Does anyone got an idea how to battle the fear of other human beeings and their judgements? It's really a dread and I'm already pushing myself to do very uncomfortable things again and again but it doesn't seem to help. I've got the feeling, that everyone hates me, or gets an instant bad impression of me which is nearly impossible to undo. I think it's because i appear fearful. And while I'm giving people the chance to make a second impression on me (because I know I'm often wrong), this doesn't seem to happen when it comes to me. It's always "ah, that kinda guy" ...and it's been very hard to approach other human beeings. Everyone seems to make friends easily while I struggle from word to word, from encounter to encounter while my feet is loosing more and more grip.

Anyone tried beta-blocker to at least remove the physical symptoms of anxiety? I blush all that time..first a little and then I blush really hard because I notice that I'm all red. So even if i pull my shit together and try to perform decently in social situation, it's always obvious, that I'm just _trying_.

Well, I like you

There is some stuff in my binge drinking thread that is basically intended to counter anxiety in a party atmosphere, but I wouldn't recommend using these things habitually. Check out the Edot thread, and it might be worth searching 'anxiety' and if that's not fruitful maybe repeat your post there too, because there's a vast range of plant knowledge there so they should be able to come up with a near-exhaustive list of suggestions. Don't forget to tell us over here what you found out too

I know how you feel. However, a true lasting change is I doubt chemically induced. What helped me was exactly as you are doing- putting yourself continually in situations that will teach you not to be shy. Habituating yourself to them. I got a job as a waiter then barman when I was 18, and that helped. I did find that I would revert to type to an extent when no longer working the bar, but only to an extent.

A bit of cognitive behaviour therapy by reading 'Feeling Good: The NEw Mood Therapy' by David D. Burns is I would say essential. Otherwise you'll just keep scuppering yourself with negative thoughts. I think this would be really helpful for you, because thinking that everyone hates you sounds like a damaging delusion to me.

Incidentally, the newer version of that book covers prescription anti-depressants such as the ones you asked about. However, I'm very suspicious of anti-depressants myself and personally wouldn't go down that road unless I had no other options left.

Following on from my previous groundwork, my next goal was to get over shyness enought to live an extraordinary rather than an ordinary life. Jack Kerouac actually inspired me that extra bit- early Jack, before the booze got to him, such as 'On the Road'. When I really want to do something but am anxious about doing so, I just think "What would Jack do?". I think about how I want an extraordinary life, a self-actualised one, with no enticing opportunity missed. I gear myself up with this thought, and do it.

For example, I was on a bus shortly after reading On The Road, and a hot girl got on. There are lots of hot girls where I live, so at that point I wasn't super-interested, but when I saw she had an arty book in her hand I really wanted to talk to her. But it's not the 'done thing' to talk to people on buses where I live (unfriendly place!). So when my stop came, and I'd wussed out and got off, I thought "what the fuck are you doing wasting your life like that?" Here's where I decided to live like Jack. Judging by her book, I thought she probably will be getting off in my area as it's the 'arty' one. So I ran to the next bus stop! Of course I slowed down as I got near so I wouldn't look crazy. She wasn't there. So I ran to the next one! And guess what, she was there, leaning against the wall waiting for her friend. I went up to her and said hello, that I'd seen her on the bus and that I saw that she liked art by her book, and that I thought how stupid it was to not talk to someone just because they're on a bus. I was unbelievably nervous but I managed to pull it together- the running probably helped. She was surprised, but she liked it, and I got her number. We went on a date. Score! Of course, I still let opportunities slip nowadays, but less often and when I REALLY want to do something, I now go for it. A few months ago I actually did chat up a girl on a bus because she was hot and had a guitar (irrisistable combination!), so I guess the practice is paying off... I didn't get round to actually swapping numbers that particular time, so was kicking myself a little, but still I was amazed at the progression I was making.

Now there was of course the possibility that the first girl would've freaked out by something portrayed as 'romantic' in a movie happening in real life. But who wants a girl who's scared of life anyway? Really the reaction comes down to whether she likes you or not. This girl had probably already seen me on the bus and liked the look of me, although if I was wittier I could've won her over from cold just from chating to her. And if she hadn't liked me, so what? There are so many people in the world. Accept that some of them AREN'T going to like you. Don't let them inhibit you. If they don't like you, then you have no reason to care about what they think. It is only the people who DO like you that you should care for the opinions of. And playing the numbers game is the way to find out who's one of you and who's one of them. Of course it helps if you learn to read the signs... a good book on body language helps.

