While it can be nice to dream about massive telekinetic efforts, super-human achievements or even alien builders, I think there's enough evidence that dynastic egyptians were astounding engineers, brilliant astronomers and probably many other things, but by the time a hundred thousand people would work along and synchronized to move a massive two tons concrete block, through simple meditation and focusing, a few thousands would build a pyramid from scratch.

I remember fantasizing about similar things many years ago, but a little research places things in a different perspective. And that does not belittle their achievements. Not a little bit.

When people think pyramids they think Egypt for some reason... There are older pyramids discovered already around the world. That are submerged or even hidden in jungles that are over 40k years old. They found one pyramid that has a block that even 14 of of our biggest cranes today have trouble lifting it. I would like to keep my options open when it comes to the mysteries of the past. There is barely any proof that they were built by hand still. The lack of tools says enough by itself.

Do you have any credible source for these claims?

ancient aliens

Do you have any credible source for these claims?

Also the lack of tools does not mean much, there can be a lot of reasons why certain tools are not found: They can be moved to other places, they can have rotten away, dumped in the ocean, etc. So stating "The lack of tools says enough by itself" is a false assumption and a fallacy, something that should be avoided here.


Kind regards,

The Traveler

Please also read this article the sources are cited on the bottom of the page.
http://www.abovetopsecre...m/forum/thread635457/pg1

Uhm, linking to one of the biggest Conspiracy Theory sites is not what I mean with a credible source.


Kind regards,

The Traveler

When people think pyramids they think Egypt for some reason... There are older pyramids discovered already around the world. That are submerged or even hidden in jungles that are over 40k years old. They found one pyramid that has a block that even 14 of of our biggest cranes today have trouble lifting it. I would like to keep my options open when it comes to the mysteries of the past. There is barely any proof that they were built by hand still. The lack of tools says enough by itself.

Please also read this article the sources are cited on the bottom of the page.
http://www.abovetopsecre...m/forum/thread635457/pg1.

"This is how the pyramid was made: like a set of stairs, which some call battlements and some altar steps. When they had first made this base, they then lifted the remaining stones with levers [lit. machines] made of short timbers, lifting them from the ground to the first tier of steps, and, as soon as the stone was raised upon this, it was placed on another lever, which stood on the first tier, and from there it was dragged up to the second tier and on to another lever. As many as there were the tiers, so many were the levers; or it may have been that they transferred the same lever, if they were easily handleable, to each tier in turn, once they had got the stone out of it. I have offered these two different stories of how they did it, for both ways were told me." [History, 2.125]

This thread is being written with the intentions of laying out facts and argumentative data that touches upon the mysteries which linger around the Great Pyramid of Giza. The beginning and majority of this thread will illustrate factual data with conclusions on the Pyramid (as well as other anomalies) towards the end.

(I put this thread in this forum to illustrate my conclusion on the Great Pyramid)

All opinions are welcome.

Introduction



Egypt is considered to be one of the most extravagant civilizations of the ancient world; rivaling with the societal paradigm of its day and stretching far beyond antiquity. From the remnants of the once prosperous empire sits several great architectural feats and towering high above these incredible monuments one of the Seven Wonders of the World rests in a state of timelessness, the Great Pyramid of Giza. The immense size and geometric accuracy of this superstructure leads to a bewilderment of the rational mind. Higher than its other two counter parts, the Red Pyramid and the Pyramid of Khafre, the Great Pyramid was the tallest man-made structural accomplishment of its time. Obviously this massive consummation exhibits an extraordinary skill of craftsmanship – raising a fervid curiosity.


How did the Egyptians manage to plan, build, and finish such a magnificent structure with such precision? This is just one of several questions in which 'mainstream archeology' claims to have already answered. However, there are serious disputes on the matter, and a considerable amount of holes in current widely accepted theories. Adding to the dilemma of how and why the Great Pyramid of Giza was built is the lack of information in Egyptian writings and records.

