So I've been a committed psychonaut and visionary artist since my early twenties. Now, in my mid-forties, suddenly there is a baby girl in the picture (she's actually over a year old, but I'm still going through major adjustments). She's absolutely incredible, and the experience is something I'm grateful I'm having in this lifetime. But it's also incredibly challenging. My wife and I have spent our lives immersed in our art careers, and now we've had to put the selfish aspects of ourselves in the backseat. We are also both very hands-on in our parenting style- no daycare or nannies. She works a lot too... So, long story short, I've had to give up the vast majority of personal freedom and spare time that I'd been enjoying for so long.

I think that the psychedelic understanding has made it possible for us to appreciate the parenting experience at a great depth- she has added literally a new dimension to our lives. It's truly the ultimate creative experience. At the same time, it's unlikely I'll be able to squeeze in an acid or shroom trip for a long, long time (thank the universe for the spice!). The challenges of doing this parenting thing the right way, while still being true to ourselves and fulfilling our creative needs, have proven to be overwhelming. There are large parts of myself that I've had to simply put away- possibly forever. But my world is bigger for it.

I have a few friends (In California, where this is pretty normal) who are really open about their psychedelic use and cannabis consumption in front of their kids. In one sense this is very honest and admirable, but I can imagine the complications once their kids are in school and talking about it. We are in the small town Midwest where we could never afford such a leak, so I have to be very discreet.

Any other psychedelic parents out there? I'd love to hear about your experiences, how you deal with balancing it all. Mr. Electric Cool-Aid has mentioned similar challenges in a couple of his posts... Anyone else?

While I personally don't have an experience with this, I remember hearing Alex Grey and his wife talk about their psychedelics use once they had their baby daughter. Here's some links I dug up:

http://www.matrixmasters.net/salon/?p=169
http://psychedelicadvent...grey-on-psychedelic.html

Cant you, when your daughter is too young, refer to these things as "daddy is gonna drink a tea from the amazon" or things like this... And once she's old enough to really understand, explain to her why she cant talk with her friends about what you do ?

I have a 6-month old here. I've put substances on hold for a while, mostly out of respect for my girlfriend who hasn't been able to take part. I'm still unsure about how to deal with it. I do feel the itch to step out of this reality for a little bit, but I also know that the possibility will always be there, so I'm patient. My girlfriend is not the type to be fully open with it and I may just follow her in that. I do like the openness approach, but there's something to be said for subtlety.

endlessness, the problem is there's quite a gap between the moment they understand what your doing and the moment they understand why other people (mistakenly) think it's wrong. That's a few years of unresolved issues there.

The real problem is the dissonance in our social values. I think that by keeping that part of our lives a good arm's length away from them, we're displaying how it is indeed possible to function in society while keeping those things private. That being said, we may also be showing them how to hide things from us in return, but can you really avoid that anyway?

As you can see, I don't know either, I'm still pondering it.

I'll have to check out that Alex Grey thing.

If I had known about spice when my kids were born, I would have never taken a 15 year break from psychedelics. My oldest is 19 and my youngest will be 15 in this year.

When the oldest was 3 I stopped with LSD and mushrooms because I just never felt safe being checked out that long.Or course, with that kind of anxiety in mind it DID make sense to lay off. 6-12 hours was just too long for me to be unavailable, should a need for me arise related to the kids.

Heck, with DMT you're only gone as long as it takes to take a good crap. SO it's a non-issue in my mind fromthat standpoint.

All that being as it is, I never intentionally let my kids know anything illegal I was doing. Sure I wish I lived in a society that isn't so damned uptight about these kinds of things, but I do. I didn't think it was fair to try to explain to young children how "sometimes it's ok to lie". Even if they would understand it and do it, that's not a stress I wanted them to have because of me. What they didn't know they could deny in completely good conscience.

Well, both of them figured out a lot of "what Dad's up to", now that they are in their teens but now they do have the capacity to keep their mouths shut and they do understand more of the nuances of truth. I've talked to them about my beliefs and stances on the topic but still to this day don't admit directly to anything - we'll except to the one that's 19 if he asks.

My 2 cents... good luck and blessings

1000k- thanks for the links. Great quotes... But I'll have to watch the vid later when I'm not with a sleeping baby...

We've known the Greys personally for 15 years, and they-Allyson in particular-have always been very vocal about their opinion that we should start a family. They began their relationship under the premise that they were going to dedicate their lives to their art. One day, while on X on the top of a mountain, Allyson proposed parenthood to Alex. She promised to take on a lion's share of daily responsibilities, so Alex could stay focused on painting. He couldn't possibly say no, and of course there are no regrets of any kind.

Our situation is a little different. Neither of us proposed it to the other, but after 20 years together I think we were both feeling the itch. We started easing up on the protection, without really making any plans to go along with that... And suddenly Bam, we have this amazing baby.