This kind of thinking applies to interacting with any people, not just girls. Acknowledge that you're nervous, feel the adrenaline, and channel it into action. It's ok to be scared, when you go ahead and do the thing that scares you anyway. You'll find you actually get a real thrill out of doing it afterwards. Massive natural high. And eventually you won't get nervous any more, once your body learns it as normal behaviour.

Honestly the best thing to do is to just not give a flying fuck what people think... theres no way I'd still be a member of the online entheogenic community if I hadn't learned that long ago...

The internet isn't much of a social situation... you'd have to be pretty screwed to get social anxiety online!

OP- if you're seriously considering beta-blockers, you shold be speaking to a psychiatrist about it. Just saying in case you aren't already. If it's not serious enough to visit a doctor, I'd say stay away. On here most people are pretty anti corporate-zombie-pills.

confidence is key...and use your experiences with dmt to show yourself your strength..i mean really...SWIM has been to 'other' fucking worlds!! how many people can even comprehend what that means...know your strength...be like...'hey...ive been to fucking hyperspace! i am strong..i have contacted alien beings!'

SWIM also gets nervous around people...but hes learned to just SHINE..amplify your energy around people..and exude awesome..show people how amazing you are inside..and dont be afraid to share yourself with people...if they dont like who you are...find some new people to hang out with...people that WILL appreciate you...most of the time SWIM has issues with people that are kinda...well how do i put this gently...with closeminded...hateful...negative..people..he cant stand them...but then..he has to remember..that we are all on this earth ship together..traveling between stars...and we are all just trying to have some fun on the way

I would address the medicine on this... take DMT with THH and harmine orally and just ask the medicine to help you change that, ask it questions. I recall once I had a long lasting depression that stemmed from a hurt to my self esteem that a woman/series of women had helped to inflict on me... i asked for little doctors to come and help me remove this pain from my heart... low and behold the closed eye visuals i was expereincing turned into a face composed of those visuals and i felt a hand reach into my heart and this small woman was pulled out of my heart, she was in pain too... and the energy was released and love and light flooded into my heart and I was healed of that long lasting depression that had effected my relationships with women.
your social anxiety CAN be healed in a simular way... smoking DMT i REALLY dont think will do the trick in helping you with that... but an ayahuasca analog would be most benifical if you set an intention for healing and held it through out the session.

I used to be just like that! You got to STOP TRYING to be anything and just be yourself! If you don't care what other people think... then it gives you the comfort of being yourself. It's hard to find good friends out there... if they don't like you for you (which we all know obliguhl, you a cool dude) then fuck them and find somebody better than that person! If they don't like you the way your acting now anyway... what do you have to lose? You can only gain... and learn from your true self.

For this situtation.... I would also suggest you take some cactus... preferably Peyotl. Do it alone in the wilderness, take a large dose on an empty stomach, if you vomit, take more.

Please DO NOT turn to pharmaceutical bullshit zombie pills! Try Kava and Kanna! If that doesn't work... stop all drugs for 30 days and then begin taking Rhodiola rosea. Rhodiola was the only thing that helped me.

I know that very well...



That's also what I thought... but doing it 'alone' is not efficient and can be even counter-productive. By 'alone' I mean without the help of a therapist. A cognitive-behavioral psy would really help you. Speaking to someone who is not 'involved' in your life (like friends and family) is very helpfull. You can say things that you almost do not dare to think.
SSRI or SNRI are also proven efficient medecines for this kind of problem.

@ohayoco
Thanks for your kind words and the book recommendations. I've heard some guys in a related forum talk about the writer you mentioned, and I'll look into it. I just purchased the self help book..looks good from the reviews. It was also very nice to read your little anecdote. This is a situation which has happened to me before and I admire your confidence...and i also like edot - a pretty place indeed.

And I agree that the internet is not , how you put it, that much of a social situation. I have to confess, that the beginning was really hard for me. I could hardly chat with somebody..and was sweating and blushing in front of the screen. But it faded.

@Jorkest
I see what you meean and i think its a good way to go. Now I just have to enter hyperspace for the first time. Sorry guys...butI've only traveled the outer realms, but it sure was beautiful and helped me in a way.

@LLB
I'd love to do aya, but this is not something I will do in a hurry. I need to find someone to watch over me, a good place and time..

@coatl
Thanks for your compliments! Mescaline/Cacti is definatly on my list since reading about it here and how wonderful it is. I know Kava and it's nice in moderate dosage. It really helps a little with social anxiety, but only for an hour or so. And anything above 15g makes me feel REALLY sick. Kanna is something I wanted to try for a long time...and the only adaptogen I've eaten so far is Taigaroot...but it only helps me to fight the common cold.