The Factual Paradoxes Are Profound

The Egyptians recorded every piece of their lifestyle in detail – they were a civilization full of accountants. The scribes recorded how many of the enemy they killed in battle, the names of the pharaoh's children, even cake recipes. Yet, there are no official inscriptions, no carvings, no related paintings, no recorded accounts of the construction of the Great Pyramid – nothing. The ancient Egyptian records are silent in regards to one of the greatest structural accomplishments in the history of man kind.

Bob Brier and Jean-Pierre Houdin state in their book The Secret of the Great Pyramid, “ I can tell you the names of the two horses that pulled Ramses the Great's chariot at the Battle of Kadesh ('Mut Is Content' and 'Victory in Thebes' but I cannot tell you how the Egyptians hauled those huge blocks up the Great Pyramid or how many men worked on the Pyramid at any one time.”

Noticeably there is quite a mystery lingering over the Great pyramid; the Egyptians recorded minute aspects of their society but this one magnificent achievement has no written documentation whatsoever. Consequently, after years of heated debates and time consuming research, scientists and scholars are still attempting to try to determine exactly why, how, and who built the Great Pyramid of Giza. There is no conclusive evidence to back up any one theory as none has yet to be found. Undoubtedly, coming to a mutual agreement on how the Great Pyramid was constructed is almost unfathomable considering the sheer size and precision at which the structure was built.

The Pyramids Precision

The Great Pyramid, also known as Khufu's Pyramid, was the tallest known artificial structure in the world for roughly 3,800 years, the longest period of time that such a record was held. Now sitting at roughly 453.1 stories high the pyramid was formerly 480.69 feet tall with it's capstone.

Originally, the Great Pyramid comprised of a staggering 2,500,000 million stone blocks with it's casing stones. These casing stones were polished white limestone that gleamed in the sunlight and covered the four faces of the pyramid; each one of these stone slabs weighed up to 15 tons or 30,000 lbs. The majority of these polished stones were stolen and used to build mosques, fortresses, and even houses in Cairo after a devastating earthquake in the 14th century (1301 AD) caused many of them to shatter and fall off the faces of the pyramid.

What's left today without the casing is still a mind boggling 2,300,000 million stone blocks consisting of limestone and dense granite slabs. Even more astonishing is the weight and size of some of these stones – to call them enormous would be an understatement.

The smaller stones used throughout the majority of the pyramid were limestone blocks weighing anywhere from 1.3 to 10 tons, with an average weight of roughly 2.5 tons. The larger slabs were the solid granite beams used inside the chambers of the pyramid. For example, in the Kings Chamber the beams were on average twenty-three feet long and weighed anywhere from 50 to 70 tons – that's practically the weight of a small locomotive. To make a comparison to the overall weight, the Great Pyramid of Giza weighs an estimated 6,500,000 tons and the Empire State Building weighs 350,000 tons; that means that roughly 18.5 Empire state buildings would match the approximate weight of the Great Pyramid of Giza. Adding on to this astronomical size, the Great Pyramid of Giza was built with specific measurements that were far more meticulous than today’s standards of construction.



The Great Pyramid was built with inexplicable definitiveness. The northern face of the pyramid is aligned, in near perfection, to true north, the eastern face is aligned almost perfectly to true east, the west to true west, and the south to true south. With an average error of roughly 3 minutes of arc, 2 minutes on the southern face, the structure is of unarguably incredible accuracy for any era. Not to mention the North Pole moves over time and may add credit to the pyramid being of perfect alignment thousands of years ago. The accomplishment is without a doubt an astounding feat for an ancient civilization 4,500 years ago and in some cases impossible today on such a grand scale.

Three arc minutes of a deviation is only in error of less than 0.015 percent from true. The reasoning for such accuracy is almost incomprehensible. If the base of the pyramid would have been just 2 or 3 degrees out of true (which is roughly 1 percent) the difference would not be noticeable to the unaided eye. The motives for such precision must have been paramount considering the difference in the magnitude of tasks would have been enormous if the pyramid was just a degree or two out of alignment!

The structure's north side has a length of 755 feet 4.9818 inches, it's west side is 755 feet 9.1551 inches, it's east side 755 feet 10.4937 inches, and it's south side 756 feet 0.9739 inches. This means that there is a difference of about 8 inches between the shortest and longest side of the Pyramid. That is a miniscule fraction of about 1 percent in relation to the average side length of 9063 inches. Once again, there was an unimaginable amount of care in getting the measurements of the pyramid to near flawlessness.

