Some thoughts for conversation...

Prior to finding Salvia, I had attempted astral projection/oobe techniques with minimal success. I currently practice lucid dreaming techniques off-an-on with moderate success. I have also used self-hypnosis successfully, but mainly focused on the relaxation techniques.

Basically, astral projection/oobe's involve building up your 'energy' body over time with mental and physcial exercises, then attempting to put your body to sleep while you stay consciously awake, then pulling/projecting your energy body out of your physical body. While there are tons of techniques, a common one is to envision pulling yourself up a rope attached to your ceiling while your body is asleep.

Self-hypnosis techniques are also used to put yourself in a similar very relaxed body-asleep/mind-awake type of state.

While I only had very limited success with OOBEs, I found the personal body subtle energy itself to be quite noticeable. And it was even easier to feel the energy when cannabis was used.

Salvia seems to allow us to tap into a similar subtle body energy. At low doses (especially with quids), the energy is rather slow, although it can be pretty strong. I've found it is also somewhat controllable. For example, I can focus energy on a neck pain and a swirling energy will start gently moving my head/neck in particular circular patterns if I don't resist. It feels similar to swirling water in a pool. It's like having a built-in chiropractor :-)

I also notice, especially when quidding, that I feel almost exactly the way I do when I try to put my body to sleep and keep my consciousness awake for astral projection/OOBE and similar to self-hypnosis. My eyelids are almost locked shut, breathing can become deep, and visions are very hypagogic-like. The difference with Salvia from OOBE is I can still move my body around and not 'wake up'. When trying to astral project, any movement tends to kill any opportunity to get out of body. Salvia alleviates that problem.

At higher doses, especially when new to Salvia, it seems like our consciousness is moved to our energy body or somehow detached from our physical body, and the Salvia energy is so strong and fast it's like being in a turbulent ocean riptide. We get tossed and turned and thrown all over the place. Everything is always spinning...

Perhaps separate from the energy, the other thing I've noticed is that every time I use Salvia, I get to experience a different consciousness state or level while still awake, and it's the same level every time. For the sake of argument we could say that dreaming consciousness is different and separate from waking consciousness. Of course there is some cross-over, especially while lucid dreaming, but in general they are two different consciousness states.

There is Chris.Awake and Chris.Dreaming. And there is also Chris.Salvia. Chris.Awake is always the same, Chris.Dreaming is always the same, and Chris.Salvia is always the same.

The .Salvia version always seems parental to the .Awake and .Dreaming states.

It also feels like at the .Salvia level, we should be able to communicate with others also at the .Salvia level, although I've never had the chance to experiment with this as of yet. If mental telepathy is real, it seems like this is a level where it could happen. While quidding, it is not difficult to keep a verbal conversation with those around me, and there is plenty of time to experiment. I'm looking forward to an opportunity to experiment while simultaneously quidding at some point in the future...

Thoughts...similarities...experiences?

Some more thoughts for discussion...

This week I've been experimenting with using less and less plain leaf for my quid. My 'normal' amount is .75 grams dried and slightly wetted. This week, I've used 750mg, 500mg, and last night 300mg. I also always use a little bit of cannabis first as it seems to allow me to use less Salvia.

I did the 750 and 500mg tests on back-to-back nights. I was surprised that the 500mg night was the same as the 750mg night in terms of depth of experience, visions, sweating, and energy strength. Perhaps because I did it 24 hours later, reverse tolerance had a strong effect. (I've also tested 1g and 1.25g recently, and they were quite similar as well.)

I then waited two nights before trying the 300mg amount. Again, I was surprised at how well that little of an amount worked. The visions weren't quite as bright and obvious as with the higher amounts, and the energy wasn't quite as forceful...but it definitely worked. I was able to manipulate and work with the energy, and was in the familiar detached consciousness space.

At these low amounts, its possible to work with attaching and detaching my consciousness from my body at will. It's very subtle. It's like our consciousness is attached to our body magnetically. If we can get just enough force of some kind to detach it...then we can be in Salvia-land and explore. And it doesn't take much...especially if you are intentionally trying.

As with most psychedelics, it always seems so easy while in that state, and it seems we should be able to do it at will even without extra plants in our system...but it never quite works when completely sober.

I've been noticing that I have more control over electrical surges through my body, especially from head-to-toe, while using. I don't recall being able to cause it from toe-to-head though.

For astral projection energy training, it's common to practice running energy up and down your body from head-to-toe and back. That energy is similar, but not as electrically twitchy as what happens with Salvia.

In general, being in the Salvia space - at least at low doses smoked or while quidding - allows you to have extra controls over your physical body from a more inner, parental level than normal. I'll continue exploring this over time, and am curious to hear from others about their findings.

That is a great way of putting it in terms that are understandable, especially for those with little to no experience with Salvia and the states it induces. I feel exactly the same, and have written as much in different words, in my Salvia journal. That is what people are trying to communicate when they say things like, "The Salvia reality feels more real than this one." There is some strange feeling of maternity/paternity or that the reality you experience after ingesting Salvia is 'bigger' or perhaps even akin to a pretext? Prerequisite? Hard to language these ideas

I think this is also where a lot of the feelings of familiarity come from with Salvia. That feeling of going home or the motherly vibes. Salvia takes us to a place where we've been before, where we come from, and where we could possibly return to without the help of Salvia.

As for communicating while within those states, that is the difficult part for me. Quidding would certainly help with allowing you to keep one foot in this reality, so to speak. Very interesting idea