My question comes after looking at my lack of skills when it comes to extracting spice. Before I ask the question I do understand everyone is different and each person has their own skills and talents in life, personally mine are mechanically geared which I think is why I have a bit of a hard time with extractions. And with that I understand that this science is ever evolving and that no one is "perfect".

I also love the fact that one day I know I will have a better understanding of the simple truths of extractions and produce better yields, and that learning how to work with the spice from beginning to end is something that really touches me and brings a happy dance to my brain space.

So, my question to all, especially the veterans of spice extractions... How long did it take for you to be able to produce a good quality extraction more times then a failed or slightly less then amazing tray. More or less, how long did it take for you to get this process down to a comfortable science so to say.


Thanks everyone!

Lastly, my word of the day is Phantasmagoria

My first time I screwed up badly and didn't try again for 3 months. My failures were mostly due to lack of preparation, no way to separate the liquid layers, and a bad extraction container.

The next time I decided to try again, I spent a while researching different extraction techniques and gathering materials. To my surprise, everything worked wonderfully!

First time for me, but years of chemistry classes gave me something of a leg up.

If I were you, I would spend a lot of time learning the theory behind your Tek of choice: that will give you a better sense of what is going on and why you're doing what you're doing.

Just blindly following a recipe leaves way more room for error.

Blessings
~ND

I lurked here for off & on for approximately 4 years before attempting an extraction; did lots of reading.

I got good results starting with my first attempt; I've only done STB extractions, and only used naptha.

An extraction walk-through video would make things easier for those members who are visual learners, or are new to such things, (such video would be great within the FAQ).

Found a pictorial for an STB tek randomly on the deep web one day, tried it out after a bit of research and managed to get it down first time pretty well. Took about two pulls before I started getting consistent pearly white crystals from freeze precip. I've since done 2 extractions, same tek.

I extracted just before coming to the nexus using what in retrospect is a pretty poor method I found on another forum somewhere randomly. I was 18, had no extraction or chemistry knowledge, couldn't even bake a cake, but was happy with the quality of the results...however overall the yield was really low compared to what i'd later get doing nomans. I think the low yield was partly due to how I did it, and partly because of the bad tek i was following.



phantasmagoria is a pretty cool word.....sounds like a phantom porno or something

My first 100g STB extract yielded a pathetic 50mg of product.

The problem was that I was rushing the whole process. Second time round I was much more patient and I couldn't have been happier with the results

That was my 'before-nexus' days. Only by a couple of months mind, the rest is blissful history.

My first couple of extractions (STB) actually went pretty well. I did quite a bit of homework ahead of time, reading different teks and learning a little bit of basic information regarding how the procedure works. I was using mimosa hostilis root bark and getting pretty decent yields, although I can't remember exact numbers. My first couple of pulls would always come out fluffy and white, then I would get several pulls worth of yellowish crystals.

This past spring was my first time working with acacia confusa root bark, so I had to upgrade to acid/base extraction. I never made a big enough mistake to ruin an extraction, but I never had a good grasp on the concepts of alkaloid extraction or enough experience to start tweaking the teks I borrowed to make them work better for me until I had a few A/B extractions of acacia confusa under my belt. That was when my passion and fascination with chemistry and ethnobotany really began to blossom.

I feel like now I have a decent understanding of the concepts and reactions involved in alkaloid extraction, but I am constantly learning new things.

Good question. In my years of extracting the molecule I have tried do as many different teks as possible to extend my learning and experience.
I had it pretty easy when I began by using what I consider to be the hardest to screw up tek, Q21's. Although many people still manage to, lol.
If your goal of extracting is simply to supply the molecule then difficulties and "screw ups" are un wanted and a set back. If your goal is to gain as much working knowledge and learn as much as possible in all maters pertaining to extractions, then the same screwed extractions are a positive learning experience.

I am only as good at extractions because of my mistakes. I am able to help others un-f'k their botched extractions often times because I have been there. I can identify and break up a nasty emulsion, trouble shoot quickly and accurately a low yield, create pure white snowflakes or bright yellow full spectrum spice and everything in between all from problems. Extraction problems are like a fun riddle and I love the challenge. When something is going wrong Ill lay in bed at night and think about it, then wake up and solve the puzzle. Its a rush, I love it!

I try different things to learn more. Ie; doing a limoneen pull then a FASI to salt is a waste of time when extracting from mimosa other than gaining experience because there is no reason to make fumerate if your end goal is freebase but I sill will from time to time just because. Next pull I will use a FASA.

