Ok... I thought that this Might require its own thread...
SWIM wants to recommend the snuffing of HBWR seeds. One or two seeds Ground up fine (SWIM used a finger nail file for maximum sinus coverage... Swim has done this a number of times... insulflating 1-2 seeds obtained from basement shaman, high quality seeds from what SWIM hears from others. Swim has never ingested them because Swim does not like the nausea SWim got from morning glories... so when swim was advised at an entheogen conference to snuff them... swim jumped on it...
no nausea, lower dosage... no real sinus pain so to speak... long duration... POWERFUL effects. total immersion into OEV AND CEV.
SWIM comes to think of this state as dreaming awake... the edative effects and intoxication are strong... SWIM could just sit there and watch it all but could not really interact with the space... there where spirits... human and animal interacting with SWIM but SWIM could not really interact back just kinda silently watch. A bit of Keef was smoked each time to increase effects... oh and does it ever... but it really increases the sedative effects even more along with the visionary effects...

SWIM wishes to figure out how to manifest a more stimulating Snuff with HBWR seeds... SWIM is wondering how one would do this... no extraction seems to be nessecary with snuffing them. there is no nausea at all... so no problem. No extraction TEK is needed ( i know you guys love your crystals but if it aint broke why fix it?) So...
A mentholated HBWR seed snuff would be splendid indeed... SWim LOVES menthol tobacco snuff ( especially the raspberry menthol mmmmm) So snuffing peppermint infused seeds would be a lovely experience...
So how would one do this...
converting the snuff from LSA to LSH? could it be done with out doing an extraction. Swim has read that 69rons FOAF drinks the seeds in peppermint tea and that seems to work. is the heat of the tea having an effect? along with the peppermint?

Here is SWIMS proposed Idea...
-Take 1/2 teaspoon of Ethanol mix with one drop of peppermint oil (organic pure peppermint oil).
-Heat oil infused ethanol until warm in a hot water bath.
-add peppermint infused ethanol to six ground/finely powdered seeds of HBWR and allow to cool and evaporate.
-once snuff is evaporated divide into three equal piles.
-put pile number one on a nice decorative plate with meaningful patterns of what ever spirits you align your self with... and snuff with hollowed out bone found from a tree an eagles nest is in...
-get lots of work done... commune with spirits of your ancestors... make agreements with local deities and gain insight on how to make the world a better place... viola...
-save other two doses of snuff for freinds or patients in healing practice... place snuff in freezer for storage.

See if this works for yah... if any one has any insights into this or making it work let SWim know...

THis could also work with Rivea Corymbosa (Turbina Corymbosa...
Ololiuqui snuff... or Coaxihuitl snuff...
I am not sure the potency of these seeds in comparison to HBWR seeds... having to snuff more seeds would not be pleasant... but there may be differences that would be worth exploring...

a bit on the subject of acetylated peppermint oil...
taken from here...
http://chestofbooks.com/...ls-Vol1/Acetylation.html

Boy, you’d really not want to attempt to snort undiluled LSA crystals. The amount needed would be so tiny, you could very easily overdose on it if you weren’t careful.



Yes. You just need an acidic environment (about pH 4), LSA, water, and acetaldehyde. You don’t need isolated LSA or isolated acetaldehyde. Just putting the powdered seeds in sherry wine in the refrigerator overnight will do the trick.



The heat is just making the LSA come out better, that’s all. It has nothing to do with the process and is actually not so good because it causes some of the acetaldehyde to evaporate, but because there’s a ton of it present in the peppermint tea it doesn’t matter much that a lot of it evaporates away. It would be better to do it in the refrigerator overnight with a cold extraction.



Sounds great except I believe LSH cannot exist in dry form without protection of some sort. I believe it will decompose into LSA and acetaldehyde if its dried. But maybe that’s not accurate.

Give it a try and see. Just know that acetaldehyde evaporates away at room temperature so it’s always best to perform any acetaldehyde procedures in the refrigerator.

Acetylation is actually not related to this process. Acetylation is the process of adding acetic acid (vinegar is diluted acetic acid) to another molecule such as converting psilocin (4-HO-DMT) into 4-AcO-DMT or bufotenine (5-HO-DMT) into 5-AcO-DMT by reacting it with acetic acid anhydride.

The LSA to LSH process involves adding acetaldehyde to LSA. It’s totally different.

ah thanks ron!
makes sense...
we shall see if it works or not.

So soaking it in sherry over night has worked for SWIY?
one wonders if using a nasal spray would be effective?

im sorry i had to post this i was looking to see if maybe a neti pot would work... and found this... i laughed so hard i pooped my pants...

SWIM has not tried sherry, but others say it works very well.

SWIM used rum and citric acid and that works very well.

SWIM prefers peppermint oil. He doesn’t much like alcohol.

Some info you might be interested in.

