se, but the reasons and workings behind their way to interact with the western culture. It's a somewhat dramatic result of what the "civilization" has done to them, and in any case, way less dramatic than what's happening for instance with the guaranis.

As far as anthropological works go, I think it's a fairly shoddy piece. Some people have already voiced some of the major issues I see with his claims about Shipibo actions/perceptions of the world. The main problem with a lot of these statements is that they are made without the inclusion of any cultural analysis or cultural context.

I won't diverge on what you (vodsel) have labelled a tangent, and will instead try to engage with your point of interest, "the reasons and workings behind their way to interact with the western culture."

First, I would like to state that I think it would be better framed "the reasons and workings behind their way of reacting to industrial culture." Imo, 'interaction' implies a more egalitarian relationship than can ever be present between colonizer/colonized...and the 'western' signifier becomes particularly troublesome when we are in the Western Hemisphere, dealing with differences that appear mainly between the Global North and South. Semantics or not, I feel they're points that should be considered.

There are a few things that immediately stood out to me in this piece...but I'll try to avoid my usual verbosity so as to maintain focus.


Oh, really?


Is this different? Do we not see this attitude espoused by many "respectable" members of the business community within the industrial/capitalist mindset? It seems to me, we have a good argument for saying that "they get it"...'it' being the logic of capitalism.


Further evidence that "they get it." All of this is perfectly logical within a capitalist framework. Hell, imo, you could play these scenarios out using game theory, and I bet you'd find that the shipibo are making the "right" choices within the logic of capitalism. With extractive industries decimating the land, these are the tools for survival in this new and rapidly shifting landscape. The statements made here seem no different from the statements that could be made about numerous marginalized and dominator communities within industrial contexts.

Now, here's a point that encapsulates some of the problematic components of the piece as well as the the "reaction to industrial culture."

This is a rather disparaging way of presenting an otherwise valid concept, imo.

Capitalism seeks to fold every piece of reality into itself. This is why you can't just "unplug" from capitalism. Whenever a group finds space "outside" of capitalism, the mechanisms and institutions of state and capital work to incorporate the "outside" into the "inside". Take, for example, autonomous subsistence farmers who are forced to give up their land (read: way of life) and move to cities as the result of industrial monocultures and/or subsidized cash crops.

When the "natural" ways of sustaining ourselves are usurped by capitalism, what choice do we have for survival, other than attempting to use components of the capitalist framework? Whether this is squatting, dumpster diving, stealing from work, or obtaining funds from tourists and NGO's, what's the difference?

This is not a choice freely made by the indigenous...this is a choice between death and survival, forced on these people by the barrel of a gun (or really, the collective munitions of industrial civilization). There is no decision to "hunt money," there is only the drive to survive...and in this case, the viable channel is through the capitalist paradigm that is stripping away any alternative.

<>Side Rant<>
This is why it's not enough for folks from industrial contexts to eschew aya tourism. This is why it's not enough to give money to NGOs. This is why it's not enough to sign petitions. This is why it's not enough to vote for new rulers or pray for new legislation or whatever other form of reform you can imagine. Until you are attacking capital and its effects where you live these horror stories will continue to unfold.
<>End Rant<>

I have avoided touching on the purely ad hominem that seem to have little to do with an actual cultural analysis (such as what nen quoted), because they don't seem to engage with the focal question of the reaction of the indigenous to industrial civ. But, I would pose the question, as food for thought...why are these present in the piece? What purpose do they serve?

Finally (sigh...sorry for the novella) some points about the concluding caveats:


The irony in the author making this statement after pinpointing the "noble savage" mentality as problematic would be amusing if it were not so sad.

What is special about the indigenous people? Is not industrial civilization (or materialist culture) just as toxic for all other peoples? Is it not "physically destroying [OUR] natural environment via large-scale, extractive industries"? Is it not "ruining [OUR] health through the aggressive marketing of...fast food"? Is it not "mentally conditioning [US] to [Industrial/Capitalist] modes of thinking"? Is it not emotionally creating a sense of inferiority [in US] and spiritually undermining and denigrating [OUR personal worldviews]?

There is nothing special about the toll that industrial civ is taking on the indigneous people around the world. It is exacting the same atrocities it exacts on us, perhaps on a greater magnitude, given their proximity to their landbases. The setting is different, the history is different, the landbase is different, sure. But the methods, mechanisms, and frameworks are the same. Their struggle is, or at the very least should be, our struggle, as they are some of the most visible examples of what the industrial capitalist paradigm is doing to the planet and the organisms that live on it.