But we are both trying to stay with our careers... And not to be redundant, but wow... An incredible, almost overwhelming challenge. But no regrets at all.

several thoughts.
my kids are 11 and 8.

We went without for a good while. When the kids got old enough to not be an infant having psychedelic friends who are willing to babysit helped.
For starters, you can basically tell them, "Me and the Mrs are going to trip our asses off Saturday."
Obviously these need to be highly competent people who can handle any emergency and are smart enough to realize that calling you isn't a good idea unless absolutely needed.
We've done some solo journey's as well, tho this isn't much fun and isn't done very often.

The wife and I agreed at the start to never talk about these things until the kids are adults. We will not by hypocritical with them, but we aren't going to divulge many things as we feel kids may have trouble differentiating between drugs, etc. Best just to wait.
Or at least, me saying "Hey 11year old kid, when I was 17 I bought 900hits of acid and moved into a shack in the woods for 3 years so there!" would not really serve any useful purpose.

Don't sweat the psych thing, there was plenty of time before and there will plenty of time to do it all later, now is the time to enjoy the heck outta your kids. Mind you I am at a vastly different time in my life then you, so take my perspective for what it is. When I'm 42 both of my kids will be over 18 :-) We often joke that when we hit 42 we are locking the doors for a month or two to "catch up"

good luck!
Rw

Pup- great post, and that's really very similar to how I've been envisioning this next decade and a half. I definitely intend to step out to take a good crap every now and then! (which I've done about a half dozen times so far during this new chapter... But usually by the time baby and mommy are tucked in and the daily carnage cleaned up, I'm too exhausted to visit hyperspace). I also intend to cling stubbornly to my cannabis habit... But it's such a moderate thing that it's easy to be discreet.

Ringworm- that does offer some hope. But you're right, enjoying being parents really should always be front and center. One difference between my situation and yours (besides the fact that I'll be 60 when she's 18!) is that I need to tread lightly on these grounds if I want to retain the support of my wife. She's done tripping (got the message/hung up the phone about a decade ago) and has babysat me on all of my worst trips - four of them in a year- so I can't pretend it's a harmless pastime. Some of my bummers were truly epic and her efforts heroic.

That said, I'm not explicitly banned from anything in particular, but I have to be reasonable and not bring stress into the family. She's been supportive of my spice excursions and time spent here at the Nexus. It is absolutely my priority to be a good husband and father... But that calling just won't go away, and often fills my head for much of the day.

I'll find that balance. Nice to hear some of your experiences... This isn't exactly dinner table conversation.

If I had kids in public school hell no I would not have them know about this..public school brainwashes kids with all sorts of weird ideas that are not based in reality and the slightest slip up from them can have social services all over your ass. I know this, my mother is a teacher in the public school system. I would never ever send my kids to public school.

When I have kids I am not sending them to public school. I am going to home school my kids and arrange times for them to go learn and play with other kids in similar situations so they are still socially developed. I feel like I wont feel so much pressure to hide this sort of thing from my children in that sort of a situaton, and they will be getting a better education anyway free from all the brainwashing.

I dont want my kids having the typical drug talk brainwashing at like 12 years old they tell public school kids..its all bs and just pollutes their minds. You dont have to smoke joints, blow smoke in their face and tell them drugs are great..there are other ways for the reality of this whole thing to be introduced to children I think and I doubt a kid seeing their father or mother drink a tea late at night before they go to sleep so they can be with the spirits or something is even going to associate that with most drug war propeganda..it is all about how it is presented.

The word "drug" has alot of bs attached to it and I dont see any reason at all for my use of ayahuasca to be explained to my future children when they are like 11 years old with the word "drug" anywhere in that explaination. It is a spiritual plant based medicine that is used when one is comming of age and by adults etc..that is it.

I do know of people who do have younger kids around 10 years old, and they drink ayahuasca. I dont think they just hide it from their kids..I just dont think they would ever put 2 and 2 together and think "oh hey my mom is taking drugs"..it is just some tea that tastes like dirt..looks like dirt and she does not like trip her face off in front of her kids or anything..

Guyomech, look at the bright side, doing a psychedelic after a 3 year break is AWESOME.
I got tied up in the the whole game, make money, strive for success etc etc. It was nice to step back out again, plus also interesting to see what I retained over the time.
I don't know how you did this or that, but I found I'd done certain things enough, that simply listening to certain music in a dark quiet space was enough to remember where I was :-)

Jamie,
Sure the war on drugs is bs. We home school actually as the local public schools are scary.
We just found that at least our kids are highly perceptive. They are little adults, they can see through the bullshit. If someone tells them something they immediately question it and try to disprove it with reason. We raised them to prove everything.
Even authority type figures are highly scrutinized, so if someone said "This is this and this is that." the first question my kids have is, "Ok, why? explain this to me."
It is really funny to see a 8 year old scientist dissect the logic of a 45 year old trying to pull the wool over their eyes.


anyway I rambled long enough, Guy, good luck!

that is awesome that you homeschool your kids! The public school system is scary and after going through it I just could never send a kid there with alternatives like homeschooling in place. My only worry is that my kids(when I have them) will be socially less developed if I dont make sure they interact with other homeschool kids etc...so I want to make sure I will have a good relationship with other parents who see education in the same light so myh kids can play with their kids. I have thought about this alot lately..I am 28 already and want kids by the time I am 35..

