Hello!

First of all: this is just a hypothetical question. So dont worry, I would not ingest now something based on the results that people may give here.

So what I was wondering ages about is that Tryptamines are MOSTLY safe with Harmalas, but all those Members of the MDMA / Speed / ... category are unsafe, causing Serotonine Syndrome.

Now it was still mentioned sometimes that Cacti is safe with Harmalas.

Meaning that the Combination of Mescaline + Harmalas = OK

I found this very strange as it is still a Phenylethylamine, but I was told the following:


Phenylethylamines are metabolized by MAO A + MAO B. And Harmalas only inhibit MAO A. Therefore you dont get a Serotonine Syndrome.

Amphetamines are slightly different and dont seem to fit into MAO B and therefore are only metabolized by MAO A. As it gets inhibited with Harmalas you will get a chance of a Serotonine Syndrome, making it unsafe.

Ok! So basic Phenylethylamines are still safe, only if they get the additional Methyl group - making them amphetamines - they become unsafe.


But doesnt that mean that 2C-B / 2C-I / ... are also safe with Harmalas?

This simply sounds strange to me, as they are 100 % chemical drugs and I was simply not expecting something like a safe interaction between Harmalas and a pure synthetic component, very similar to MDMA and so on ...






AND there is a second question, now back to Mescaline:

If Harmalas dont totally inhibit the break down of Mescaline, then why even bother taking Harmalas with them? I mean ... if they are still metabolized by MAO B, then why is there even a reason to take Harmalas?

Or is there a SLIGHT fortification by Harmalas, which is simply giving a very tiny boost of the experience? This would be my only guess ...

THXXX

all phenethylamines exhibit some activity in monoamine release or inihbition, it is normally just too low to be significant. This goes for all drugs in general, its a matter of ratios, vs something being active or completely inactive.

Some phenethylamines are more active in monoamine release and inhibition than others, but the data isn't fully collected, or at least its scattered across many different publications, would be in our interest to compile all of that data. I have sourced and recorded a lot of it, but i'd have to do some digging to get it posted on here.

The more active phenethylamines in monoamine release and inhibition appear to be the 2C-T-X series, with the 3-carbon analogues, ALEPHs seem to be highly potent serotonin releasing agents, while also being amphetamines, making them quite dangerous and unpredictable (more similar in action to PMA or 4-TA).

The 2C-X (X = halogen) are less so, but 2C-I and 2C-B carry more of this activity. On this fact alone, I would not combine MAO inhibitors with 2C-I or 2C-B. Part of this activity of 2C-B, while also being only a partial 5-ht2a agonist, is thought to be the reasons for its empathogenic effects.

But yea, pharmacology is complicated, every single molecule/ligand/drug, is a mixed bag.

Ah ok thx so far!

Yes indeed I read something about compounds from the 2C-T-... family that have caused death based on their sole use. I remember that there was a chemist who was in search for MDMA alternatives for psycho therapy and he came up with a new phenylethylamines on top of shulgin's work, but then there were deaths associated with compounds sold on the internet that he originally invented and he had to give up on all of this ...

I'm pretty sure this compounds that could cause fatalities solely on their own looked somehow like the 2C-T-...-ones, but I dont remember furthermore ;o