Hello!

Quick question here about heart palpitations (i.e. uncomfortable awareness of the heart beating) and psychedelics. I've been very aware of my heartbeat since I was around 13 - it abrubtly began one night and never really stopped. After a trip to my GP, then to the nearest hospital, my EKG/X-ray/blood pressure/pulse rate all came back normal and I was sent home again. After a while of the continued awareness I put the cause of this down to anxiety, and I was able to ignore it.

This all changed when drugs came on the scene, specifically psychedelics... For some reason whilst tripping (generally on the come-up and come-down) I become incredibly anxious about my heart (I can literally see it beating through my clothes). It's odd because mentally I feel so peaceful and euphoric, but my heart says the opposite. Obviously I'm not asking for medical advice here, I've been told my heart is fine, I was just wondering if anyone has any experience with anxiety/over-awareness of the body and how to possibly overcome this? I feel like I can never quite let myself go and relax into the experience, it's like my ego is screaming "if you let go of me your heart is going to explode!". Sounds mad I know, but it's very distracting

Anyways, if anyone can offer any advice that'd be lovely! Many thanks guys!

Peace

I get heart palps too, mostly with some strains of red wine (and GHB use in the past)
On Psy's it goes mental and is a real put off/worry..

Have you looked into allergies? Or diet?

I worry very much about the same things. If you are really determined to continue with psychedelics you need to find a way to really KNOW you're gonna be OK. I would strongly advise the following:

1) Get a cardiac stress test, from a cardiologist. This will tell you for sure whether your heart perhaps has some rhythm problems when you're under stress, etc.

2) AFTER the cardiologist gives you the OK, take up some serious aerobic conditioning (and don't forget that "intervals" are the key to efficient aerobic improvement). Get to the point where you can really put some exercise pressure on yourself, and you're feeling very fit, etc.

At that point you will KNOW that you don't have to worry about your heart during trips, so you can learn/train yourself not to worry about it.

EDIT: I should add that you don't need to discuss psychedelic use with the cardiologist. Just tell him sometimes you feel "heart palpitations" when you get anxious, and you want to take up some aerobic conditioning, and you want to be absolutely sure about your exercise tolerance before you do. Any sensible cardiologist would agree with your interest in having a stress test, and wouldn't need to ask any further questions.

There is, of course, propranolol. But that is potentially a somewhat tricky drug, and if you DO happen to have some underlying rhythm problem you DON'T want to be fooling around with off-label uses of drugs that affect heart rhythm!

Ahh I feel your pain man.

I've never had any allergy problems as far as I'm aware (maybe mild hayfever...) but I don't know how I'd even begin to narrow down all the possibilities! Can allergies effect the heart like that?

As for diet, no meat, lots of organic fruit and veg, lots of water, I can't imagine my cholesterol would be an issue or anything, or any weird un-reasearched chemicals in my food etc. To be honest I do feel like it's probably related to anxiety - maybe on a sub-conscious level though? And obviously the more I stress about it the worse it gets...

And thanks for the advice SWIMfriend

That sounds like exactly what I need; the knowledge that it's all in my head and I'm not actually gonna have a heart attack! I've been thinking about taking up jogging or something similar to convince myself my heart's still going strong, but obviously a cardiologist giving me the thumbs up would be even better...

I've never particularly felt like my heart is 'off-rhythm', more that it is trying to escape from my chest haha, but it's probably something I should get checked out for piece of mind. Man, if my GP didn't think I was a hypochondriac already...

Thanks guys!

EDIT: Double post

Point one is likely to be unnecessary, but point two is spot on.

From an intellectual and not subjective point of view, palpitations is a good symptom to work with.As with all symptoms, the history is as vital as any fancy tests; infact it may well be more important.And the most important part of this is defining exactly what is meant by the patient when they complain of this."Awareness of ones heartbeat", as the OP states, is the true definition.But are they fast,slow, sustained, provoked, relieved by anything, associated symptoms,how well tolerated etc etc?