As to the second caveat...
Smash Patriarchy
Women and children are also corrupted by patriarchy. Women simply do not gain any power from it, rather they are subjugated to internalized/interpersonal destruction.

You're going to have to work with men to some degree to dismantle the system in which they receive so much privilege. You're also going to have to work against men. Saying that you should only work with women and children is an oversimplification of things. Patriarchy takes a toll across the gender spectrum, even while privileging the "male". That doesn't mean all men support it, even if they all benefit from it in some way. There are entire tomes on this, so that's all I'll put here.

Against State and Capital,
Snozz

Thank you very much Snozz for your reply. You do bring out the hammer an hit a few nails square in the the head.




Perfectly put. This is actually very close to what I thought after reading the piece, the major difference being that you target capitalism as system, and that is more precise... changing your ethics becomes an adaptation, not a cunning plan.



The author is wrong in calling the fact they are "liars" a "human vice", but I think that's as far as the ad hominem goes. I don't think there's a purpose but rather insufficient analysis, or perhaps he fails to realize that his own judgement is partially assimilated, and doesn't see how present is the lie in his/our culture.



Personally I did not finish reading the piece with the feeling that the author had labeled the shipibo as relatively problematic, but looks like almost everyone here found more condescending (or contemptuous) the author than I did. Maybe it's because the source where I got the link from is seldom going to share opinions defaming indigenous peoples, and that made me put on certain glasses.



I totally understand your appeal for local action and agree with it, but I think it makes sense to build a special case around indigenous people. We (citizens in capitalist countries) share responsibility for the fact this system is running amok. Most of us receive our crumbs (no matter how shitty) and either us or our elders are responsible for what's going on. The shipibo and others hardly are.

This is a blind parasite swarming a host, and the shipibo country, both them and their world, is a mostly unscathed piece of flesh. The teachings we can get from them (or the lost memories) are particularly precious.

Snozzleberry as usual you make bullet proof points and back them up with your understanding of the perverse capitalist system that no cultures can evade even if the wanted. Your reply sums up many of my feelings as well as my own reply that was briefer than I would have written had I not been on a phone.

As is most issues it's never as black and white as the blogger describes therefore I defend the claims that this essay is pretty empty and didn't really address the root cause but instead painted the shipibo on a poor offensive manner.

Thanks for the positive feedback, I'm glad to be a part of the discussion


Oh no no no, that's not what I meant (I don't think)
I think you misunderstand what I'm saying.

The author states earlier that:

I'm not saying that he's saying that Shipibo are problematic. Almost the opposite. I'm saying that after the author (rightly) denounces the concept of the noble savage, he then presents the predicament of the indigenous as worse than the plight of all of humanity on spaceship earth.

The reason that I understand him to be presenting things in this light (and I very well could be wrong) is that he consciously or unconsciously is attributing some of that same noble savage mentality to the Shipibo...that they are in a "special" position where they are now facing a fall from grace (a fall from nobility if you will) where their noble lifestyle is being decimated (and should be privileged) as distinct and "other" from the predicament of humans in industrial contexts.

We are all under the barrels of their guns. I didn't ask for it any more than any of the indigenous folks. My life is already controlled in the ways that they are seeking to control the indigenous. That said, what makes fracking the indigenous lands in canada any different than the fracking they're proposing in my backyard? When I see the indigenous canadians burning cop cars and forcing military forces out of their protest camps, I see a mirror image of the struggle in my back yard (albeit, no cop cars have been burned here, to date).

The meaningful difference, to me, is the ecological biodiversity and perhaps some of the cultural components in these regions, when compared with the developed area I live in. But, imo, if anything should be privileged, it's the landbase. The struggle is important, but not because something truly unique is happening to indigenous communities. The sterilization/genocide of the indigenous is connected to the sterilization/genocide of minority populations in "developed" countries. These are different vectors of the same strain of White Supremacy playing out around the world. The loss of culture is beyond tragedy, but no moreso than when it happens in any developed region.

Does that make more sense? Sorry if I poorly articulated that initially.