That's a good idea jamie. If you can get together a network of home-schooling parents, maybe you could all share the responsibility, giving you more spare time and allowing the kids to mix.

Peace

Macre

I second this. I can't explain how excited I was to get back in the pool after 15 years. It was VERY groovy.

Apparently, with psychedelics... absence DOES make the heart grow fonder.

the usefulness of homeschool groups is very limited. You get two major groups, the religious nutjobs and the damaged kids that have obvious problems and want to beat everyone up.

we found the kids have plenty of time (school is over well before noon if they can keep it together) as such the activities are huge. My daughter does some major dance competition... I mean like dance 40hours a week kinda thing.
My son does haiku, watercolors, and spends most of his time doing karate (That's what we get for naming him Ronin). he is also our little scientist, so he is constantly growing something on a petri dish or collecting some plant or insect.
Activities are more important than school in many ways, as the kids are nearing the dangerous teen years they are far to involved with their current projects to wander into the "we're bored, so lets get drunk and have sex" mentality.

Anyway, through these venues the kids have plenty of time to form social connections, they get invited to birthday parties, go play with kids et el. It's a non issue. If anything the kids are *better* at interacting on a wide spectrum. What I mean is they live doing daily life kinda stuff: shopping for food, working in the wife's shop, talking and dealing with people of all ages. Kids in school only really deal with people their only age and the teachers (the man).
We find public school kids have a harder time relating to younger and older people. The younger are seen as inferior, and the older are authority figures. My kids view everyone on the same plane which is good.


Pup Tentacle, how's your chin?

Meditation has a positive effect for animals, babies, children around the person meditating so imagine the effect of chemical enlightenment..

Haha, this thread is so good to find, today of all days!!

I'm a single father of twin 7 year old boys who are both off school for their easter break. I've been trying to do a discreet Q21Q21 extraction all day without arousing their suspicions. However, one of them saw it as I had the purple paste in a glass bowl earlier.... I answered the inevitable question with "I'm just trying out a new blend of cement for a wall I'm going to make in the back yard"

I HATE lying to them!!

I look forward to telling them the truth one day....

Not a parent myself, but my ex-stepfather is a psychonaut. We have never talked about it in person, since he moved out about 1,5 years ago, right before my psychedelic career started. We both just know the other one tripped. He has been at both Ozora and Boom for as long as i can remember, and we share alot of the same musictaste (e.g Shpongle, Ott, Ultimae Records).

I also think he did it at night sometimes. I remember one incident for maany years ago, i was probably around 10 (18 now), when i woke up at night and went upstairs, finding him dancing alone to some music with beat. I asked what he was doing, and said, nothing, and giggled while he asked me to go to bed, its really late. I did, didnt think much about it until i started to trip, and did MDMA.

We have always had a crazy wall decor as well in the living room. I know this can be quite common, but it is one of many small things which adds up.

Forrest, I disagree. The possibility of being exceptionally weird or freaking out is too big of a risk.
Image is everything, right now my children think I'm the greatest thing in the universe, to shatter that reality would have long term effects.

DiamondTongue:
I don't lie to my kids, I've just never given them a reason to question anything. We all have such weird hobbies at the house here that it'd be hard to find anything questionable.
I mean, what kinda weird stuff could happen here????

Ringworm, what have you done to R2-D2? You animal!

Peace

Macre

Congratulations Guyomech! A little girl, a blessing indeed, until she turns 12!

Have recently started my exploration with DMT but been using other psychedelics for over 20 years apart from a 5 year break when my teenager was born. Have had a fantastic few times being around small kids on low doses of lsd! Always with responsible and understanding adults around.

Especially living in a small community, I don't think it's necessary to take deep journeys with kids around, or for them to know what we do. Miss Miss, my daddy drinks tea from the amazon and smokes mud from a box!! Keeping secrets is a big responsibility on kids, especially if it is something exiting. When they are interested they will start asking questions (especially after those dumb talks they do in schools!) and you can be more honest with them. Or they will repeat something that they heard and you can take that opportunity to educate them a bit.

As my kid gets older I find more and more opportunities to do my thang! I am experimenting with extractions and vaping techniques (few and far between) and will try some harmala extraction, brewing and make some changa. My local goatherd helps and bioassays. My kid will be away for a couple of months in the summer when I will try some pharmahausca. And the rest of my journeying can wait until the time is right, which is not that long to go now!