Acetaldehyde chemical properties

interesting thanks!

Notice that the boiling point of acetaldehyde is 21 °C (69.8 F). That's room temperature. So that's why it’s best to perform reactions with acetaldehyde in the refrigerator in a solution to ensure it doesn't all boil away.

If it's in water or alcohol, it takes longer for it to escape at room temperature because it tends to stay trapped in the solution rather than boil away rapidly, much like carbon dioxide bubbles in sodas like Coke or Pepsi. Reactions even in hot peppermint tea will work, but the reaction needs to be quick, so it’s best to use pre-extracted LSA when using hot tea. At room temperature in water or alcohol, it will eventually all boil away if given enough time, but in the refrigerator it will not.

I would like to see an LSH snuff recipe perfected. That would be awesome if it’s possible for LSH to stay in dry form somehow. Or maybe a sublingual tincture would be just as effective?

SWIM just chews on about 9 seeds with some peppermint in his mouth..and then after 20 minutes spits everything out..

this is..DO NOT SWALLOW ANYTHING..it will give you a stomach ache..not your spit..not the seeds..NOTHING

SWIM does a special LSA specific double A/B extraction on the seeds. That effectively gets rid of the toxins. If you can extract DMT, you can extract LSA, but it’s a slightly different process.

You extract with boiling acetone. Evaporate that, then dissolve in water and you do 8 defats with DCM to get rid of most of the toxins.

You then freebase at pH 9 with sodium carbonate. Then during the freebase stage you cannot do any water washes or you’ll lose product (just like with mescaline). You extract 5 times with DCM. Then distill off most of the DCM, until down to about 25 ml.

Then extract with dilute hydrochloric acid or vinegar. Then defat again about 3 times with DCM.

Then freebase at pH 9 and extract with DCM 5 times. Then distill off most of the DCM, until down to about 25 ml and let the rest evaporate to get fairly pure freebase LSA and some other alkaloids.


At that point it's a good idea to salt it with hydrochloric acid and let it all evaporate. Then make a 50:50 glycerin:water tincture out of the alkaloids, and add vitamin C to it to preserve the alkaloids. Such a product produces no stomach upset at all (unless you OD on it).

damn dude..SWIM has a lot to learn

qualitatively though with the bioassy wise I wonder if the effects of jorkests sublingual method is just as effective as an extraction...
SWIM has to say though that snuffing One finely ground seed was enough to blaze SWIM and another one for swims FOAF was enough to keep us going for 10 hours... it was so damn strong snuffing the seeds is unbelievable... and well super economic. SWIM has some around here some where if not swim will ust have to find some... but SWIM thinks that either peppermint oil in alchohol extract or soaked or wetted in sherry and then snuffed while still slightlywet would do the trick...
I mean one seed... snuffed... it doesnt even hurt... SWIM snuffs tobacco SWIM preffers it to any other method of ingestion and snuffing that hurts worse then this... but its really strong... if the conversion to LSH is effective in making it more stimulant... well good god... that would be revolutionary....... HBWR seed would be incredbile...
SWIM had a dream years ago of a Polynesian ritual rite of passsage ceremony that included HBWR seeds... the young would go into a burial pit... and eat the seeds and stay in there all night long... it was very itneresting... all of the young people were so happy and proud to die... ritually awith the seeds...

Maybe if used within a few days dry LSH will still be ok.

It’s a known fact that in the seeds, fresh seeds have the most LSH and are the most stimulating and most psychedelic. It’s also a known fact that as they age, they become more sedating, and the LSH degrades into LSA and acetaldehyde.

The fresh seeds don't contain much water, but maybe the little water they do contain helps keep the LSH for a while until they dry out?

Try it out. A small bottle of peppermint flavoring in the baking section of a grocery store is pretty cheap and abundant in acetaldehyde. It normally just contains 90-95% ethanol and peppermint oil. It's perfect. Just soak the ground seed in maybe 1/4 of a teaspoon or more of the peppermint flavoring and then put it out to dry. Try it dry. It might work as is.

Give it a shot. You've got nothing to lose. If it doesn't work, you'll at least get an LSA trip out of it. But if it works, you’ll be a very happy camper

SWIM did the sherry wine thing. Worked great, had a very visual and psychedelic trip. But he ended up purging anyways, and let me tell ya, purging sherry wine through your mouth and nostrils is a horrible experience.

SWIM may have to work on this snuffing bit..SWIM found lsh to be extremely nice...especially with a splash of dmt...maybe he will take some vasodilators and smoke some bufotenine on it..may turn out wicked sweet

I like the sound of this snuff business

I want to go back to Jorkest's idea about just keeping it in your mouth. So it would be something like grinding 8-10g of morning glory, comebining that with a little water/vodka/peppermint oil and swishing it in my mouth for half an hour. If it won't make me throw up, that sounds perfect.