There are very few modern-built buildings today that have corners which consist of anything close to perfect 90° angles. Such a deviation of 1 or 2 degrees is not quite noticeable at all, and the difference doesn't cause any malefactors structurally. The pyramid, however, is 89° 56' 27” measured the south-eastern corner, 90° 0' 33'' measured on the south-western corner, 90° 3' 2'' on the north-eastern corner, and the north western corner is 89° 59' 58'' of true. The measurements are astounding and are surely a mark of an extreme expertise in architecture of the highest order – especially considering the fact that the pyramid sits on an area of 13 acres. This is something that modern structural-engineers could only wonder how they would go about in accomplishing today with such pristine accuracy on a truly monstrous scale.

How was the great pyramid built?

The amount of time that the Great Pyramid is said to be built is within a span of 20 years. This means that if the builders worked 10 hour days, 365 days a year, a block of stone had be quarried, transported, and set into place every 2 minutes. That is disregarding, accidents, non-working days, weather conditions, etc... Also, the timing does not necessarily take into account the 50 to 70 ton granite beams that are found in the innards of the pyramid. So how did the builders of Khufu's Pyramid manage to build such an extraordinary architecture that rivals the best modern-built projects today?

Generally, the most accepted theory on how the Great Pyramid was built consists of ropes, ramps, rollers, sledges, and thousands of free workers. For example the college text book, The Making of The West states, “The pyramids exterior blocks were quarried along the Nile and then floated to the site on barges. Free workers (not slaves) dragged them up ramps and into position using rollers and sleds.” This current belief, however, is quite flimsy in addressing the faults in the theory itself.

Each theory is incredibly erroneous – especially when one takes into consideration the lack of evidence to support them. There are several different ramp theories in regards to the construction of the Great Pyramid, each one incorporates a different model or design. The most common ones include the “spiral ramp” theory, the “straight-on ramp” theory, the “zig-zag ramp” theory, and a considerable amount of other variations. Regardless of the alternate styles or theoretical conclusions of different ramp models, each one has it's advantages and it's disadvantages.

The Spiral Ramp -

The model consists of a spiraling ramp roughly a third of a mile in length that wraps around the sides of the superstructure.



The problems in this theory are obvious considering the lack of ease in getting the average 2.5 ton block in place every 2 minutes. To move stones that are 2.5-10 tons around a 90° every 2 minutes is highly improbably. There is also the factor of the 23 foot long granite beams weighing up to 70 tons that are absolutely impossible to maneuver around any corner on the spiraling ramp. In addition, the ramp covers most of the pyramid which may create difficulties in observing the construction for correct and precise measurements for the flawless shape. The advantages are that less material would have been used in comparison to other models.

The Straight-on Ramp -

This model consists of a single massive ramp going straight into the face of the pyramid. The problem with this ramp is that the around of material that had to be used would have been roughly 1/5 to 2/5's of the material used for the Great Pyramid itself!



With a realistic angle of inclination, the ramp would be 1553 (5° and respectively 713m (10° long at the very top (146.59m high).

That would mean that the gradient would begin to get quite steep. The ramp would have to be be built upon in length and height every time a new course was finished; there would also be severe issues with the stability of the ramp if not made wider on a constant basis. This is expressive of a very time consuming model and a single ramp would make it quite improbable to move a block into place every 2 minutes. The advantage to this ramp would be the majority of the pyramid not covered by the ramp for the project; thus adding clarity in observations and control in structural shape.

The Zig Zag Ramp -

The zig-zag ramp model consists of a switch-back style of ramps on a single pyramid face all the way to the top. This variation is also used in several other ramp models in regards to the very top, when other ramp models are to steep or are in need of a wider base.



A serious difficulty arises in this model considering the amount of corners that there would be throughout the ramp structure. The blocks would have to be shifted several times, which would promise a large consumption of time. The larger slabs of stone such as the granite beams would be extremely difficult if not impossible to maneuver around the corners. A wide base would also have to be used in this project which would need a commodious amount of materials and resources. The real gratification of this method would be the three faces of the pyramid not covered by the ramp and would thus give a better chance of maintaining the desired shape and measurement of the Great Pyramid.

