Hi guys,
im wondering if the tryptamine DMT and the beta carboline Harmalas create issues with male fertility. I havent found any material out there, for or against. Ive read several times that DMT (and possibly harmalas) intercalate the DNA (but nothing negative was noted), and I know Peganum harmala can reduce fertility, but I am not interested in the harmalas from Peganum.

If anyone has anything helpful to contribute, it would be appreciated,

Thanks!

Peganum harmala reducing fertility? Since when? a couple of alkaloids from peganum harmala (vasicine/deoxyvasicine/vasicinone) are uterotonic and abortifacient, so they might indeed prevent/interrupt pregnancy, but first of all they can easily be removed from a peganum harmala solution by doing a salt precipitation (Check harmala extraction guide in the wiki), and also this shouldnt be anything in long term. And once you have pure harmalas, it doesnt matter the source (rue or caapi), harmalas are harmalas (in different ratios and rue usually with little or no THH, but in terms of health effects as you ask, it wont really be different)

Regarding dmt intercalating with dna, not that I know of, its harmalas that do this but what exactly it means is unknown. Again, there is no evidence of reduced fertility, people that participate regularly in ayahuasca ceremonies have no problem to have babies, same with indigenous peple

since this:

"Peganum harmala is an abortifacient,[21] and, in large quantities, it can reduce spermatogenesis and male fertility in rats.[22]"

21. ^ a b c www.thenook.org
22. ^ El-Dwairi QA, Banihani SM (Jun 2007). “Histo-functional effects of Peganum harmala on male rat’s spermatogenesis and fertility”. Neuro Endocrinol Lett. 28 (3): 305–10. PMID 17627267.

oh ... and here

http://www.cabdirect.org...stracts/20093336756.html

Those poor rats!The doses given to them would be calculated on a mg/kg of bodyweight basis and Im sure if a man was to recieve an equivalent dose then adverse MAOI effects would overshadow any effects on spermatogenesis.Ethically this is not a practical endeavor.

These kinds of studies require caution when extrapolating between one species and another.A few years back an oral contraceptive pill (DIANETTE) was found to cause tumors in rats livers but again, they were given industrial-sized doses which a human would never experience under normal circumstances.

jesus christ.

i thought this community would provide useful information, not idiots regurgitating useless speculation.
i highly suggest you two refrain from posting on health threads, or any for that matter, without not only having a bare minimum of an idea, but also sources to back your claims as ive wasted more than enough time correcting you, i should be a damn mod.

corpus, not only did i display that peganum was highly destructive to fertility, but i also suggest you give this a read, this will set you right on extrapolating doses from different species

http://www.fasebj.org/content/22/3/659.full
there are PLENTY of other information out there as to why different species are given different mg/kg doses. be informed before you reply with useless garbage.

there should be an addition to forum rules "if you dont know the answer, mention you are speculating or do not reply".

...and this is why we have the nursery

xoanon-thanks for the link on BSA, but theres no need for such belligerence .Did you note at the bottom of the link you posted it implies BSA is a better measure for use in extrapolating between species.I dont doubt this but it also implies that this measure cannot be regarded as THE definitive measure which still leaves some room for uncertainty.

Have a look at this link:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11393581

This suggests that, extrapolating from high dose observations to lower doses effects are linear is innacurate-as your liking for BSA as a measure concurs with- but there are additional factors between species which will still possibly confound any results due to a number of different possible mechanisms of effect in the different species. So, BSA may be better than a measure using a 'mg/kg (adjusted)' approach but this is still not enough to make intraspecies extrapolatory data conclusive or 100% accurate.

If you dont agree with something in this community, you can calmly and respectfully voice your disagreement, explain why rationally. Attacks such as this are completely out of line with the Nexus attitude, so if you want to continue being a member of this forum I suggest you reconsider how you express yourself.

lol lol lol

thanks for your outstanding contribution to this thread integralsoul. ive been helpful and friendly in every other post, i was just hoping for real answers to a serious question ...

at least i got you guys thinking ...