Saludos a todos

Been experimenting with this wonderful brew. I even have shared it with some close relatives and friends and neither me or any of them have reported any of the dark, demonic or infraworld visions usually reported in some threads around here.
But we all have experienced the purge and the body load. For me purge happened only in three experiences but it seems to be de rigeour for first timers.

The answer you are seeking is one you are not likely to find. Because the ingredients to a hoama brew are a closely guarded secret, and most of the ingredients are for the specific purpose of reducing body load and increasing the positive nature of the experience.

I do know two of the ingredients though, honey and salt, try brewing with a good amount of honey in there and see if that helps! Would be curious as to what you think

Secret? I've never heard anything about such, can you give references to this please?

* * *

Nuance:

A premature purge is nothing like a healing purge, difference is timing.
The premature purge is like within one hour after take of, I hate that LOL. It seriously compromises the following depth potential. This purge comes from a superficial level.

The healing purge comes like 2 hours+ after ingestion and happens when the heat is already powerful on, and depth potential is not affected anymore, this purge comes from very deep and is very nasty with MHRB, even more nasty than ayahuasca LOL.

I'd do anything to prevent the premature purge, but welcome the healing purge in contrast as it usually lightens up the vibe.

Body load, for me is best being really empty stomach, and I mean like nothing eaten for like 10 hours in advance. Usually I don't comply but each time I say to myself "I told you so".

To prevent premature purge:
* ginger (tablets)
* lemon essential oil (from the peels)
* oath porridge with some honey (few spoons, not a whole stuffed meal of course)
* lying very still
* last time I took a travel sickness pill which did prevent premature purge very nicely but the body load was heavy but I will not blame the pill for that. The base of the pil was dimenhydrinate, check it out it seemed to work better than concentrated ginger pills. It did not prevent the healing purge once neck deep in.

PS: with ayahuasca the internal pressure catapults out easily, with Mimo I feel when it's time and then just need a finger to help a bit after which the healing purge takes over from there. But that's just me.

I dont know about additives , but decanting the brew in the fridge overnight should help a lot. (Esp. Mimosa)

I think that´s a quite common feeling here!

Already tried with bee honey and agave honey and it only seemed to help in making it taste better.
Could you share some of your experience with Haoma?

That is more affirmation that it is secret then isnt And of course if there were articles about it wouldn't be very secret either.

I heard this from a friend who is training in shamanism, he told me that a teacher of him told him the ingredients but he must never tell anyone, and he wouldn't tell me. But he did tell me that honey and salt were among the ingredients.

As far as hoama goes, you can look it up, there is info about it, but it never lists the secret ingredients, and most recipes for hoama are either just Syrian rue or Syrian rue and acacia.

Furthermore it may seem like all is known and everything can be googled, but this is far from the truth when you delve into shamanic practices and recipes. Much more is forgotten and undiscovered then is known. If you can google it it ain't secret knowledge

But those items you listed are great ideas for combatting the early nausea, I really like the ginger beer

I agree that there's more out there than we commonly know, but why secret? What the gain by secret? Then again I'd be careful in hear-say either to make bold statements, you know.

Nausea combating is a huge item and if you say there's a solution to it but keep secret about it then what's too bad I think.

Let me elaborate, perhaps I was a bit dramatic with the secret bit

I'm not keeping a secret, I don't know the ingredients to the brew called hoama as my friend referred to it... If you look up hoama there are recipes, but he would say they are not complete recipes, and that the ingredients are handed down from teacher to student only.

I somewhat question the validity of this because these plants are Middle East and if there were an archaic recipe (which there is) it would develop there at the origin of these plants, and I'm fairly certain the guy he is learning from is not related to that culture, but I'm just offering the tidbit I was told about it.
As far as people I know Irl this guy is the closest thing to shaman I personally know though and I do believe he knows a secret hoama recipe that he was unwilling to share.

Just to explain myself a bit

I've done honey flavored oat porridge (few spoons in advance) with partial but definite positive success. Maybe I did too less oat I dunno, but this was inspired by Alan Shoemaker (he runs an ayahuasca retreat in SA) and this:
Ayahuasca and Oats

In Ayurveda both ginger and salt is said to start up the ingestion process before a (big) meal. So I'm not surprised to hear salt mentioned, I haven't tried it really in combination with alks.

No secrets here, I could have, but no
Ask your friend to help us out? With puppy eyes?

I'll definetly ask him again about it he is hard to get in touch with but I'll definetly think of it next time I see him.

I'll also see what I can find on "hoama" on the net and see if there is tips there

It's interesting what comes up when you search hoama, according to what pops up it's like the soma of the Indian culture lol. By that I mean it is written about thoroughly in ancient text but there are different theories about the exact ID of the plants involved. There are references that name Syrian rue as one of them though.

Here is a obscure old site I discovered awhile back that talks of ancient use of the brew. Nothing too specific though but does talk of traditional use of rue with acacia which in and of itself is pretty important cause there is very little info on that and could offer more of a cultural basis for the rue and mimosa or acacia brews out there
http://acacialand.com

I realy find that rue is a lot more nauseating than either caapi or pure harmala-alkaloïds.
Mimosa tends also to be worse when it comes to nausea, than acacia or psychotria viridis.

There is a herb called muna, that is a traditional ingrediënt of ayhuasca brews, and it is supposed to help against the nausea as well. It's a bit like mint. Mint itself might also help.