The ramps all seem to be quite faulty, and the advantages don't necessary out weight the cons in regards to easier construction. In general all of these theories have the same disadvantages and lack of support for a strong argument. The amount of material used would vary between different models, but the amount used would be immense regardless. Each new course would mean another several days to weeks to add on to the ramp(s), making it longer, wider, and higher in elevation. The width of the ramp must also accommodate the crews going down the ramp with empty sleds and the crews going up the ramps with colossal sized slabs of stone. On top of all this work on a massive scale, there are dangers for the well-being and life of the workers. So why would such a time consuming and incredible project be pursued? Why such an extensive line of work that is clearly worthy of modern-day contemplation?

Why Build The Great Pyramid?



The current theory is that the pyramids were used as tombs for pharaohs and their eternal trip into the after life.

National Geographic describes the pyramid's function. "To shelter and safeguard the part of the pharaoh's soul that remained with his corpse, Egyptians built massive tombs – but not always pyramids."

However, contrary to popular belief, there have been no bodies found in any one pyramid throughout Egypt. Corpses are found in mastabas which were carved into the Egyptian bedrock and comprised of flat roofed tops; sometimes even having mounts of dirt and mud over the ceiling. This raises the big question of why the Great Pyramid of Giza is depicted as Khufu's tomb if there is no official inscriptions anywhere throughout the structure. One would think that such an incredible creation for the pharaoh and his afterlife would have many official inscriptions stating so.

There has been a wide controversy in regards to the Great Pyramid being considered Pharaoh Khufu's tomb. The only account that expresses a supportive stance to this theory is from the Greek historian Herodotus, who had said that the pyramid was built by pharaoh Khufu during the 4th dynasty.

The oldest surviving written description of the monuments (from Herodotus himself) states:

Cheops, they said, reigned for fifty years, and on his death the kingship was taken over by his brother Chephren. He also made a pyramid... it is forty feet lower than his brother's pyramid, but otherwise of the same greatness... Chephren reigned for fifty-six years...then there succeeded Mycerinus, the son of Cheops... This man left a pyramid smaller than his father's.

This account was written after Herodotus saw the pyramids in the fifth century BC. This was roughly 2000 years after the pyramids were supposedly built. Yet, this testimonial from Herodotus is what the most, if not the entirety, of current subsequent history is based off of. Still to this day this testimonial is assumed to be up to the status of an unassailable fact – even with no other recorded documents or written evidence included to prove or support the testimonial.

The Kings Chamber

The kings chamber of the Great Pyramid is beautifully remarkable – built entirely of rose granite. Resting at the western end of the chamber is what is supposedly a granite sarcophagus which once contained King Khufu's body. The granite coffer is also made from a single block of rose granite weighing approximately 3.75 tons. The lid to this coffer would have weighed an astounding 2 tons. What's odd about this coffer is that it would have had to be built and set into place before the pyramid was even close to finished as it is too wide to fit through any passage and obviously too heavy.




This 3.75 ton rose granite coffer was the supposed final resting place of King Khufu. Yet, there is no evidence to suggest that a corpse had ever been place within the rose granite masterpiece. No embalming materials have been found, not even small pieces or traces of articles of clothing – nothing. The common belief is that the tombs were raided by grave robbers, but why would they leave nothing, no traces of anything whatsoever? Another aspect of the coffer is that it is barely spacious enough to support an average sized man, let alone a man in a sarcophagus – which was not a common practice in Egypt.



A Quick Conclusion

There seems to be another unfortunate common practice in believing that the Great Pyramid of Giza was used as a tomb. There is incontestably a lack of information on the subject besides a several centuries old testimony that was incorporated into writing long after the pyramid was built.

Graham Hancock states in his book Finger Prints of The Gods , “All this is orthodox, mainstream, modern scholarship, which is unquestionably accepted as historical fact and taught as such at universities everywhere.”