A cardiac stress test is not used to provoke a potential rhythm problem or to usefully evaluate it.It may be required if coronary artery is suspected from the history/exam but only after a prolonged period of ECG monitoring (minimum 24 hours) in order to capture the potential rhythm problem on 'tape', or ECG paper.Some palpitations can be potentially very hazardous to subject the patients heart to stress testing.

The history and examination are key to deciding which tests, and in which order of priority, are required.

Thank you for the educated reply! Much appreciated



There doesn't appear to be any increase/decrease in pulse rate, there are no other symptoms I associate with it, it just feels as if my heart is beating 'too hard', and perhaps a little too fast when I start to stress about it. It becomes obvious when I'm not distracted, and is often made worse by smoking cannabis and psychedelics (particularly when coming close to ego-death).

I guess this means another trip to the GP... I feel like a spend far too much time there - and every time I'm sent off with a "come back if it doesn't go away - oh and stop smoking."

CC is correct that a 24 hr EKG (in the US, at least, that refers to a "Holter monitor" ) is the ideal thing to do; BUT, you're gonna want to try to get recordings during your "palpitations" in that 24 hour period.

So...you'll probably want to try a challenging trip during. You're usually asked to keep a diary of what you're doing when wearing the monitor. When you're tripping you can probably say "having an argument" or something, lol.

If you're really worried about "the way your heart is beating" you should demand that it be looked into--there ARE sometimes people who simply drop dead (at all ages) because of undiagnosed arrhythmias. But you'll only know for sure if you can get EKG recordings WHILE you're having your episodes.

I would give it serious consideration, if I were you. It obviously bothers you, and you have the means to hopefully PUT AN END to your need to worry about it.

psychedelics always make me aware of my heartbeat in that way..though they dont necessarily give me heart palpitations..cannabis and caffine can do it for sure. I have had heart palpitations on mushrooms for example if I panic a bit but I have also had them when I panic in situations in life where I am not taking any psychedelics.

I'll tell you another thing that's true for me particularly: I've discovered that supplementing potassium (as gluconate--about 3 grams once or twice a day) reduces those palpitations (and my BP).

Anyone who eats many meals in restaurants--or eats lots of processed foods--is getting WAY more sodium than they should; and sodium (more in some people than others) can increase BP and (in my case) increase feelings of palpitations. I've found a lot of benefit in K supplements regarding both BP and feelings of palpitations.

^ Right. The truth is that it's possible to have HORRIBLY bad diets leading a "typical" life, these days. It's a great advantage to try to eat a really healthy diet, made from simple foodstuffs you prepare yourself. Unfortunately...not all of us are as consistent with that as we should be.

IME it's very easy to see my BP rise and palpitations be not infrequent. Then, if I supplement reasonably with K, Mg, Ca my BP goes down and the palpitations disappear (although, like jamie, mine can also be exacerbated by caffeine).

Supplements aren't the cure for everything; but when your diet is TERRIBLE, well, the best cure is a better diet, but judicious use of supplements can be a quick fix, too.

And speaking of supplements, a very heart-healthy pre-trip set of supplements, IMO, consists of three things (in addition to making sure your mineral needs have been met): acetyl-l-carnitine (2-3 grams), CoQ10 (a gram--I buy powder and mix it with hot melted coconut oil, for far better absorption), and alpha-lipoic acid (a gram). A great place to get these cheaply, in high quality, is purebulk.com

I'm glad I'm not alone here - it makes me feel a bit reassured! Thank you for all the responses, I will consider speaking to my GP about something like the 24 hr ECG, but maybe after trying some light exercise and a little fiddle with my diet... I do eat fairly well but waking up to a strong coffee and a joint some days sounds like it could be contributing. Those supplements look interesting too, I wouldn't normally take them but before a trip could be very useful!

