Art I think you misunderstood me, I dont think her understanding DMT should be a relationship breaker, I do however believe that if you can not be yourself, good bad or ugly, then you are in the wrong relationship. Just my experience.

To me, being a parent is passing on my knowledge and experience to my children. When they are old enough to understand, I hope you reconsider speaking with them. Better from you than someone else that doesnt know shit about drugs. In the words of Yoda, 'The force runs strong in your family, Pass on what you have learned..." Don't let them grow up not knowing the truth about life. Show them it is all just a ride.

Regarding what LLB says, who fucking cares? You wont get everyone's approval so I suggest you do yourself a favor and simply not respond to him. Thats how he is entertained. Beyond tek assistance, or sharing DMT trips/spiritual awakenings, why would you or anyone for that matter give a two squirts of shit what people think? Let alone idiots on the internet? I don't know LLB and I don't know you and honestly I don't care, just saying let it go and if he responds, ignore him. Clearly talking down to people is something you both enjoy. You could be friends outside of these forums and own people up together heh.

I do wish you luck sir.

I don't think it has a single thing to do with approval. My agreement with LLB's statement has nothing to do with the measure of good deeds or any shit of that nature. Where did that come into play? Selfishness doesn't = your actions, but rather your motive behind your actions. I certainly didn't sense the condescending tone, either. You're response to the post just furthered the effect of his statements, IMO. Sometimes the things you need to hear most are the things you want to immediately shut out.

But I wish you best of luck, my friend. You are the keeper of your own destiny - and you know what is best.

you gotta give it to my boy.....he sure can wield an e-pen. LLB- though nothing was said between Art and myself, i KNEW you weren't gonna get away with that post of yours without getting an earful from senor D'lay. and in truth he does have an extremely valid point here. he more than owned up to every possible culpability right from the word boo in his initial post. calling the dude selfish and digging into him about "excuses", etc......bro, have you not READ any of his posts before?? the man could be a professional writer if he wanted and you're gonna give him a 2nd grade-level chastisement complete with horrible grammar and muddy overall point?

...like i said....i knew THAT wasn't gonna fly.....

now then- to play peacemaker and hopefully bring this thread back onto the track it was originally meant to be on. our brother Art- an INCREDIBLY intelligent, self-aware dude...poured his heart out to his family here on the nexus and essentially stated that after thoughtful reflection he decided that he was not coming correct with the spice. so he's taking a break. his post is about as honest and from the heart as anything i've read on this site thus far. i, for one, support such a step towards healing and i do so SANS berating diatribes adding to what is clearly spelled out to be an extremely challenging situation that would have many lesser folk making far less wise and soulful decisions.

in short, LLB- before "altruism" there must be COMPASSION. if you can't show this in everything you post, perhaps you are letting your gums flap before your soul has had a chance to piece together something to help "forward the family".

....and yes, i would get ANY of my friends' backs that i felt were unjustly (or just plain unintelligently) ripped on. i'm all about us helping each other find our way with as much compassion as can be applied visa vie their particular situation. that whole "tough love" shit would have only been apropos if Art had NOT chosen to TAKE RESPONSIBILITY for what he saw he was doing.

LOVE AND GRATITUDE!!

Wa da da dang
Wa da da da dang - Ay!
Listen to my 9 millimeter go bang!

Talk about leaving with a bang. See you later/soon alligator, all the best.

Damnit!

I can't even view the rest of the first page of this at work because there are too many cuss words.

ART, LLB can you two clean this up as soon as you can.

How did just a great post diminish into this kind of bickering? Damn guys that's just sad.

It's not sad, it's discussion that ended up in name-calling and the like. Which is understandable, though... this is far beyond discussion about the experience of spice, or how to smoke it... it's about someones life. Someone who had 'the balls' to put it all out there. It's very commendable... it's very personal... and like said before, I do really appreciate the post (actually, ALL of your posts).

Compassion is something I believe we all [hopefully] share here. With each other, with everyone. I can't speak for LLB but I don't believe he was trying to barade our man Art here but rather attempt to help him find the root of his 'problem'. Yes, it was harsh, but that's the route he took to explain his thoughts. This didn't vibe well with Art, which is also understandable... nobody knows a person better than that person themselves, and that obviously wasn't the right solution, or path to the solution.

Nothing more needs to be said here, I believe. Nothing more beyond good wishes for Art.

W&B you are a wise and righteous brother. thanks for your poignant awareness and compassion. and LLB- i have read many of your posts that have elicited a thankful, loving response from none other than myself. i know you are, at your core, a solid human on a similar path of trying to be a righteous part of the great whole. i'm sure we all (including Art) appreciate the underlying intent of helping a brother in need.....

...sometimes we ALL miss the mark and try a strategy that doesn't best fit the problem. that, i believe, is all that happened here.

BARKEEP! A ROUND OF LOVE AND COMPASSION FOR ALL MY FRIENDS HERE!


L&G!

