Hello everybody,

this is my first post in this beatiful DMT-Forum.
Since i smoked some DMT years ago im planning to do such a journey again.
I'm growing Phalaris arundinacea in pots and also work with stressing the plant and so on.
I allready did a try with wild Phalaris around my house (smoking the dried juice) and i really wondered that it worked.
Of course it was low dose.. but yeah.. it worked.



At this time im drying the juice from my self growed Phalaris.
Is it dangerous to combine Phalaris with Harmalaseeds ? (in smoked form) 'cause im planning to smoke some harmalseeds before smoking the dried phalaris juice.
If this all go wrong.. im thinking about doing an A/B Extraction and sure there will be further questions.

Would be fine if you could tell me what's your experiences with it.

BTW dont know if this is the right place for this thread.. please move it when i posted in the wrong forum

Peace and love
Dr.Plant

Welcome Dr.!
It would be good to know if Phalaris arundinacea works well and if it can be extracted. It is a nuisance plant around here and they sure aren't going to ever be able to get rid of it all. I do know that some species of Phalaris have some bad toxins that need to be avoided. Good luck and Welcome again!

Phalaris arundinacea works (when stressing the plant to enlarge alkaloid level) it has gramine in it but i heard when smoked gramine isn't active.
It has more 5-MeO-DMT then N,N-DMT in it (got a strange bodyload at my first try with wild phalaris. i think the 5-MeO-DMT caused that)
Would be fine if you have informations about the smoked combination phalaris+harmalaseeds (any known dangers ?)
Is here someone who allready smoked dried phalaris juice ? (Jim Dekorne told about it in "The Enthogene Review)

wont be my last posting.

Dr.Plant

What SWIM would do with phalaris is juice it, mix the juice with pickling lime and wash the basified material with limonene to extract the actives. There are a number of routes that one could go after the limonene pull: Evaporation would work, but it would be a very impure freebase product. Salting would work, but most have only tried this with vinegar; and SWIM's not sure whether the vinegar pulls impurities that may impact the process of converting the acetate goo to base. If not, then just mix the acetate with sodium carbonate and a little water, dry completely and wash with acetone, collect the acetone and evaporate. SWIM definitely would not use any extract of phalaris orally, due to the gramine, but SWIY is probably already aware of that.

Note that few if anyone has any actual experience with phalaris extractions, but the methods outlined above should be fairly universal for spice extraction.

its interesting..i have read reports of wonderful oral Phalaris experiences...

Certain clones have been developed with low gramine and low additional "accessory" alkaloids. One such clone is "Big Medicine" developed by Johny Appleseed. There are others as well. P. brach is also supposed to have a clean alkaloid profile (High DMT levels). Also AQ1. SWIM has heard of anecdotal reports of P. brac being active at relatively low doses orally. I believe in trout's ayahuasca book (online at erowid) a dose of 20g dried grass gave an intense effect (prob mixed with MAOIs). This is pretty incredible if you think about it, through artifical selection we have the ability to create high yielding clones with clean profiles.

These grasses seem to have great potential. Imagine having three strains one for 5-MeO, one for DMT, and one for 5-OH. That would be amazing. These grasses have the potential to produce up to at least 1% alkaloids dry weight. That is as good as MHRB. Now currently the alkaloids are not solely the desirable ones but with more work and selective breeding who knows what will be available in the next few years. Many of these grasses have a wide array of additional tryptamines and indole alkaloids that have yet to be researched and may have interesting pharmacological profiles.

Cutting the top 1/3 of the grass off and then letting it grow back for several weeks is a great way to stress the plants. When cutting for extractions take the top 1/3 of material or the entire re-growth. Also certain high nitrogen containing fertilizers have been found to increase alkaloid content. tryptophan may also increase alkaloid levels. Because of Staggers syndrome there is actually a fairly nice sized literature on the subject of alkaloid content in these grasses and a variety of manipulations have been found to increase yields.

I think many people buy P arundinacea seeds online, grow it, try a single extraction and then give up when they see 5 mg of brown goo after hours of work... Remember though there are many strains and clones that have been found to have nice alkaloid content and profile. Big Med for example is a clone of a single parent plant you can obtain clones (cuttings or Rhizomes) to ensure genetic identity. These strains are available one just has to search a little harder than for the P arund. Also stressing and environmental conditions are paramount to alkaloid yields.

These grasses are so easy to grow, people should obtain some and play around who knows what will come out of it. Also they survive over the winter thus they grow back bigger and bigger each year. Temp is also a stressor. P arund also reproduce by rhizomes which makes cloning simple, which is necessary for selective breeding and development of ideal clones.

The FASA technique seems very promising with the grasses as one of the difficulties in extractions is the high fat content of the grass material. Also using a Soxhlet to defat is a great way to preserve expensive or hard to get solvents or just to be environmental friendly (Green chemistry). One can defat all day with a minimal amount of solvent then take the remaining plant matter and do an alkaloid extraction.

Keep up the great work.

Very interesting bufoman!

I did neglect to mention the possiblity of extracting from the juice by mixing with sodium carbonate, drying with anhydrous magnesium sulfate, washing with anhydrous acetone, and precipitating with FASA. SWIM's been too caught up in limonene madness.

How did you smoke it?
Also, what did you experience?

SWIM's thinking about growing. He can harvest wild as well, but producing super-strains sounds fun.

http://diseyes.lycaeum.org/dmt/dmtlu.txt

SWIM tried 3 extractions from wild arundinacea naturally growing around there... Never got anything more than few drops of thick cat piss (from kilos of wet herb). SWIM is trying to grown Desmanthus Illinoisis which seem more promising.

What extraction method was SWIY using?

I used the stressing methods above: clipping, no watering and i also used high nitrogen containing fertilizers.
Sounds very interesting bufoman. How to "produce" such strains ?
I think i will first simply try the evaporizded juice in combination of harmalaseed(syrian rue).
Im also growing with same phalaris seeds outdoor and my Phalaris in the pot is regrowing very fast - unbelievable!

So when it go wrong.. i will use any of the known extraction instructions.



I smoked the dried juice from wild phalaris.
Strange bodyload it felt like my body is growing. Some fractals with closed eyes and so on. But nothing special.

I hope there will be more effects with my self growed phalaris.
Sure i will tell you after i tested.

Greetings
Dr.Plant

Acid/Base -> naphta -> full evaporation -> almost nothing

In my opinion it is important to use young Phalaris leafs. (i only used young phalaris leafs and juiced them)
Stressing with clipping should be also usefull for wild phalaris.



So try it with young Phalaris plants.

My ringed octopus is very precocious and has a Soxhlet and 1000ml heavier than water CLLE. She is interested in growing her own p. brach. to do a pure n,n-DMT extraction using ISA or a 50/50 methanol/ethanol solvent. Not using DCM (carcinogenic, toxic, possible mutagen) or Chloroform (hard to synthesize, degenerates into phosgene gas etc...) to extract a pure white n,Oxide-DMT and n,n-DMT.

What is the name of this high n,n-DMT primarily clone p. brachys. lineage that I have read about on erowid.org's vault? Is it an A1, A2 hybrid of other p. brachys.?

EXCELLENT! I am soooo glad to see somebody growing their own DMT-plant source! You guys should follow his example! It doesn't look like he lives on a farm and he can do it! So can ALL of you!!!