What starts to happen after proessing enough bark with many different teks is you start to "get it". You stop needing to have the wiki open while doing extractions even if its one you have never used or a new substance. being extracted. You start to fully understand what your achieving by doing A,B, or C rather then simply following the steps. You can confidently substitute this chem for that without having to log onto to chat and ask if its ok because you understand things more completely.

Acidify, basify, pull, becomes a mantra.

I guess I like to learn because I am passionate about this path and get a lot of enjoyment from helping others.

I don't really understand how simple STB extractions can fail at all. You need to have the right tools from the start, and a lot of patience. For instance, the emulsion problem...it does not happen if you use the correct water to lye ratio and don't shake your container but gently roll it around. Sure, it takes a lot longer but --- no emulsion. Then the problem of the lye tea getting into the pull...well...don't be lazy and decant, but use a syringe to seperate. If lye tea gets in ...just seperate again. It's not that hard. What I'm saying is, that if you read enough and learn about the potential problems associated with one tek, if you are careful and patient, you can't fail. It's not rocket science. More like cooking...

Imagine that in a cooking forum, someone wants to make baiseer and has to seperate egg white from the yolk. Nobody would ask "A bit of yolk got into my egg white and it didn't foam, im such a loser at making cookies! How long did it take you to master the art of baking baiseer cookies?"

Just follow the tek to the letter, use appropriate equipment. Later on you can still improvise...simply don't improvise from the start and you'll have DMT, BOOM!

I got a pretty good yield on my first try because I spent months researching the process, and have a pretty solid scientific background, so I had a pretty decent understanding of the chemistry involved. For my first time I did Noman's STB TEK. The only problem I had was filtering after the freeze precip because it was a hot day and a lot of the freebase redissolved back into the naptha as it warmed up. Ended up with a small amount of crystals, and had to evap the naptha and wash resulting goo with acetone. It was a good yield though.

It was my second extraction, using FASA that ended up being my first big screw up. Had a lot of problems with filtration due to poor planning and setup.

My biggest screw up, and yet most educational, was with using a THP with san pedro. My setup was too big and I accidentally used too much vinegar. I ended up with an undrinkable "tea" with all the plant fats emulsified in with the aqueous phase. I'd turned a simple mescaline tea, into an improvised A/B extraction. That wasn't pretty, but in the end I made it through the extraction, learned a ton in the process, and was rewarded with a decent yield of alkaloids. The only big disappointment was that the cactus was too young and *most* of the alkaloids were hordenine and the like, with little mescaline. So I did all that work for very little tangible reward. It was an amazing learning experience, however, as I had to improvise most of the steps.

first time.
i even improvised a little.

i just did TONS of research before i extracted, until i completely understood what i was trying to do

This made me laugh

As a chef, I think approaching extractions from a culinary standpoint is what gave me such success from the beginning. I've never taken a chemistry class in my life. I did do a lot of reading teks and threads where people were discussing the chemistry involved. So I had a basic idea of what each step was for and why, because I had to have those answers before going ahead and attempting it myself.

I think that's the key. Read and read and read until you understand the process. Why you want a pH of this or that, why you use a non-polar solvent instead of a polar one, etc. I think what really helped me was reading the threads where people screwed up and were looking for advice. The replies usually explain what went wrong and how to fix it, so you get an idea of what not to do while learning something about the chemistry behind it.

I got crystals on my first try, but I was also way too slow at drying them off so they mercurially melted away from my grasp.

Yep, lots of reading, I'm far from a chemist, maybe alchemist,idk, but my'Braille Tek' worked first time, like a charm!
Thanks to all the folks who put in the hard work if trial and error to come up with the great info here.

I read through so many teks and spent AGES researching before my initial attempt. My first yield was almost 1% from 50g of powdered bark and was only slightly yellow. I was a happy camper

Whow guys thanks for the responses. I think the general consensus was that prior research and a well rounded understanding of each step is critical.

Totally agree.

My extractions weren't completely trashed or worthless, they were more like...depressing. I feel like it put a lot of time into doing each one and when that day would come and I would open the freezer I could see some good but not what I expected. Which is okay I still am getting something.

I know for sure one of my faults is " free styling " because I feel like a touch more of this or a splash more of that is going to help. But I know this must stop. I have this insane problem that I feel like I'm always trying to make something better when I do it. Even if it works perfect. stupid ego

I really appreciate the stories from everyone and I read them thoroughly and with doing so I now know what I must do.

1. Back to the basics.

2. K.I.S.S (keep it simple STUPID!)

3. Research more and more and then some more so I can try to better understand what I thought I knew. But at least with all this experience now maybe reading I will have a better understanding of what Im doing.

I love you guys/gals

Keep it fresh friends