Disclaimner: If this next bit is overly impassioned, it's only because it's how I feel, and it's not directed at anyone within this discussion

I too think that it makes sense to build a special case around indigenous people, if only because they are situated within some of the last biodiverse regions in the world. But lest you put a burden on us that I don't think we deserve, I did not create this system, nor did my ancestors. My lineage had no say in creating an industrial capitalist paradigm, and some actively resisted. Capitalism isolates...it atomizes...it breaks us down and makes us feel powerless, tells us that we are to blame for the ecological catastrophe even though we are not. The vast majority of the resources that are being used are being used by corporations and militaries.

To reiterate, I would challenge your assertion that we all share responsibility for this system. Hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of people have taken to the streets around the world over the past decades. They have been suppressed by military and paramilitary forces. Activists have been assassinated on every inhabited continent. Resistance is fertile, but it is also being fought, tooth and nail by the dominant culture. The reason being that this hierarchical system and the forces in place to sustain it exist to protect and enrich a tiny minority. Nobody wants their landbase despoiled. If people were given the option to say no, they would. But if people said "No", there would be no profit and those at the top would lose their privilege and power. As such, they impose their will by force.

There are people who only subsist on the crumbs of this system. There are people who eek out livings working service or other menial jobs, living paycheck to paycheck. These people do not have a say in changing this system through the established channels. In fact, it's pretty simple to argue that the established channels are there to staunch real change. The venues available to them are the first venues denounced in the mainstream media. Homeless people involved in Occupy were openly mocked by politicians and pundits alike as, "Using the cover of politics to camp in spaces they otherwise would not have been allowed to." Such class-based society allows this statement to be viewed as valid by numerous consumers of media, even though homelessness is a major political, social, and economic issue...and who better to speak out and take action about it than those living it?

The people who run the corporations and states that are controlling the destructive machinery are responsible. The scientists who do the research that creates genetic monstrosities and leads to toxins being pumped into our environment are responsible. The bureaucrats and techies, the military and paramilitary forces, the people working in extractive industries are culpable.

The people killing the planetary ecosystems have names and addresses. I know that such a statement and the action it belies is too militant for many in this community, but I don't see this system stopping of its own volition.

We are not the privileged controllers of this system. They are not us. We must act against these oppressive and destructive systems on every plane that exists to us. Personally, I am not from South America. I do not know the cultural or political landscape there...I am an outsider. I would never be so presumptive as to insert myself into their struggle without there being a long list of things that would need to have happened to put me in such a position.

My place for resistance is where I live, fighting against what I know. The struggle is interconnected, no doubt. This system is spreading its tendrils around the world and it needs to be eradicated in its entirety, anywhere it attempts to take hold. Some areas may appear to be more tantalizing loci of resistance (such as the Amazon), but we have to fight where we stand. I believe that anything less will fail.

Completely. And I don't think it was a bad articulation on your part, it was probably my glasses again.



It actually depends on how wide and deep do you allow your lineage to go. Surely lots among us are actively resisting one way or another (although not so many do actively fight back) but most of us are enjoying commodities that directly or indirectly are ill-gotten. Infrastructures, technology. Aren't these crumbs as well? That might not make us responsible, but puts us in a position of debt. By "us" I don't mean us discussing this here, but to our social mass, including scientists, journalists, bureaucrats, law enforcement and CEOs.

Your posterior reasoning of why it's precise to act locally makes good sense to me; I don't mean to suggest going to the Amazon in order to become an activist... But it's clear we have to re-define our interaction (both action and reaction) with the tribal cultures, and that asks for one big look to ourselves as much as to them.

I'd like to figure out a good critique of our judgements when we look at people like the shipibo. Know where do these judgements come from, the good and the bad, and come to terms with them. Be as honest as possible. Then maybe we'll be in good shape for asking honesty in return as well.

There's some psychological burden difficult to shake off, assuming you have the intention to evolve instead of coiling around it. Guilt complex dripping from colonialism, mostly. I'm for instance spanish. And never proud of it, not just because nationalist pride never made any sense to me, but because we're full of genes shared with a bunch of sick barbaric zealots.

Many years ago I learned one grand-grand-(...)-grandfather of mine had been a slave trader in the Philippines. In the end he was cut to pieces in a mutiny, but never mind the happy ending. And I heard this in a conversation a few hours after having to run in an anti-war demonstration. Of course you do dissociate both, but eventually you start wondering pretty seriously how much of the city you walk on was built on human bones.

So as a society we are also in the process of integrating that. Apply to many countries in the northern hemisphere.



Yup.