Basically stating that these theories are taught as if fact, when in fact, there is hardly enough evidence, artifacts, records, or documentation to create a support for a strong argument.

Many seem to forget a theory is only just that, a theory, and to be accepted as fact is to do the truth little to no good.

The inquisitiveness that arises from the pyramids may never be quenched. The Great Pyramid will probably still go on just as puzzling and shrouded in paradox as it is magnificent. Egypt might always remain a land veiled in mystery with it's remains of a once affluent ancient civilization sitting in a state of awe and allurement. Hopefully, of course, there will be more extensive research and questioning on the current accepted theories in regards to Egypt and it's ravishing architecture, more notably the Great Pyramid of Giza, which is truly a conundrum made of stone.

Part II: Something Extraterrestrial?

(Part II will be much shorter and only for the sake of raising questions.)

There are several interesting facts in accordance to the Great Pyramid that only makes the observer ask, "why?". The current conclusion that I've come up with is that the Pyramid obviously had a great task that was far beyond the fallible conclusion of being a tomb for an egocentric pharaoh.

There are several interesting anomalies.

Rose Granite which is used in the inner chambers of the Pyramid is considered to be one of the most paramagnetic substances measured.

Something paramagnetic is a body or substance that, placed in a magnetic field, possesses magnetization in direct proportion to the field strength; a substance in which the magnetic moments of the atoms are not aligned.

http://dictionary.refere...paramagnetism?&q

Limestone which was used on the outer portion of the Pyramid (including the polished tura limestone casing stones) is considered to be diagmagnetic.

Something that is diamagnetic has the property of being repelled by both poles of a magnet. Most substances commonly considered to be nonmagnetic, such as water, are actually diamagnetic.

http://dictionary.refere....com/browse/diamagnetism

Think of the Limestone as an insulator and the Rose granite as a conductor. The word "Pyramid" translates to 'the fire in the middle or inner fire'.



(The story accompanying the pyramid image is about the pyramid energy research of Mary and Dean Hardy of Allegan, Michigan.)

Was the Pyramid actually used as some sort of machine? Was the Pyramid built for the sake of helping the Egyptian culture? The effects of the pyramid on the human body in relation to it's placement, it's proportions, it's make-up, may be something worth looking into with future research. The structure now probably is but a shell/ghost of what it once was (especially without it's capstone/casing stones) which may bias conclusive evidence.




(Quote taken from: http://www.crystalinks.com/gpstats.html)



Which raises another question, why go through the trouble of making eight faces?

The Closing and Personal Opinion

There are pyramids all over the world. Why would humans just randomly come up with such a concept without having contact with each other. Who knows?

My belief will stay on the fringe side, especially after in-depth research. I believe, without a doubt, that the Great Pyramid was used as a mechanism for a properly-oriented place of initiation.

Was the Great Pyramid of Giza An "enlightening" machine that sharpens an individuals awareness, handed down by far off visitors?

There is a big piece of the puzzle missing here. Or... is the truth staring back at us with eight faces?

Quick Facts

The Great Pyramid is located at the center of the land mass of the earth. The east/west parallel that crosses the most land and the north/south meridian that crosses the most land intersect in two places on the earth, one in the ocean and the other at the Great Pyramid.

The length of a base side is 9131 pyramid inches measured at the mean socket level, or 365.24 pyramid cubits, which is the number of days in a year. {9131/25 = 365.24, accurate to 5 digits}

The average height of land above sea level for the earth is 5449 inches. This is also the height of the pyramid.

There is so much stone mass in the pyramid that the interior temperature is constant and equals the average temperature of the earth, 20 Degrees Celsius (68 Degrees Fahrenheit).

The outer mantle was composed of 144,000 casing stones, all highly polished and flat to an accuracy of 1/100th of an inch, about 100 inches thick and weighing about 15 tons each.

The mortar used is of an unknown origin. It has been analyzed and its chemical composition is known but it can't be reproduced. It is stronger than the stone and still holding up today.