Thanks again! Peace

I have certainly had similar experiences. My first ever psychedelic experience was 20mg of 2C-B followed by a foolish booster of 20 more 3 hours in. This sprouted from a complete lack of education regarding safe dosing and my own personal thresholds, and although it was among the most transformative experiences in my life, it also was a harsh way to learn about my personal hypersensitivity to phenethylamines. I lay in my bed from t+10:00-t+19:00 with the exact same thoughts you had running through my head, watching my heart throb massively and rapidly in my chest and hoping it wouldn't explode.

I wonder if your issues may also have a certain sensitivity to a specific compound or class of compounds as is the case with me. Obviously you noticed them prior to even starting your psych usage, but I am curious if you have noticed or may retrospectively notice a trend in certain compounds of producing the effects more markedly?

I can definitely speak toward the importance of cardio. In addition to strengthening your heart, it will allow you to become more aware of your vascular and respiratory function. During long runs I would sometimes have an issue where I would gain sudden hyperawareness of my heartbeat and start to 'lose my cool'. I eventually learned to adjust the rhythm of my stride in such a way that it would actually get rid of this sensation. Obviously this will not necessarily be something that happens with you but I think that exposure to cardiovascular stress with a controlled activity like running will give you more insight into your body and minds' relationships to with your heart and perhaps give you more control over these sensations.

Well, but one thing I wouldn't do is gobble a large (and untried) amount of MINERALS before a trip--and probably not even the other, either. Any of the things I've mentioned can really make you feel quite a bit different--the effects are--or can be--quite large.

I recommend you play around with them at least a bit sober before you try adding them to a trip.

I often get heart palpitations on psychedelics. I become very aware of my heart and at times I can feel a very high heart rate, as if my heart is going nuts. The first few times this scared the living crap out of me, I worried if my drug use was causing me serious heart problems. After a few of these experiences I felt my pulse and noticed that my palpitations weren't even my heartbeat. My heart would beat at a normal pace while it felt like it was going at 190 beats per minute.

That's how I know I'm safe: I just feel my pulse. It could be that your palpitations are that, but there could be other medical causes. Good luck with it.

Sounds like it's not such an uncommon problem...

Thanks again for the advice, there's so many different things that could be causing this apparently. I don't think it's a reaction to a certain substance as it happens with a range of psychedelics and even when I'm sober, but I'll take the advice of getting some good excercise for sure; I'm quite active but I never 'push' my body particulary...

And as for the minerals, are there any physically dangerous drug interactions? If not then I find throwing myself in the deep end (mentally) is how I perform best

So thanks people, I'll update you with results once I've taken some of this on board. Much love to you all!

If you eat a really good diet, there's no need for the minerals (particularly common ones like K, Ca, Mg). Unfortunately MANY MANY people do not eat a good diet. Almost ANY supplement can be...dangerous--or at least unwise, if you go crazy with it. You CAN overdue K and Mg.

But IF your diet is not the best you CAN easily have a slight mineral imbalance (as I know I have when not eating really well), for which (if you're like me) palpitations (and high BP) can arise--and which the use of the proper minerals WILL mitigate or eliminate.

Bone broth is one of the richest and most bioavailable sources of minerals and other nutrients. Many people have claimed to completely reverse mineral deficiencies and other problems by making broth. I have been making lots of it and ingesting it every day. I just go to a farmer that has organic free range chickens and he sells me feet, necks and backs and I boil it all up for hours with a teaspoon of ACV..kinda like brewing ayahuasca

Hmm, well I'm vegetarian, so bone broth might be a bit of an issue... It's odd that bones contain that much goodness though, where does it come from?

I feel like I have a good diet in general so maybe this is all more mental than physical. I had a look on Google (terrible idea if you're prone to hypochondria BTW!) but it seems it's not that uncommon to be very aware of the heartbeat, especially if you're slim and/or have any anxiety issues. Perhaps I should experiment with a good dose of mushrooms and some NO2 (guaranteed intense experience) and just let my heart do as it pleases... If I come back OK then I guess it's all in my head! To be fair the heart is incredibly resilient, I think I may have over-hyped a small worry - mind over matter and all that