But let's keep in mind that the indigenous causes often work as a gateway outlet for activism - they are good to stir people up and make them respond, since they are a very stark example of what's going on. Tribal cultures that are more able than us to understand the universe symbolically, spiritually, are giving us a symbol with their situation. Even if it was the last thing they gave us, it's a powerful myth in the making and should be our job as well to help hard-headed people receive the message. Then hopefully they can start tying up loose ends.

..ok, maybe 'condescending' is a too strong a word...
i guess it's the generalisation of 'them' ('they' this or that etc.) that made me slightly uncomfortable..the idea that they are some uniform block..i think in any tribe you have a range of attitudes, ethics, behaviours etc..from alcoholism to shamanism..a culture's knowledge/laws/mythos etc are not bourne out by every individual..
small point...good discussion..
.

Yes and no, I think. If you and I stopped utilizing these crumbs, the machinery of industrial capitalism would hum along just fine. This is why I made the point about corporations and militaries being the largest "consumer entities" earlier. Even if we all individually stopped participating in consumer economies (a ludicrous proposal offered by some in appeal to their perceived consumer guilt, despite the fact that it will never be reality) there is decent evidence to show that it would be a small dent in the actual use of planetary resources.

Voting with your dollars is for people with dollars. Many people in this world do not have dollars in a real sense...in a sense where it has meaningful impact. The most successful economic campaigns against large-scale corporations have not been cases where people boycotted purchasing, but those where activists made doing business with these corporations economically nonviable. See: the SHAC campaign.

I don't think we really disagree on this point, I just think that we should absolve ourselves of much of the blame/guilt that this society puts on us with regards to ecological catastrophe. We can use the master's tools to dismantle the master's house, and we don't have to feel guilty about doing so...they'd be making the tools whether or not we picked them up.


This is exactly what I'm talking about. We also have to recognize that this guilt is manipulated against us in modern contexts (e.g. green capitalism).


I think the sad reality is, all of it, eh?


Some folks are...other folks resist integration. Possibly because it's too painful to acknowledge? Or they have too much to lose (positions of power/privilege/wealth) within this current paradigm to make acknowledgement/integration desirable.


I agree with the sentiment (I think), but allow me to be critical of some of the syntax.

I think it's important that we not cast this as them "giving us a symbol with their situation." I think it's better framed as dominant culture creating a catastrophic situation that has strong symbolic resonance with some people in industrial contexts. It's not a gift to be given, but a dire situation manufactured by dominators' ways of life.

That said, as I have heard from the mouth's of people engaged in indigenous resistance and indigenous solidarity, don't just talk about it, be about it. It has to be more than a symbol, it has to be more than a cause for which we wear t-shirts or post social media updates about. This goes back to the fighting where you stand in this interconnected web of resistance.


Well said nen, I couldn't agree more.

It's like when news pundits talk about "American Interests" as though everyone from janitors to CEOs have the same vested interests, positions, values, etc.

"most of us are enjoying commodities that directly or indirectly are ill-gotten. Infrastructures, technology. Aren't these crumbs as well? That might not make us responsible, but puts us in a position of debt. By "us" I don't mean us discussing this here, but to our social mass, including scientists, journalists, bureaucrats, law enforcement and CEOs."

When the people who are really responsible, start taking action than the rest of us can follow suit. Until then we are all just people who have been colonized, removed from out lands(like other "indigenous" peoples) and are being ruled by force under a fascist regime. It just happened to us farther back so we think we are a part of the colonization. I never colonized anyone/anywhere though..which is why that statement by the author about people who say that came off sounding semi naïve to me. Really..how am I any different from a local native man down the raod from me forced onto the little dot of land the call a "reserve"?..other than that the first nations peoples are still afforded some tiny scrap of recognition as "indigenous"? Colonization is colonization..ruled by force is ruled by force. There is no getting around it. I want all the same things the first nations peoples want..and given a choice I think most people do. We are all being fucked as a collective.. There is the dominators/colonizers and us. It's divisive and at a certain point I do draw the line between us and them. I know where that line is, and it seperates the terrorists with names and addresses who have the power to change things and don't(and hire terrorist groups to enforce they're dominance), and the rest of us who are forced into submission.

I fail to see how I am a terrorist.

True. But the crumbs we have received, or keep receiving, are not only by-products of the big business. We stole patrimony and resources in the past and largely built our places with it. This does not invalidate your argument at all, but helps to put a better perspective if we are to absolve ourselves.

