We've Moved! Visit our NEW FORUM to join the latest discussions. This is an archive of our previous conversations...

You can find the login page for the old forum here.
CHATPRIVACYDONATELOGINREGISTER
DMT-Nexus
FAQWIKIHEALTH & SAFETYARTATTITUDEACTIVE TOPICS
harmala alkaloids and UV light Options
 
entheogenic-gnosis
#1 Posted : 2/7/2015 8:38:30 PM
DMT-Nexus member


Posts: 2889
Joined: 31-Oct-2014
Last visit: 03-Nov-2018
(If a thread on this topic already exists I apologize)

The link is to an article focused on harmala alkaloids and UV light. There's some really interesting and useful information contained in it.


Alexander Shulgin writes:

Extraction techniques with harmala can be evaluated for effectiveness using UV light. Both of Peganum harmala's major carbolines, harmaline and harmine, are rather intensely fluorescent compounds.

https://www.erowid.org/p...e/syrian_rue_info6.shtml

-EG
 

STS is a community for people interested in growing, preserving and researching botanical species, particularly those with remarkable therapeutic and/or psychoactive properties.
 
GOD
#2 Posted : 2/7/2015 8:43:41 PM
DMT-Nexus member


Posts: 290
Joined: 18-Jan-2008
Last visit: 13-Feb-2016
Its true and its a good test for an amateur chemist to do = Look at your kitchen with UV light before you extract a large amount of P.Harmala and again afterwards ........ = You are very probably going to get a shock because it gets everywhere . The walls . The floor . The surfaces . In my case the ceeling to .
I am autism spectum ........ please dont burn me at the stake for being honest .
 
entheogenic-gnosis
#3 Posted : 2/8/2015 11:12:10 AM
DMT-Nexus member


Posts: 2889
Joined: 31-Oct-2014
Last visit: 03-Nov-2018
https://www.dmt-nexus.me...;t=62845&find=unread

In this thread ^ someone had gotten alicia anisopetala or some such species that did not contain harmala alkaloids.

powdered banisteriopsis caapi should react with UV light, correct?

Is this a reliable test to determine if your vines do in fact contain the desired harmala alkaloids?

-EG
 
pitubo
#4 Posted : 2/8/2015 3:18:45 PM

dysfunctional word machine

Senior Member

Posts: 1831
Joined: 15-Mar-2014
Last visit: 11-Jun-2018
Location: at the center of my universe
GOD wrote:
it gets everywhere . The walls . The floor . The surfaces . In my case the ceeling to .

Your hands, your face, everywhere you occasionally get an itch. Especially the nails seem to soak it up, still glows in uv light after weeks.

entheogenic-gnosis wrote:
powdered banisteriopsis caapi should react with UV light, correct?

Is this a reliable test to determine if your vines do in fact contain the desired harmala alkaloids?

Yes, it is a good test for the presence of harmala alkaloids. Not a very good quantitative test, as the harmalas cause strong fluorescence at even minute amounts present. But if there is no glow then there surely aren't any harmalas in the brew (need to test solution, not bare plant).
 
entheogenic-gnosis
#5 Posted : 2/8/2015 3:28:04 PM
DMT-Nexus member


Posts: 2889
Joined: 31-Oct-2014
Last visit: 03-Nov-2018
That's what I was asking about was testing the bare plant, that way if it did not contain the desired alkaloids I would not have to go through the trouble of putting it into solution.

"One interesting thing about syrian rue seeds is that the powder from the seeds glows dimly under blacklight and extracts made from it glow brightly under common UV."
-This is the first line on the link in my original post ( https://www.erowid.org/p...e/syrian_rue_info6.shtml )

Because it worked with powdered peganum harmala I assumed that it would work with powdered caapi as well.




-EG
 
Chan
#6 Posted : 2/8/2015 3:29:41 PM

Another Leaf on the Vine


Posts: 554
Joined: 29-Jul-2013
Last visit: 26-Aug-2023
I dabbled with rue snuff a few months back. We visited a club pre-Christmas, and I looked like Scarface the White-Nosed Reindeer Embarrased Embarrased Embarrased

My nostril hairs are still blinding white under UV.

Even better is berberine, from barberries etc, a really nice turquoise color under UV, if you're body-painting...!
“I sometimes marvel at how far I’ve come - blissful, even, in the knowledge that I am slowly becoming a well-evolved human being - only to have the illusion shattered by an episode of bad behaviour that contradicts the new and reinforces the old. At these junctures of self-reflection, I ask the question: “are all my years of hard work unraveling before my eyes, or am I just having an episode?” For the sake of personal growth and the pursuit of equanimity, I choose the latter and accept that, on this journey of evolution, I may not encounter just one bad day, but a group of many.”
― B.G. Bowers

 
entheogenic-gnosis
#7 Posted : 2/8/2015 3:34:17 PM
DMT-Nexus member


Posts: 2889
Joined: 31-Oct-2014
Last visit: 03-Nov-2018
.....Dave G writes: (January 1996; erowid link)-We dipped stuff into it and painted our bodies and the walls and it worked wonderfully. I think I remember hearing that P. harmala seeds are used in dyes, so I'm wondering if a psychoactive black-light tie-dye is in the works...