Sources
1. Peter James, Ancient Mysteries. New York: Ballantine Books, 1999

2. Bob Brier, The Secret of the Great Pyramid. New York: HarperCollins Publishers, 2008

3. “The Giza Plateau and Pyramids,” The Global Education Project, (Theglobaleductionproject.com) accessed November 30, 2010, http://www.theglobaleduc...pt/studyguide/gpmath.php

4. “Facts and Trivia,” The Empire State Building, (Esbnyc.com) accessed November 30, 2010, http://www.esbnyc.com/tourism/tourism_facts.cfm

5. Graham Hancock, Finger Prints of the Gods. New York: Three Rivers Press, 1995

6. “Egypt: Secrets of an Ancient World,” National Geographic, (Nationalgeographic.com) accessed November 30, 2010, http://www.nationalgeogr...com/pyramids/maidum.html

7. Hunt, Martin, Rosenwein, Po-chia Hsia, Smith, The Making of the West. Boston: Bedford/St. Martins, 2009


9 "Guardians Egypt,” Guardians, (Guardians.net) accessed November 29, 2010, http://www.guardians.net...yramids/GreatPyramid.htm

10. “News and information on the Pyramids of Egypt,” Talking Pyramids, (Talkingpyramids.com) Accessed November 29, 2010 http://www.talkingpyrami...m/giza/pyramid-of-khufu/

END

Of course we are to keep possibilities open. I didn't imply that egyptian workers (or mayans, or aztecs, or ancient druidic cultures) had to use necessarily hand-still, brute force approaches in order to build huge structures. Different engineering techniques, different ways to understand the environment and the terrain than we have nowadays should be considered. In Egypt, for instance, it's extremely likely that they used the Nile river in ways we cannot fathom easily. They might even have super-intelligent, "divine" if you want, inspiration. But, since you mention proof and evidence, we have no evidence either of ancient (or modern) civilizations using meditation in order to create or move huge body masses. While there are evidence of pits, ramps, harbors and quarries. So to me, makes more sense to consider unique engineering methods and brilliant, forgotten designs than telekinetic building. We know they piled up mastabas before engaging into far more impressive, precise and evolved designs.

And the fact they are extremely old doesn't make more or less likely one method or another. They are very old. So what? People was certainly not stupid 40K years ago. One of the fallacies of the colonialism implied selling the idea that "primitive" and ancient cultures had terrible lives and were not able to perform all the feats that our oh-so-awesome modern culture easily mastered. And, as you will agree, that's a load of bullshit. A forty-thousand year old structure might have been designed and built using knowledge and techniques beyond our brutish building methods, but I still think that proposing telekinesis as a likely solution of the mystery is not the best way we can go.



Regarding this paper, they repeat ceaselessly the huge size of Khufu's pyramid in Gizah. Okay. They bring out a lot of impressive figures on how precisely (and meaningfully) measured the pyramid was. On how exactly oriented it was. We know that ancient egyptians were INCREDIBLE astronomers. That's their achievement. I cannot see what that has to do with telekinetic powers. Knowing their ways to compile such an impressive amount of astronomical data, including precessions, that is worth studying imo. And proves they were wise and extremely intelligent. And obviously, if you are to start such a massive project, makes sense to plan thoroughly every major aspect of it, doesn't it?

The rest of the paper, IMO, is just more speculation, and states the fact that we need additional data or findings to explain completely the construction techniques. Is it worth considering paranormal or alien intervention as a wild hypothesis? More solid than other approaches? I doubt so. If you want other readings, just to balance things, I would recommend these, for starters:

Pyramid Construction
Nova: Who Built the Pyramids (interview)

Edit: This is what one of the closest sources we have, Herodotus (circa 450 BC) wrote on the subject.

I'm pretty sure the pyramids are a relic of the stuffing wars between the ancient pilgrims and indians during the first thanksgiving... Also I base all my knowledge on the daily show and south park.

Interesting point will read and do some more research . Anyways the thread got kinda derailed into me proving my claims. I wanted to spark the possibilities of mass intention and meditation and what can possibly be accomplished by it. Create matter, move objects, shift dimensions... who knows... summon astral entities. There's a theory that everything is made up of quanta energy and the only way it can materialize into matter or our physical world is for enough people to believe it exists and that's enough for the energy to materialize.