Or maybe it's just one way among others of getting there... you recognize you are in debt, maybe at first you're fooled about it, then you realize what you were doing in order to make up for it is not working (aka debunking green capitalism), and that helps you understand the cogs and wheels of the machine better. And once that happens, you may see one does not simply try to shield someone else who is under heavy fire - if you really want to help, you will aim for the machine itself.

That's why I said they could be seen as an symbol (for awakening), and that we can be thankful again for the lessons they teach. I didn't want to romanticize the amazonian struggle, or to dismiss others, but once you have looked their way, or been there, it's hard not to invest some of the momentum you received in work, and you cannot forget some revelations. Surely you could have received them closer to your home, and hopefully you will work in the right direction, but to many a jaguar will stay more effective than a local wolf in order to raise concerns about the global poacher.



Yes, it's virtually impossible to be fair when talking about collectives unless you throw in a lot of exceptions and considerations.

Many discussions approach somewhat of an equilibrium once the point shifts towards the meaning the participants give to one key concept. Then often everyone acknowledges the gap, or agrees to disagree, or end up polishing their arguments, including all the required caveats and commentaries to acknowledge the other point of view. The discussion hits a language wall, or a conceptual wall, and to go behind it you would need to build new concepts.

Maybe this topic would need new concepts. Concepts able to avoid the generalizations nen was pointing at. Because we can trace all the cultural, geographical, even historical boundaries we want between the shipibo and the non-shipibo, but there's many other areas where we melt with them, and then there's not an "us" and "them". More like jamie said,



I never implied that. But it's a fact our european-american society is in historical debt particularly to Africa and Latin America. We could choose to keep our memory of that or not, but the vast majority among us has reaped benefits from the plunder, in the form of opportunities, or simply because around here it's easier to learn and communicate online around hobbies, interests and (hopefully) initiatives. Of course that does not make you and me terrorists. But a good sense of justice can be a powerful aid in activism of any kind.

"I never implied that. But it's a fact our european-american society is in historical debt particularly to Africa and Latin America. We could choose to keep our memory of that or not, but the vast majority among us has reaped benefits from the plunder, in the form of opportunities, or simply because around here it's easier to learn and communicate online around hobbies, interests and (hopefully) initiatives. Of course that does not make you and me terrorists. But a good sense of justice can be a powerful aid in activism of any kind."

I never thought that you implied this. I do however see this as terrorism, and to be associated with that would make us terrorists as well..which I don't really agree with..we have simply been carried along as prisoners in it's wake. That, I can do nothing about..and I am able to accept that, instead of living a life of self hatred..and instead I seek to honor my ancestors who were slaughtered and rounded up and colonized. Our debt is to them as much as anyone else, for we are the only ones who can stand up and bring honor back to our lineage.

Putting the past out of our memory is not the same thing. My ancestors committed the same crimes of genocide and ethnocide that the romans committed against them. This is how it happens..you colonize a people, you stamp out all culturally relevant ideas, ban the language, remove them from they're land so that they have nowhere to go but where you put them, and then you steel the childen you make them work for you. You make perfect, confused slaves who lack any relevant context to where they are in relation to where they have been.

I have to live in the shadow of my ancestors. I know this too well. As someone who has spent a great deal of time interested in "indigenous" peoples, studying native American traditions both on my own and academically, and have felt first hand the anger and resentment of these peoples. I know what it is like to experience reverse racism..and be told I have no right to complain about it or feel oppressed because I am "not native". I have experience both the burden that my ancesors beared, the burden we now face living in the shadow of they're own confused evils, while simultaneously empathizing(and feeling guilty) with the first nations peoples, only fueling my hated of this society.

However, unless you are suggesting I actually have some more of an ability to change things than a random native American man born into this society of my same age, I am going to disagree with you. We are both just two people at this point, born into neo colonialism. What debt is it that I could ever repay them?

What debt is it that I owe them?..and how does it stand up taller than the debt the current line of terrorists owe to ALL of us? terrorism is terrorism. Are we all to be suddenly guilty by random association(in this case by birth relation alone)? This is equal to claiming that all people of german birth owe a debt to the jews for the holocaust. We know who was responsible for the holocaust..just as we know the people responsible for the continuation of colonialism and terrorism have names and addresses, and I sure as hell know I am not one of them.

What I owe, to both the first nations peoples, and to my ancestors to heal they're past, is my allegiance to them. When the line is drawn, I know who's side I will be on. Because I know who is right.