hi everyone. I have already did one sub-breathrough experience with freebase that was to say the least the most intense experience I have ever lived in my life.

I extracted harmalas from caapi vine and got some blue lilly and capea. My changa is ready!

Now I'm not even sure if changa is suppose to be more or less intense. Theres a lot of contradiction over changa on the net.

Can someone please tell me the main differences between the two ways of administration

thanks

Assuming you've done the infusion process properly, changa should be more potent if you're keeping the amount of DMT constant (i.e. 30mg DMT FB vs. 30mg DMT infused into the changa cone), the changa should theoretically be more potent because of the potentiation via the harmalas in the caapi leaf. Of course the manner through which you'll inhale the DMT in either situation will vary and thus the rate you'll absorb it into your lungs and blood stream will therefore vary as well, but I think the changa will probably seem more potent. I tend to be a DMT purist, but that's just my preference.

Not necessarily true. With changa, you’re inhaling a combination of DMT vapor, harmala freebase vapors, and smoke/combustion by-products from burning plant material. As a result, the DMT vapor is diluted quite a bit compared to pure DMT vapor.

Sublingual harmalas before pure vaporized DMT has always worked well for me. No combustion by-products inhaled that way.

I have another question, should I smoke like 20 mg of harmalas before doing the changa to be sure to have enough time for the harmalas to get going?

Personally, I prefer to take oral harmalas about 30 minutes prior to vaping spice.

For me that's worked better than changa...but I still am experimenting very much. You should experiment too.

Remember the "there's no wrong way to eat a reeces" commercials?

I used to smoke rue seeds alone until I was stoned off them, then place spice atopn my rue bed....I've done what you're saying, smoking harmalas first, then changa, taken oral harmalas then changa.

Since you mention reeces peanut butter cups, I'll share a colorful bit of history:

Twenty thousand years ago, in the amazon. Two shamans, walking through the forest....one carrying some ayahuasca vine tea, another with psychotria tea. They bump into each other--"hey, you got ayahuasca in my psychotria!" Exclaims one. "You got Ayahuasca in my psychotria!" proclaims the other. The world was never the same.

Two great trips, that trip great together.

changa > freebase

I'm completely with you on this one gibran. I do the same as you with the harmalas followed by vaporized DMT. As I was writing up my response, I recognized the dilution factor, but I either neglected to mention it, or I simply failed to do a substantial job at describing it sufficiently when I talked about "the manner through which you'll inhale the DMT in either situation will vary and thus the rate you'll absorb it into your lungs...will vary as well..." Lately I've been preferring to just go on pure vaped DMT FB with no harmalas because firstly after refining my vaping technique ever and ever more, I've started becoming too efficient for my own good, and now harmalas are almost like overkill sometimes. Secondly, I've always been a fan of pure DMT visions. They just have a greater purity about them, and they almost feel more "concise" if that makes any sense.

Hey,

so in the opinion of experienced users like yourselves, would you suggest smoking harmalas and dmt together (as in changa) or first drinking a brew of rue or caapi and then in like half an hour vaping freebase dmt ? I want to know if there is a potential difference , i ask since my supply of caapi/rue is very limited. I get the feeling that if smoked together as changa higher quantity of harmalas would be required to have the same length of experience as to having harmalas an hour earlier, since the body is already inhibited of MO-A when the dmt is inhaled.
What are your thoughts ?
And in relation to smoking harmalas and ingesting it orally, which is more potent per weight of harmalas ? Doesn't smoking cause a little loss in potency ?

This is why I prefer straight vapours. DMT vaporized correctly needs no combustion at all and pre-dosing on harmalas is certainly no hassle. But changa is easier to handle 'in the field' so to speak. Especially when it's a joint or a blunt.

Hey Orion,
You suggest changa or ingesting some harmala half an hour before smoking freebase? Will it save the quantity in harmalas if it's done this way than to smoke it together?

He just said that he pre-doses harmalas and vapes his dmt but changa is better "in the feild."

Do the math. If you need 30mg sublingual beforehand how does that compare to what is in your changa blend? Remember you only need around 12-24mgs of the spirit molecule when maois are in the mix

Some people just prefer one way or the other. How do you plan on vaping? That will be a factor. Sedation occurs with a pre-dose of harmala as well. This can help create a good space to blast off in.

At some point you are going to have to experiment and find what works personally for you.

Brewing caapi and vaping dmt later after it has set in
^^^^4-5 hour experience 175-300mg of harmala, 12-14mg of dmt
Making changa
^^^^.5-1 hour experience 5-16mg harmala, 12-14mg dmt
Sublingual predosing
^^^^1 hour experience? 30mg harmala, 12-14mg dmt

Hey FLeP, what do you personally think is more intense (forget the duration), sublingual pure harmala or changa?
I guess with pure haramala the nausea factor could be ruled out in comparison to the brew. Why is there considerable difference in quantity of haramala when consuming brew vs sublingual harmala? You dissolve haramala in Ornj Juice and place it under the tongue?
I haven't tried any of the method, but theoretically consuming harmala first and then vaping dmt would be better than changa since the experience would be more pure(only dmt) than with changa where the experience would have strong effects of the herbs added, don't you think?

Additionally, sublingual harmala + vaping free base (30 mg) or sublingual haramala + consuming free base dmt (30 mg ) would be a better experience?

good lord Make Shift, this is getting painful now

why dont you just get stuck in and let us know what you find from these experiences. You can ask the same thing again and again, but its completely pointless. I doesnt matter which ROA you try they are all epically immensely beautiful and beyond intense, non of them will let you down or leave you disapointed.

The same ROA can be differet on different days, this stuff is magic and does not conform to linear methods of interpretation.

i understand you want to make the most of what youve got but.....

Hahaha yeah man, I have got very little thing with me, 3 grams, I want to be sure which would be the best way. I had 4 grams, did almost a gram vaping freebase.
What's your preferred ROA and why? Don't kill me now

i love them all equally as they all have their time and place

infused herb - awesome
changa - awesome
pharma - awesome
aya - awsome
oral harmala's and vaping - awesome
sublingual harmala's and vaping - awesome
vaping on aya - awesome
vaping on pharma - awesome
vaping on mushrooms - awesome
vaping on acid - awesome
force fed by midgets riding rainbowed unicorns - awesome

can you see the trend?

3 grams of DMT is plenty to work out which ROA is preffered, even at excessively high doses thats 50 adventure into the madness.

Right on brother. Will give it all a shot when I get my supply of b.caapi, chaliponga.

Btw, any idea when using the water bong/dab rig, which liquid would be the best? Cold/hot/room temp water? Different people saying different stuff. Saying cold water will make it smooth, some say that hot water will humidify the chamber thereby moistening our throat when we inhale making it smoother. I tried both, well I broke through with cold water, second time with hot water I didn't break through. Can't blame the water though.

post #15 and 18, laughing my arse off.