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Few questions about House/Jorkest Resin Tek Options
 
swissmist
#1 Posted : 12/6/2009 1:30:42 AM
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I have a few lingering questions about the Resin tek....

1. Dried v. Fresh: House and most others are apparently using fresh chunks. I have dried Torch chips. does the tek work equally well for dried vs. fresh material?

2. PH level: The amount of water and acid aren't specified in the tek, so I'm assuming the exact ph isn't important? In A/B teks, it's my understanding that the NaOH basified water assists in breaking down the cellular structure of the plant. Does the citric acid in the resin tek do the same thing? And if so, wouldn't it hold true then that the higher the acidity the better--quicker to break down the material?

3. Repeated extracts yield more?: I did my extraction as per the tek but then out of fear that some of the goodies were still in the drained pulp, I resoaked. The 2nd batch of water/lemon still tastes extremely bitter--is this indication that alkaloids are still present?

Archea over on the Nook.org wrote:

Quote:
One interesting tidbit;
mescaline salts as found in the plants cross cell membranes easily in solution.
The blending/shredding/powdering of plants in my experience is often redundant and not needed, it liberates far more waxy materials and doesn't seem to provide a clear advantage.

Then again I use a simple concentration gradient method:
Say you have 1 given volume of cactus with a concentration of 1%.
You cover it with an equal volume of water with low to no TDS to begin with.
Let it sit for a time, this allows the concentration of soluble molecules, in this case an alkaloid, to reach equal concentration in the solution, heat can accelerate this but can also degrade the plant matter introducing more lipids and other junk into solution.
After sitting for a time in an equal volume of water the concentration of the plant reaches 1/2 of 1% or 0.5%.
Repeat the process and you get 0.25%
Repeat again and you get 0.125%
Again and you get 0.0625 %

If you have 4X the volume of the cactus to begin with the initial method results 75% of the soluble alkaloids in solution.
so 1% becomes 0.25% and a repeat results in 0.0625%.
The alkaloid in solution is easy to recover, I have not tried boiling filtering and freezing the solution obtained thus, but that may precipitate crystals due to the citric acid present in the cacti. However one can boil the solution to concentrate it, this results in the reverse of the process, thus if the total concentration is 0.25% by reducing the volume with boiling the concentration increases, decrease the volume by 1/2 and the concentration doubles to 0.5% and so on.

One can easily confirm this method, put a few thick slices of cactus into an equal volume of water and let them sit overnight, as long as it is not too cold you will notice the water becomes bitter with alkaloid, however there is little to no slime and very little green/brown chlorophyll.

Imagine you had 500lbs of cactus, hypothetically of course.
If you had a large barrel you could put the coarsely chopped plant material to soak, then draw off the solution after hours to a day or two and then repeat while concentrating the solution by boiling it down. When the plant and the water have no bitterness there is no need to repeat, this is easy to test, taste the water and taste the plant material. This method works well for freeze damaged material and allows large quantities of cacti to be processed.
One can take the solution obtained from the soak and boil it down into smaller volume, this volume can be placed into a single extraction vessel and extracted via normal STB and A/B methods.

This method lacks a name, but is related to osmosis and serial dilution.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osmosis
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serial_dilution


Which leads me to believe that repeat soaks/extractions might still yield additional alkaloids. Am I mistaken in this?

And finally...

4. Heat: I'm still fuzzy on critical temps during the extraction--Seems like I've read conflicting thoughts--boil the liquid vs. don't boil the liquid. Use heat to aid in evaporation vs. don't use heat. Bottom line--how sensitive are the alkaloids to heat? Is there a temp threshold that I need to stay under during the various phases of extraction?

Thanks for any help!


 

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psychosisdoses
#2 Posted : 12/21/2009 1:47:45 PM

Derek


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swissmist wrote:


1. Dried v. Fresh: House and most others are apparently using fresh chunks. I have dried Torch chips. does the tek work equally well for dried vs. fresh material?


yes i use dried torch chips and it works AMAZINGLY well

be sure to do multiple cooks evapping each separately and testing each for potency
my most recent batch iv done 3 cooks all of which yielded potent resin i am on the fourth now ill let you know when i am done but id expect it to be just as potent..


swissmist wrote:

