I know its a matter of massive manipulation, without mentioning the "illegalness". Most people let themselves carry for the mainstream statements, and even more people think that if its illegal its incorrect.

but there is a substance beyond simple obediance and mental lazyness. theres a dispite for drugs inherent to most human beings. i have think is a natural self defense against an awareness that could bring down all the mental system most people live in, also, many people are mind purist who think that altering the brain with external substances its unnatural and hence bad.

theres others that think that drugs are a form of decadence of humanity that most be erradicated. there is others that think that drug users are weak people that need to escape from reality for some self estime reasons. there is others that say that drugs supply things on drug users personality that they are lacking and base upon drugs to find what they lack.

theres many reasons but the fact that a big part of world population dispite drugs and even fight against them is there. I would love your thoughts on this.

I don't think people inherently hate drugs...I think arguments of that nature would be found wanting throughout cross-cultural history. The desire to alter consciousness has always been there, going back as far as we have evidence of humans beyond their bones. Hate or fear of drugs is a cultural construct that varies throughout spacetime precisely because it's not inherent.

yes I acknowledge chamans where the first religion on every humanity sprout. im trying to make an analysis about the proportion of people that do relie on drugs in oposition to the proportion of people that think that work for human destruction. Observation of human kind gives me a sense that theres certain animosity towards drugs no matter what age we locate our observation. i think theres inherent enthusiasm as there is aversion..

Why do you believe there is inherent aversion?

Are there any pre-modern societies that had the hate and fear of substances that exist today? Did modern society have these fears and hates 200 years ago? I don't know for sure, but I don't think so...I believe this is a modern phenomenon that fits into the global, state-oriented model of geopolitics that is a product of modern societies.

Well, look at Classical Greek society. Homer was about as square as you could get, the way he whitewashed the behavior of the gods, editing out incest between them from their traditional myths and further rationalizing them from their wilder roots. He was writing for an aristocratic audience at a point that urban centers were cementing their hold on power. The older religious traditions and practices were very much treated as hillbilly. Still, we see the knowledge and use of drugs being treated very respectfully. During the dinner with Telemachus at the house of Meneleus, for example, Helen brings out her knowledge of plants to create a soothing social concoction.

Also, we can't really look at drugs as a cohesive unit. Trafficking illegal drugs in Gabon carries a mandatory death penalty, but the President of the country is a Bwiti, and there are chapels to take Iboga in every major town. In the Ottoman Empire, marijuana was cultivated as a drug while alcohol was prohibited.

People of the world

realize:

you are drugs.

The endogenous neurotransmitter is biosynthesized and flowing withinity.

ok so i deduct there is 2 fronts againts drugs: the persuation from mainstream for people not to use drugs trhough law enforcment and mass manipulation, and, the drug users that DO use drugs for self decadence..

I think modern societies and the modern character structure both have an antagonism to ecstatic states. Like cawila points out, many people all around us have an apparently preconscious aversion to drugs framed in a certain manner. The figure of the addict is so offensive to sensibility due to their giving up of their reasonable control, turning away from what Modernity sees as the very essence of their humanity.

thats a accurate point. Dictatorial Rationalism, thats tha philosophy that reings, everything that is irrational, its judged as plainly dumb, and a waste of time, just because it can be "probed".

Well put, and that's precisely it:


This aversion is akin to any other piece of cultural knowledge/identity I possess; it's mapped onto my own wetware, programmed in by culture. This is not a human aversion to drugs (in the general sense), but a cultural aversion to drugs. In fact, it is within the context of this culture that "drugs" are "framed in a certain manner."

Put another way, people don't hate drugs...cultural hierarchies that need to control people hate drugs. Generally because it makes people harder to control (in some sense; ranging from the mental awareness that psychedelics can create to the physical/mental failings a hard-drug habit can foment).

People fear a loss of control, and many drugs provide exactly that.

...thank god...