The guy was already repentant and has realised he's overdoing it. That's why he was getting encouragement. Although personally I think he has a right to his little secrets, it's not like he's sleeping around (even if he were, there are even philosophical arguments for this, if he isn't endangering her health and ensures his forays aren't discovered, honestly, think about it, it's an interesting question... aren't we all entitled to experience all we can in our short lives if it doesn't hurt others... and what you don't know doesn't hurt you...). If you've got an addictive personality and have the urge to get wasted I'd say DMT is a pretty good choice- at least it doesn't take up too much time and doesn't mess you or your family up as much as the alternatives. Better than booze, heroin, crack, meth, gambling, prostitute etc. I can understand her worry considering the implied past problems, I guess her lack of knowledge of DMT is the problem here. It is a tricky situation. But not a black-and-white one.

I don't agree with the notion that one should 'put others before themselves'. Even Jesus said to look after yourself. This notion of being a social martyr is done by people who ENJOY being self-righteous and ENJOY making themselves miserable! Or alternatively, by people with incredibly low self-esteem who don't feel worthy of life, and need to learn to love themselves. Ask yourself why you want to serve others and not yourself, like a slave.
And ask why it is you think others should do the same. What would it be like if that was the norm? "Here, you have the last piece of cake" "No, you have it" "It's ok, I don't mind, go on, enjoy yourself" "I feel sick, I think you should" etc (both pissed off because they couldn't play the martyr). Share the stupid cake!! Eventually I learnt just to accept immediately when people try this on me. Sometimes, the look on their faces when you realise they wanted it really but just wanted to make a show of their politeness. This gives me immense satisfaction. I feel like I'm teaching them to be honest and stop hiding behind their mask. Most people live behind masks. The happiest people have shed them, only putting them on when it is absolutely necessary to deal with the mask wearers on their own turf.
Your first duty is to yourself, your second to others. It's relative of course, I'm not saying to be selfish. I'm just saying be careful not to turn into one of those pious people who wouldn't even accept a free drink from a rich man, and makes everyone feel bad for trying to be generous and brings them down with thei martyrdom trip. Putting everyone else before yourself can be an excuse to not LIVE life, being too scared to live, too scared of failure so deliberately surrendering for the 'benefit' of others.
When someone offers you something out of genuine generosity, it actually makes them happier when you accept. And if they're not being genuine, more fool them for playing their games.
Anyway, that's what I think about that, that's my martyrdom rant out the way. I love you really! I love everyone!
(Except truly selfish people, who poison Native's rivers with oil and gold. I shant shed a tear when they get the swine flu. Is that bad? Or just honest?)

Lastly, someone said they wouldn't want their kids to know. If I ever have kids, I'm gonna sit them down once they're old enough to get offered drugs and give them the run down. Don't go near this or this or this, uncle Steve got messed up on that, Auntie Ruth on this... but mescaline, ayawaska, DMT... these are true teachers my children!

Oops it had all ended then I chipped in, sorry!

WOW!

Only child, or just an asshole?

WS

Nope I have a sister! Haha what does that mean anyway? Because only childs are meant to be spoilt? I'm not trying to start a fight, I'm just saying what I'm thinking. It'd be boring otherwise. That was th train of thought that came out of my mind and I'm glad to hear what you think of it

I wouldn't've said all that if I didn't think it was what needed to be said, and if I minded people discussing what I said. Would you elaborate please? I don't see why you find it so offensive that I've questioned the cultural status quo.

What interesting roads this thread is taking... I'm greatly enjoying it... *sits down with glass of water and a bowl...*

yeah WS, whats up with that? I think he was very reasonable and didnt wrote in an offensive manner. Why you call him an asshole?

Just think about the reaction a person would have to your post, and if it is constructive in any way...

If you feel he is mistaken in something, then go ahead and tell him, im sure he is very open to criticism.

Further explanation is definitely needed. We all know what happens when one assumes...

seeeeeeeriously! i absolutely identified and AGREE with ohayoco's post! LOTS of truth in it. WS- that is just the kind of lack of compassion in response i was talking about earlier. agree to disagree for the love of buddha people! namaste!!! as in- i recognize the god that is within you. i recognize that you and i are NOT two separate things!! would you say that crap to YOURSELF??

...and fwiw- i have FIVE siblings and could NOT be MORE in complete alignment with ohayoco's post!!

LOVE AND GRATITUDE!!

and i ALSO agree W&B, this thread has truly jumped down an INTRIGUING rabbit-hole!!

No offense, but that is EXACTLY what being closed minded is... being intelligent but not willing to assimilate something that is outside their confront zone.

You wife may be smart, but she is also ignorant in the area of entheogens. I'm not saying tell your wife, I'm just saying that you need to accept that she IS close minded and believes something that is completely irrational and uninformed.

My mom is the same way... but I love her, I just think she is part stupid (or ignorant or brain-washed or whatever you wanna call it).

Remember... no offense.

Phew, incredible heat in this thread. If only I could tare W&B's shirt off and ravage his mind!

Back on point --

Art, thank you for sharing your experience. Being as honest and forthcoming as you were is refreshing and appreciated by some. Also, thank you for taking the time to write out your thoughts in an eloquent manner. Best of luck to you and your abstinence. I hope you find what you seek.

compassion comes in both wrathful and benevolent flavors... just given a bit of the latter...
take it however you wish... no sweat off my back...