I think endlessness just stated part of the problem: acetic acid vs HCl. All the various references use acetic (Fish, Ghoshal, Trout, etc.). Also note that DMT and the oxide acetates are soluble in chloroform and possibly also DCM.

I've run this reaction on a rootbark extract and it does quite a number on the red tannins which precipitate out of solution with the addition of a base. The reaction occurred quickly and you could watch the top of the solution turning back to red with exposure to O2.

I wouldn't write off zinc just yet.

-D.

LOVE THEM OXIDES

such a light and easy trip as compared to N,N. Yet so visual and beatiful still. Almost feels recreational ?

SWIM been getting sizeable amounts of it without any conversion teks. It is a byproduct of many extractions with calcium /sodium hydroxide as mentioned by Benzyme. Swim hasn't brought it up yet since he has the impression that without chromatography its of no use trying to speculate what you've actually got(red, yellow, oily, jungle, etc... mostly DMT with variying levels of impurities). The thead however perfectly describes what swim been getting.

This is how he gets it using Q2121 TEK:


First time he got it by accident was when he left his CaOH cake sit in naptha(3rd pull) for over a month, with some heating up every few days in a hot water bath. -

**Important point about SWIM's naptha: VM&P Crown brand Naptha, which I speculate is a very very light aliphatic naptha. It never ever turns darker than lightish-tinge of yellow even during hot STB extractions with lotsa LYE. It just doesn't pick up that many impurities.**

-He then evapped naptha to 1/2, and did standard freeze precip. When he poured out the naptha outta his pyrex he did not pour it out fully but had to leave bottom 5-10% because some crystals were loose. It seemed like a very small amount of naptha on the bottom covering the crystals, however as the glass warmed up from icy to Room-temp it seemed like more crystals "defrosted" into this otherwise small amount of naptha so it seemed like more naptha had to be evapped and less crystal remained.

He evapped this thing over 3 days... near a heatsource. Smell of naptha went away pretty quickly actually its just this clear-oil which looked like un-evapped naptha kept sitting on top. Finally this clear-oil was just poured out directly from there leaving crystals behind. Made some enhanced leaf with this oil and he reports experiences were very much unlike N,N intensity wise while the visuals were outta control.

It seems like in a "tek" like this some N,N would migrate into this oxide-oil the way SWIM did it. Perhaps that smallish amount of N,N is important to potentiate otherwise weak oxide, as far as other members report ? Similar to bufo-changa idea where N,N is present to activate/syngergise otherwise weak bufo.


This way can also be modified to shorted the basification time. SWIM simply made a Q2121-cake of soupy consistancy and let it sit on the stove in stainless steel pot with closed lid for maybe half a day. Temp was hot enough to see some steam coming off but definately below simmering. Water was added from time to time to keep it wet enough. 1st pull after that had quite a fair amount of oxide-oil in it, using the technique above.

I have done something similar once: thread.

I did like the outcome, and I did use acetic acid. There is some new data on this coming soon, there is just some more deciding to do about how much zinc to use.

Peace!

I tried doing some oxidation of DMT using h2o2 and it seems to have created more than just dmt n-oxide. I will redo the experiment soon with a propper control test too. Here's the thread with some of the discussion:

https://www.dmt-nexus.me...aspx?g=posts&t=29425

Maybe thats why the zinc didnt reduce it back properly, because its not only forming n-oxide but other unreduceable by-products?

Hydrogen peroxide oxidation likely goes by a radical mechanism and from what I've read will in general produce an amine oxide. However, indole substrates are unique, and side-reactions always occur off paper and in the real world.

Quick note about why we must be very careful with our nomenclature here while researching this.

SYNTHESIS OF SUBSTITUTED INDOLES VIA INDOLINES
1967 Russ. Chem. Rev. 36 753
M. N.Preobrazhenskaya



354. The structure of folicanthine. Part II
H. F. Hodson and G. F. Smith
J. Chem. Soc., 1957, 1877-1880
DOI: 10.1039/JR9570001877

This paper reveals they are speaking about a methyl group on the amine, and one on the indole nitrogen. Which is a pretty different compound then the nn-dmt we are all familiar with.


I haven't really looked into it but sodium hydrosulfite aka dithionite may be a bit better as a reducing agent. It is of course OTC and safe to use with-in reason as well.