This is a tough one. My bro had a raging alcohol problem which caused all sorts of problems, now any time drugs are mentioned, my Mum instantly thinks I will turn out like that. She thinks they are all the same, and won't accept that there are many different types of drugs - or that some of them actually may be beneficial. She also uses the argument "But you have to mix with such HORRIBLE PEOPLE!" - erm... I buy weed from a student, who gets it from hippies / other students who grow weed - is that bad?! Are they horrible?! And I buy ethnobotanicals legally, don't see the crime there, or having to deal with any ropey characters. Indeed I have, in the past had dealings with dodgy people, but that is all part of the learning curve, no? OF COURSE you will get nasty people selling drugs if you make them illegal! You would get nasty people selling tea bags if you made them illegal, it's the nature of things!

Point being, people don't always see the truth, their judgement is clouded by decades of propaganda, brainwashing etc, and one or two bad experiences for some people mean a life time of mistrust of ALL altered states of concioussnes. My Mum is a very intelligent lady, but will stubbornly opose my opinions for as long as I care to argue the point, which these days is not much, as soon as the subject comes up I will divert it now. She knows I will do what I want regardless.

People don't trust anything that threatens the equilibrium of our societies. Psychadelics have this mind opening ability, to show us that most of our so called better life is in fact a delusion. Governments and religions have worked very hard at getting the message across that drugs are evil, because if everyone did take psychadelic drugs they would realise that it's not the drugs that are evil, but governments and religions that usually are.

--Governments and religions like to keep their populations dumb, and in the dark. Then they have power over us. Their "drugs are evil " campaigns are slowly being seen for the cover up that they are, though.....

normal people hate drugs

ofcourse we are not on that list

but the reason normal people hate drugs is because they don't like to see us happy , smiling , stoned and enjoying our lives and living it well , while they have to suffer the burden of their reality ,
this is it , this is the reason why they hate drugs

also normal people believe drugs to be a harder version of alcohol , since thats what most of them come across , since alcohol impairs a persons ability to function in a working enviornment (no doubt artists can even funtion under litres of alcohol), normal people believe those who do drugs must be impaired in their functioning and prone to errors , this is not the case for champions of the entheogenic age

People do what they are told to do, they are told to hate drugs so of course they hate drugs.

If someone told people it was ok to eat babies then everyone would eat babies, it´s sickening but true.

Just look at nazi germany.

Well there are many drugs that do harm to society and the user and it's ridiculous to separate alcohol from drugs. Well how many people can actually say that amphetamines, cocaine, heroin etc. are good?

Entheogens are good and I think they should be classified as far away from drugs as possible.

tELE, you hit the nail on the head there!!

---if everyone took psychadelics, people would start to leave the stressful city for the country, and all the "office loving fools" would be all lonely in their stuffy offices-that is why drugs are illegal!

Well, cocaine and heroine have rather helpful medicinal uses.

You could argue amphetamines have kept soldiers (and truckers) alive in various situations.

As with "drugs", "good" is a relative position that changes based on perspective/circumstances.

Personally I hate drugs because they make me feel good and broaden my mind.

I don't think that the "governments brainwash people" arguments actually explain very much at all. If you look at Victorian England, recreational drug use was completely legal and tolerated amongst the aristocracy and upper classes - there still was a huge social stigma regarding it.

Government as the primary agent also doesn't explain the speed with which prohibition movements tend to gain support throughout a population. A significant portion of the drug using populace go out of their way to look and behave erratically.

I think, again, that it's less about drugs per say, as it is ecstatic states. One particularly point, the social rituals for alcohol use in the industrialized world direct its use away from the ecstasy it's quite able to produce. When the ecstatic force does break loose, it has no larger context to contain the energies, making it even easier for the larger community to demand control.

Like Snozz says, these are cultural conventions that highjack the emotional centers regarding revulsion and disgust. The historical development of the phenomena points completely away from it being a consciously directed method of manipulation. Archaeological evidence suggests festival regulations develop alongside agriculture. That hits its peak with the Roman empire, who were extremely strict in government control of cults. Urbanization probably became a driving force, with cultural conformity helping to regulate stress on a brain which evolved to deal with a couple hundred people over a lifetime.

Theories for mass manipulation didn't really get off the ground until Machiavelli and Giordano Bruno. We can see when governments begin to attempt using them intentionally, as they tended to be pretty (ham|heavy) handed.

If you think things are bad now, just wait until the age of cheap energy ends.