2. PH level: The amount of water and acid aren't specified in the tek, so I'm assuming the exact ph isn't important? In A/B teks, it's my understanding that the NaOH basified water assists in breaking down the cellular structure of the plant. Does the citric acid in the resin tek do the same thing? And if so, wouldn't it hold true then that the higher the acidity the better--quicker to break down the material?

for each cook of roughly 250g chips i used a third of a lemon squeezed
that seems to do the trick

swissmist wrote:

3. Repeated extracts yield more?: I did my extraction as per the tek but then out of fear that some of the goodies were still in the drained pulp, I resoaked. The 2nd batch of water/lemon still tastes extremely bitter--is this indication that alkaloids are still present?

yes do multiple cooks to get it all evaping and testing each separate so you know when to stop

swissmist wrote:

4. Heat: I'm still fuzzy on critical temps during the extraction--Seems like I've read conflicting thoughts--boil the liquid vs. don't boil the liquid. Use heat to aid in evaporation vs. don't use heat. Bottom line--how sensitive are the alkaloids to heat? Is there a temp threshold that I need to stay under during the various phases of extraction?

i keep my cooks at about 140 degrees thats all thats needed

good luck man and ENJOY! any other questions id be happy to help
"once youve locked yourself into a serious drug collection the tendency is to push it as far as you can..." - hunter s. thompson

~~~~~~~~...You are me and i am you, i will always be with you...~~~~~~~~IAmUsWeYouMe~~~~~~~~
‹maxzar100› YOU are like acid
‹mattimus› dosesdosingdoses
 
Bancopuma
#3 Posted : 12/21/2009 11:37:16 PM

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Hey psychosisdoses,

Dude, MANY thanks for this info...am just about to embark on the resin tek, like you guys, using dried torch chips, so this was very useful and morale boosting info to find Very happy
 
۩
#4 Posted : 12/22/2009 1:30:54 AM

.

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I wrote it out obscurely because I wanted to put emphasis on listening to your brew. A lot can be learned from it.
Someone should try to acquire xtals from dried chips.

once acquired, it's highly recommended not to eat it too often.
I think it's something that should be consumed in a massive quantity very rarely, rather than microdosing every day.


I recommend Bai Ji Li as an after-xtract tonic for hormonal balance and overall good feeling medicine.
 
psychosisdoses
#5 Posted : 12/22/2009 1:38:20 AM

Derek


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۩ wrote:

Someone should try to acquire xtals from dried chips.



i did try pretty hard
first cook was very short at about 90F
but no just got some SUPER potent resin Smile
cant knock that though..

seems you need fresh for said xtls


of course bancopuma you are VERY welcome it touches my heart when my words are received right.. after all thats why i am here Smile

"to keep my health to do my work to love to live to see to it that i gain and grow and give and give! never to look behind me for an hour never to wait in weakness nor to brag in power always working searching for more truth more light always writing teaching what i found GOOD AND RIGHT! robbed starved beaten fallen wide astray back with the full truth iv learned back to the way!"

much peace and love friends ♥
"once youve locked yourself into a serious drug collection the tendency is to push it as far as you can..." - hunter s. thompson

~~~~~~~~...You are me and i am you, i will always be with you...~~~~~~~~IAmUsWeYouMe~~~~~~~~
‹maxzar100› YOU are like acid
‹mattimus› dosesdosingdoses
 
Phlux-
#6 Posted : 12/22/2009 3:52:54 AM

The Root

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Bai Ji Li - as in the chinese maoi'ish thorn ?
antrocles wrote:
...purity of intent....purity of execution....purity of experience...

...unlike the "blind leading the blind". we are more akin to a group of blind-from-birth people who have all simultaneously been given the gift of sight but have no words or mental processing capabilites to work with this new "gift".

IT IS ONLY TO THE EXTENT THAT WE ARE WILLING TO EXPOSE OURSELVES OVER AND OVER AGAIN TO ANNIHILATION THAT WE DISCOVER THAT PART OF OURSELVES THAT IS INDESTRUCTIBLE.


Quote:
‹Jorkest› the wall is impenetrable as far as i can tell


Quote:
‹xtechre› cheese is great


He who packs ur capsules - controls your destiny.

 
۩
#7 Posted : 12/22/2009 4:41:41 AM

.

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Phlux- wrote:
Bai Ji Li - as in the chinese maoi'ish thorn ?


Yes sir. AKA Goatshead.
1tbs low dose, 2tbs high. (tea)
 
 
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