In my personal experience, small amounts of cannabis can be realy effective against nausea. For me personally, nothing works better against nausea than cannabis. But cannabis and ayahuasca is unfortunately an unpredictable combination. The effects of cannabis itself can be amplified hugely by harmala's, and then again, cannabis tends to amplify the effects of psychedelic's enormously as well. But on the other hand, even tiny amounts of cannabis are extremely effective. If all else fails, i would definately try it.

I also want to add that two to three datura seeds (Do not exceed this dose) are better/safer, to use against nausea, than dramamine. Some people experience respiratory problems when they combine dramamine with harmala's. That could be way more uncomfortable than the nausea itself.

If I'm on ayahuasca I don't even feel cannabis if I smoke it, cannabis on the comedown of any Entheogen is a must for me though

simmering mhrb instead of doing an hard boil helps. doing it with enough time so that you can leave the final filtered brew in the fridge for a week also helps, most tanins will be in the bottom of the container.

extracting the peganum seeds really helps too! follow the simple teks here in the forum, after 2 salt precipitations i have really pure and golden harmalas, and hcl is very soluble in water. i usually mix it with lotus tea, and voilá, this gives you a much cleaner experience, almost no nausea!

Must be more than a year ago but used to do in the fridge CWE of mimo powder in water pH 3 with phosphoric acid and no volume reduction afterwards. Indeed several days settling time in the fridge before decanting.

Powdered rue same procedure but used shorter times as mold came up whereas mimo never had this issue.

The cold would leave some plant material in the plant matter that should otherwise seep into the water by heat/boiling.

Thunder power

I second this info. At first bark brews would cause me early purging & very little effect.
Over time i switched over to using purified harmalas dissolved in water & simmering my bark brews with plenty of decanting & settling time.
Now my bark brews usually are sediment free but still a deep transparent red in the end & work very well with much less nausea than they would initially cause.

They still do cause some nausea & purging, but I believe that can be further reduced to almost nothing.
I have not experiemnted much lately due to lack of time, but i`m sure more can be done to make it a more comfortable experience.
I have considered trying to get a prescription for transdermal scopalamine patches, but would rather find a cheaper & more readily available way to do this.

Hoama? Secret? Never heard of it.

We only know about Haoma (and the bhang/bheng variety).


Admixtures we used (not all together in one setting)

1. Lemon balm (for long rue boils)
2. Majorana syriaca (za'atar, hyssop) (for long rue boils)
3. Sweet basil (for long rue boils)
4. Nettle (for long rue boils)
5. Tulsi (for long rue boils)
6. Black seed (nigella sativa, ajwain)
7. Pomegranate (instead of vinegar or lemon)
8. Milk
9. Kumys (fermented mares milk) (may have tyramine but produced one of the best travels)
10. Jun (very lighty caffeinated version)(may have tyramine)
11. Kvass (may have tyramine but produced one of the best journeys)
12. Green pumpkin kernels (for long rue boils)
13. Swizz chard (for long rue boils)
14. Amchoor (instead of vinegar or lemon)
15. Tamarind pulp (instead of vinegar or lemon)
16. Haldi (turmeric)
17. Black Pepper
18. Khus Khus (poppy seed)
19. Pandan water (Kewra)
20. Sugar, honey (unstoppable speed up effect)
21. Medicinal clay (powder)
22. Red clay (fresh red clay for pottery)

Woah Intezam what a list

Since I've been advocating the oat porridge here, and it grew into a memory meanwhile, I tried it again lately with great success, the oat porridge was made with oat milk (don't know if cow milk is yes or no better) and honey. 10 Spoons before T, and 10 heaped spoon after T. It was semi liquid semi stiff. Fast come on, and such a relief to enter without the usual dread nausea.

So it's not a meal actually, don't stuff yourself is always a good thing to do. Stomach happy = pilot happy. At top intensity (after 2 to 3 hours in) a healing purge was possible to fine tune the vibe, with the aid of a finger then things took off on their own to expel yuckers. It tasted not bad

Porridge rules

Filtering thru cotton ball in a funnel get's out alot of sediment which can be very irritating to the intestines, and can be useful for reducing nausea to near zero, also keeping the "light" or leaf dose at medium levels greatly reduces nausea.

Huh? This section deals with internal (tummo/candali) "homa" fire offerings as well as outer external "homa" fire pooja substances in order to summon a particular fierce aspect of mother (nowadays often called Smashan Tara). There is a connection though. It cannot well be *understood by ppl/muxlims in a **brahmaniac state of mind. In that (on the Indian subcontinent) mushrooms (any) are known as 'menstruational blood' of mother nature (growing loike 'atma linga' out of cow feces, fertilized with urine) and hence are pure 'tamas'. But given the case that a way-faring jogi understood that after thinking about 12 years why Lord Shiva has a Nandi and why ShivJi is born from a cows 'ear', it would then be a main ingredient rather then an admixture....

However we have read a south Indian Siddha text that dealt with real admixtures to SAUMA (the ancient drink exhilarant) and substitutes for it from the subcontinent, but unfortunately we cannot find it right now...


*while within the context of this rant, it means 'tricky business', the literal meaning of gorakh dhanda is = a cow herders (haoma) club/pestle/stick/wand

**pre-occupation with ritual purity