Has anybody ever tried to make black light reactive dye from p. Harmala and had it work?

Sounds like you can make black light reactive body paint with it...

-EG
 
SynKyd
#8 Posted : 2/8/2015 3:37:58 PM

DMT-Nexus member


Posts: 451
Joined: 23-Jan-2014
Last visit: 09-Feb-2022
Man From Chan Chan wrote:
I dabbled with rue snuff a few months back. We visited a club pre-Christmas, and I looked like Scarface the White-Nosed Reindeer Embarrased Embarrased Embarrased

My nostril hairs are still blinding white under UV.

Even better is berberine, from barberries etc, a really nice turquoise color under UV, if you're body-painting...!


That's classic! Your post reminded me of this recent one also, very cool idea i have yet to try.......

body painting with rue
At the center of this existence, it is everything and nothing, all of us and each of us and none of us. My light is now lit, and it cannot be extinguished.
 
GOD
#9 Posted : 2/8/2015 4:28:48 PM
DMT-Nexus member


Posts: 290
Joined: 18-Jan-2008
Last visit: 13-Feb-2016
The body paint idea has been around for a long time and it works ...... BUT ...... its harmala alkaloids that are glowing and they get taken up though the skin . Do we want that ? Do we want to have to be VERY carefull with our diaet to be sure that there are no posibly dangerous effects . Exactly the same as with ayahuasca .

LSD glows ( emits light ) in the dark when it shaken ......... would it be a good idea to spread an X amount of it on our skin ?

I am autism spectum ........ please dont burn me at the stake for being honest .
 
pitubo
#10 Posted : 2/8/2015 4:57:39 PM

dysfunctional word machine

Senior Member

Posts: 1831
Joined: 15-Mar-2014
Last visit: 11-Jun-2018
Location: at the center of my universe
GOD wrote:
its harmala alkaloids that are glowing and they get taken up though the skin . Do we want that ? Do we want to have to be VERY carefull with our diaet to be sure that there are no posibly dangerous effects . Exactly the same as with ayahuasca .

Not the same. The amount of harmalas needed to achieve vivid fluorescence is very small, milligrams per liter. Unless several grams of harmala are applied to the body, the amount effectively taken up into the blood stream is only good for placebo experiences. Even if an active amount of harmalas are taken up, the digestive system is bypassed, so that regular amine detoxification by the gut is mostly unaffected.

GOD wrote:
LSD glows ( emits light ) in the dark when it shaken ......... would it be a good idea to spread an X amount of it on our skin ?

The triboluminescence of lsd crystals is not the same as the fluorescence of lsd in solution. LSD is active in microgram quantities, harmalas in milligram quantities. Comparing the same amount of both applied to the skin is not a sensible comparison.
 
pitubo
#11 Posted : 2/8/2015 5:03:54 PM

dysfunctional word machine

Senior Member

Posts: 1831
Joined: 15-Mar-2014
Last visit: 11-Jun-2018
Location: at the center of my universe
entheogenic-gnosis wrote:
That's what I was asking about was testing the bare plant, that way if it did not contain the desired alkaloids I would not have to go through the trouble of putting it into solution.

"One interesting thing about syrian rue seeds is that the powder from the seeds glows dimly under blacklight and extracts made from it glow brightly under common UV."
-This is the first line on the link in my original post ( https://www.erowid.org/p...e/syrian_rue_info6.shtml )

Because it worked with powdered peganum harmala I assumed that it would work with powdered caapi as well.

Solid harmine/harmaline HCl glows yellow in blacklight, the same color as without the blacklight, but more intense. The effect is less striking than with solutions, but it may work to identify actives.

I would simply take a little sample of the plant and boil it for a few minutes in a small amount of water or dilute vinegar, that is enough to extract sufficient harmalas for a fluorescence test.
 
GOD
#12 Posted : 2/8/2015 5:34:04 PM
DMT-Nexus member


Posts: 290
Joined: 18-Jan-2008
Last visit: 13-Feb-2016
pitubo #10

Thats interesting . How much did your theoretical person put on his skin ? How often ? On how much of his skin ? How much harmala alkaloids were in it ? Does it also bypass the MAO system in the brain or does it also effect that ?

" Comparing the same amount of both applied to the skin is not a sensible comparison. "

I didnt do that . I said ---- > " would it be a good idea to spread an X amount of it on our skin ? "

An X amount = an unknown dose .


The comparison is that all things that have light effects are not nesecerily safe to smear on you skin = The light effect , the safety factor and not the effects of the drug . Cyanide kills . So does strychnine ........ but ...... they are not the same chemical . The lethal dose isnt the same . They dont look the same . They dont taste the same ...... BUT ....... victims of both are exactly as dead as eachother .
I am autism spectum ........ please dont burn me at the stake for being honest .
 
