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Mixing mushroom enzymes with tryptamines Options
 
Mindlusion
#21 Posted : 1/15/2019 5:23:38 PM

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Loveall wrote:
If a bio-transformation did happen, what could it give? Melatonin is interesting because the nitrogen that attaches to the acetyl group seems prime for methylation, similar to how tryptamine gets its second methylation when transforming to psilocin. One bio transformation possibility is shown below consisting of two simple steps (see first image where melatonin is in the first row, and the ~equivalent psilocin steps are in the second row).

Mass-spec would show a peak in the 262-264 range (see second image). It could be named 4-OH-5-MEO-MACT (where MACT = MethylACetylTryptamine). A close relative to it could be 4-HO-5-MeO-DMT.

To be clear, this is not a claim of a result, only discussing one of the possibilities there could be.


I doubt you will be seeing any N methylation on melatonin

NHAc is an amide and NH2 or NHMe are amines.

The enzymes for N-methylation are only for amines. Amides are a very different functional group, they are non basic (pka ~17) and very stable functional groups that are not easily cleaved. The properties of the amine are also vital for receptor binding in the brain, so that N-acetylated tryptamines or phenethylamines are not active psychedelics (unless first deacetylated invivo, maybe a pathway for melatonin).

Though as we have discussed in length, the other transformations are very possible.
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Good quality Syrian rue (Peganum harmala) for an incredible price!
 
Loveall
#22 Posted : 1/15/2019 6:04:48 PM

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Thanks Mindlusion, makes sense.
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Mindlusion
#23 Posted : 1/15/2019 10:24:02 PM

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Loveall wrote:
Thanks Mindlusion, makes sense.


Ah I missed that the suggestion for this product was from the mass spec peak at 264 m/z

The resolution isn't very good, it could be 263 (M+1).

and i was wrong before there are enzymes that can methylate amides, a quick google search told me so.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih...pmc/articles/PMC3391011/

Perhaps not the N-methyl transferase that is the same for amines , but another enzyme.

Its the only real suggestion I can think of based on that data
Expect nothing, Receive everything.
"Experiment and extrapolation is the only means the organic chemists (humans) currrently have - in contrast to "God" (and possibly R. B. Woodward). "
He alone sees truly who sees the Absolute the same in every creature...seeing the same Absolute everywhere, he does not harm himself or others. - The Bhagavad Gita
"The most beautiful thing we can experience, is the mysterious. The source of all true art and science."
 
Loveall
#24 Posted : 1/15/2019 10:44:43 PM

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My bad, I just aluded to the MS. Below is the screen capture from Benz. This is preliminary and not confirmed, Benz would need to weigh in. The peak at 198 is background mobile phase I believe. For completeness also adding Dreamer's TLC (interesting spot would be on the top left).

Edit: looks like the images did not uplad properly sorry. Trying again.



Loveall attached the following image(s):
4356_ff7b83d1-4665-452f-8fc3-8ac2c793b7f3_IMG_5910.jpg (2,973kb) downloaded 81 time(s).
6837_c2658768-5253-4b24-8793-a7466c50db89_tlc.jpg (1,355kb) downloaded 80 time(s).
4356_ff7b83d1-4665-452f-8fc3-8ac2c793b7f3_IMG_5910.jpg (2,973kb) downloaded 52 time(s).
6837_c2658768-5253-4b24-8793-a7466c50db89_tlc.jpg (1,355kb) downloaded 53 time(s).
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