anyone know a tek for Desmanthus Illinoensis? or is it possible to use the dried powdered roots of Desmanthus Illinoensis in the same way i would MHRB? what kind of a yield should i be looking for with say 100g Desmanthus root


also just realized that i have about an acre of ground that i let get overgrown has anyone here attempted to grow Desmanthus Illinoensis indoors or outdoors?

I hear ya. I've ordered live plants from nurserys, I've tried growing from grass seed. I cant get it to survive the winters where I am at.
I always marvled at the idea of mowing the lawn as procurement for more lab work.
If you replace your backyard with reed grass, I'll be your favorite landscaper.

I would do an A/B extraction on the roots, specifically the root bark. I imagine you would need quite a few plants to make a significant harvest. 100g would probably only yield a few doses. Let us know if you ever do.

Oooops... I was thinking of the canary reed grass...
And I've also tried growing Illinois bundleweed. I purchased 3lbs of the seed and I spread it everywhere I went in Colorado. My backyard had 1 flower garden full of the spindly little plants.. My cats loved hanging out under them. I ended up having to move so I dont know how big those plants eventually got or if they survived the winter.
I'll see if I can dig up pics of the cats hanging out in the plants.. It really is a cool plant.
Your effort will not be wasted nursing them.

enjoy!

..as far as i know Johnny Appleseed and others got ok DMT yields from D. illinoensis in the early '90s..
Psychedelic Illuminations magazine (C.A.) put the theoretical yield at 0.3%..
some times of year have been said to be mainly NMT..

most of what i've read does indicate that Desmanthus leptolobus is the stronger species, and more consistent..

(see also Desmanthus Illinoensis Where Are You? thread in General Information https://www.dmt-nexus.me/forum/d...aspx?g=posts&t=23833 in which amor-fati recommends D. leptolobus)

.

I'd use an A/B tek with a defat, I'm not sure if the root bark has any more fats that MH but from all reports it has less DMT so the DMT:fats ratio is almost definitely lower. Hopefully eventually I'll get a chance to experiment on some, only one of my plants is doing well, but it's still pretty small and since i'd be going for the root bark it seems like I'll need a pretty bit plant to make it harvestible. My cat love 'em, ate all the leaves off one poor little sapling.

not wanting NMT

the name of the Desmanthus Illinoensis implies that it is native to this portion of the country although yesterday i went for a walk in the state forest prarie reserve area looking for this plant and didnt see any - assuming that the park authorities forgot to plant this with the other prarie grasses and not that it dont grow in illinois

i cant seem to find much information on where Desmanthus leptolobus grows do you know if it grows in the same climate as the Desmanthus Illinoensis veriety?

I remember reading somewhere that Desmanthus contains an alkaloid that is toxic, I am looking for the thread now, if I find it I will link it. If this is correct, DEFINITELY do an A/B with a defat and ONLY pull with naphtha, better safe than sorry, in all aspects.

..it may contain some Gramine, but this isn't proven to be particularly toxic as far as i know, and is water soluble so easy to remove..

gramine freebase should be insoluble in water, according to merck. Its said to be practically insoluble in pet ether so a naphtha/heptane/hexane re-x (or two or three) should be the best way to separate them I think.

I too am growing this species! I ordered Desmanthus Leptolobus from Shamans-garden and I guess they don't know the difference between the two seeds because Illinois seeds are what I got.
The following is based upon what I've managed to learn by rote from researching on line...none of it is actualy knowledge verifyed by me. Yet .
Yeilds should be about two thirds the size of MHRB yeilds.
Take Endlessnesses advice on the seperation of gramine (thanks for that BTW Endlessness, I've been trying to figure that one out), I've read that it is nasty stuff and can cause brain damage or even death.
Although the root-bark isn't as potent as MHRB, the roots themselves also contain something like .25%-.3% DMT as well.
Desmanthus Leptolobus and Desmanthus Illinoensis share the same natural habitat and occur right next to each othe in the same space in nature.

I read somewhere that the reason those of us who live in the western U.S. don't see them all the time is apperantly because they have been pushed out by hybrid phalaris grasses that are even more invasive and cold hearty.

Desmanthus species can be quite cold hearty and flurish in sandy soil so I imagine wild crafting should be fairly easy, even in Colorado...

I can't seem to figure out how to post pictures to this forum otherwise I'd love to post a picture of my cute little seedlings. A good looking plant that acctualy folds up its' leaves at night and goes to sleep!
On some of them I plan to apply techniques used in the cultivation of horse radish in an attempt to get one big taproot to see if it increases bark and alkali yeild.
Sadly it may take excess of three years before sufficient root bark can be harvest ready...it's ok though with me because I have a growing list of new sources for spice to explore and I just can't belive how little mankind knows about the plants he uses for landscaping in his own front yard! It has inspired me to go back to school for entheo botany!

endlessness wrote

thanks, i was in a rush yesterday, but somewhere on the nex i've seen reference to easy gramine removal, i think..

YTXian wrote

gramine (also found in Phalaris spp) is speculated as having ephdedrine-like effects.. in sheep it was 'psychotropic' at 10-30mg/kg i.v.; it showed oral toxicity at very large doses (400-600mg/kg) leading to death in some animals [Bourke et al 1988]..
..in the amounts present (if at all) in Desmanthus or Phalaris (less than 5% of total alkaloids) it should present no serious toxicity, and be barely (if at all) noticeable..
in the early '90s i heard of or read about several successful D. illinoensis dmt extractions.. root bark was used, A/B was the usual method, solvents varied..
spring vs. fall was said to the the content variance periods, but i don't remember which was highest in DMT..
.

Desmanthus leptolobus is said to to be common in the southern United States, i guess in 'prarie' country..
here's an old Mycotopia thread onh it: https://mycotopia.net/forums/bot...8008-desmanthus-dmt.html
and a couple of photos:

could you send a link of that page im only seeing the Illinoensis veriety for some reason

Well that is very wonderful news. heheh. Well this plant certainly is worth investigating then.:idea:

Caravel said;
'could you send a link of that page im only seeing the Illinoensis veriety for some reason'[/quote]

Well that's just the problem; they are selling Illinoensis under the heading Leptolobus but, if you then read the info under the heading it says "Bundle flower....ect."
I wrote customer service and perhaps they corrected this. I'll have to check. I personaly haven't found a source for Leptolobus. If I do I'll PM you (don't want to violate the forum guildlines by disscussing vendors outside of the vendors area).

BTW; Thanks for the more accurate info on gramine nen888. This is encouraging! I'd still like to find Leptolobus as well.
I'm hoping to post about Delosperma soon as well ...depends on if I'm successful.
Maybe I might end up writing a book about huwasca of the north west US! I've found some promising sources for MAOI and spice all within a one block radius of my house

Which one of these Desmanthuses would tolerate harsher winters? Would any of them survive in northern Europe winters?

nen888; Are you aware that the picture you posted is of Desmanthus Illinoensis? Your post seemed to imply a picture of Desmanthus Leptolobus. Just wanted to clarify for others to ID them who may not know the difference.

..i wasn't actually aware of that thanks YTXian, i haven't studied desmanthus botany much..
here is a good page in Trout's notes on leptolobus http://trout.yage.net/sc/Desmanthus_leptolobus_2.htm
below are, to the best of my knowledge, Desmanthus leptolobus and Desmanthus pernumbucanus,
..perhaps someone growing the plant can shed some light..?