Chan
#13 Posted : 2/8/2015 5:55:18 PM

Another Leaf on the Vine


Posts: 554
Joined: 29-Jul-2013
Last visit: 26-Aug-2023
GOD, it's fairly common knowledge that harmel, aka syrian rue, has been liberally chucked on fires throughout the Middle East since way back when. Birth of a child? Harmel! Wedding? Harmel! You got the new iPhone? Harmel!

I bow to no one in my caution, but sometimes, some comparisons are just fatuous, and do more harm than good.

I still have glowing nostrils, and I'm alive. Harmel for everybody!
“I sometimes marvel at how far I’ve come - blissful, even, in the knowledge that I am slowly becoming a well-evolved human being - only to have the illusion shattered by an episode of bad behaviour that contradicts the new and reinforces the old. At these junctures of self-reflection, I ask the question: “are all my years of hard work unraveling before my eyes, or am I just having an episode?” For the sake of personal growth and the pursuit of equanimity, I choose the latter and accept that, on this journey of evolution, I may not encounter just one bad day, but a group of many.”
― B.G. Bowers

 
pitubo
#14 Posted : 2/8/2015 7:46:07 PM

dysfunctional word machine

Senior Member

Posts: 1831
Joined: 15-Mar-2014
Last visit: 11-Jun-2018
Location: at the center of my universe
GOD wrote:
Thats interesting . How much did your theoretical person put on his skin ? How often ? On how much of his skin ? How much harmala alkaloids were in it ? Does it also bypass the MAO system in the brain or does it also effect that ?

This hypothetical guinea pig / lab rat / friend called "SWIM" has some experience processing and handling sizable amounts of extracted harmalas. Additionally, he has experienced varying amounts smoked, eaten and facepainted. Only a minute amount of harmalas will make a large amount of water glow. In order to make the whole area of the body glow, he estimates that it would require an amount of harmalas less than that needed for effect when smoked. When applied to the body, most of the harmalas are not immediately taken up into body plasma, for else there would remain no body paint to be observe. These considerations make him theorize that harmala body paint is an unlikely and ineffective route of administration.

If the digestive MAO system is functional, it will have taken care of most exogenous amines. There is AFAIK very little data on what happens in terms of interactions with psychomodulatory substances when only the central nervous system's MAO system is inhibited by harmalas. Your conjectures are as good as mine.

GOD wrote:
" Comparing the same amount of both applied to the skin is not a sensible comparison. "

I didnt do that . I said ---- > " would it be a good idea to spread an X amount of it on our skin ? "

An X amount = an unknown dose .

Oh thanks for clearing that up. Would it be a good idea to ask an unknown question?

GOD wrote:
The comparison is that all things that have light effects are not nesecerily safe to smear on you skin = The light effect , the safety factor and not the effects of the drug . Cyanide kills . So does strychnine ........ but ...... they are not the same chemical . The lethal dose isnt the same . They dont look the same . They dont taste the same ...... BUT ....... victims of both are exactly as dead as eachother .

Don't put harmalas on your skin, because cyanide and strychnine kill? What are you arguing?
 
entheogenic-gnosis
#15 Posted : 2/9/2015 1:01:27 PM
DMT-Nexus member


Posts: 2889
Joined: 31-Oct-2014
Last visit: 03-Nov-2018
pitubo wrote:
entheogenic-gnosis wrote:
That's what I was asking about was testing the bare plant, that way if it did not contain the desired alkaloids I would not have to go through the trouble of putting it into solution.

"One interesting thing about syrian rue seeds is that the powder from the seeds glows dimly under blacklight and extracts made from it glow brightly under common UV."
-This is the first line on the link in my original post ( https://www.erowid.org/p...e/syrian_rue_info6.shtml )

Because it worked with powdered peganum harmala I assumed that it would work with powdered caapi as well.

Solid harmine/harmaline HCl glows yellow in blacklight, the same color as without the blacklight, but more intense. The effect is less striking than with solutions, but it may work to identify actives.

I would simply take a little sample of the plant and boil it for a few minutes in a small amount of water or dilute vinegar, that is enough to extract sufficient harmalas for a fluorescence test.


Thank you, I appreciate the response, this was the exact info I was seeking, thanks again,

-EG
 
dtrypt
#16 Posted : 10/15/2015 4:32:06 PM

13.7 Billion Year Old Noob


Posts: 182
Joined: 16-Aug-2011
Last visit: 19-Mar-2022
Location: Africa
Haven't been on a forum in ages, but I decided today to do something with the 150g caapi vine that's been sitting in my cupboard for years. I did 4 boils (followed the tannin colour fade as indicator to stop boiling) and reduced the tea down to about 350ml.

My fingers are rough and tender from shredding hard caapi vine by hand after getting it as pulverised as possible by hammer. It's best when nature makes your work for it, like when you have to coax some mescaline HCl from a spine covered column of ouch Razz

My UV light suggests that I have not destroyed the "spirit" Smile


image host
 
 
Users browsing this forum
Guest (2)

DMT-Nexus theme created by The Traveler
This page was generated in 0.033 seconds.