@garulfo
Well, I won't take SSRIs. I just dont trust them. I tried natural 5-htp and it definatly got an relaxing and mood elevating effect...which is a nice thing but it didn help with anxiety. I also don't trust therapists as I think that many of them are brainwashing agents of the dominatory culture and I really have no real problem telling my friends my secrets..fortunatly, I've found 2 new friends recently and they seem to be really special.

And I have to say that my experience with the "psychedelic community" has been a pleasant one and it feels good to be around intelligent peoople, who do not fear the borderlands of existence, but embrace them..cheers!

"@LLB
I'd love to do aya, but this is not something I will do in a hurry. I need to find someone to watch over me, a good place and time."

you will smoke DMT but you wont take aya eh?
huh...
how far you willing to go to improve your self for the benefit of others... used to be that tribes would have adulthood initiation ceremonies where a child had to DIE to become an adult and they did so for the benefit of the tribe of the community... if your not willing to do that your not willing to grow up... and the healing you seek is primarily focused on unconsciously perpetuating an immature relationship of the world that is primarily narcissistic. The entire biotic community depends on your being a healthy and whole individual if your not willing to die to be that person your a detriment on the biotic community... so how far are you willing to go for the benefit of the whole, it depends on your health wellness and happiness. if your not able to develop and maintain that... the biotic community will kill ya... if you can maintain and develop, health well being and unconditional happiness that means you choose to die... either way you die... and your not unique in this...

You've got a point..i feel that its really this way. It sounds harsh at first, but it's only beneficial if you think about it. Over the course of the last months I've come to realize that one of the things that saddens me is the fact, that I'm too bound by my fears to even help others...it puts shame to myself.

There was this girl with a staple full of books in her hands, with wet eyes..and she was stumbling along her path. She'd stop for every couple of steps as if she'd hope for someone to rescue he before it's too late.

..and there I was - unable to fulfill one of the most basic human functions: to help one another. I feel like a monster.

But I think you should understand me when it comes to aya. I know that the use of such brews is an integral part of the life of quite some tribal cultures, but I wasn't socialized in one, so i think that its only understandable, to seek a supportive context.

I think Cactus would be much better in this situation.

You're not a monster, you're a dude! I'm glad you're buying that book... I've bought so many of those now because I always end up giving it to someone who needs it and everyone wants to keep it once they've got it! Well, EVERYONE needs it really. Apart from Nick Sands, he's got it together! I just can't believe they don't teach you this stuff at school, it's ridiculous, far more practically useful that scripture lessons.

Psychologists are people too, so of course some are going to be jerks or not your type of person or believing in different stuff. But if you live in a country where you can see one for free, or if you've got the money, I'd say give it a shot. They can't brainwash you just by talking to you.

I'm sure it'll work out for you, keep trying. When I was an unhappy little emo-kid in my teens I drank to get confidence so I could speak to girls, and despite gradually improving my confidence vastly over the years as I described earlier, it's only now that I've given up getting drunk that I'm actually dealing fully with my social anxiety. In fact, my renewed interest in psychedelics has really changed my life for the better.

I agree with coatl that mescaline is the friendliest psychedelic, a very gentle teacher. Some people may suggest MDMA but SWIM would say be wary because he became psychologically 'addicted' to it because the contrast between ecstacy and his then-rubbish daily life was too much. Keep the dose LOW with that stuff if you must so it doesn't become escapism. Be wary of escapism with all things, use them as tools, fun tools, but tools nonetheless. The goal is to eventually not even need anything- to become emotionally autonomous. And for SWIM and some others MDMA's mega-depressing for the next 4 days so that's another reason not to use that one. Oh also, give up weed if you haven't already, it didn't help SWIM at all. Not good for the shy.

Finally, I want to say don't resent or regret having this challenge to battle. You can succeed, and the struggle will make you a better person because of it. People who have it easy their whole lives end up as vacuous air-heads

Ohayoco makes an excellent point... this battle is integral in shaping YOU into YOU! As are most, when you have to come to grips with your reality, and how YOU want and need to change it in order to live a life that not only is beneficial and meaningful to yourself, but to others as well.

And, I wholeheartedly agree...

Confidence is everything. Finding inner-confidence is so imperative, in my [short] experience.

Positive energy activates constant elevation, my friends!!

dude, obliguhl you, we, are just different. dont you think its an outrageous statement that everyone hates you? so strange yet the thoughts still show up.

i took a good look at a good batch of fungi this weekend and realize that why not approach that random or unintroduced person on the road. everyone should try it or at least consider it everyday.

yes

propranolol is the old-school chill pill. it works well
I took it when I needed to talk in front of a group of people. some musicians take it for stage fright.

That my friend is a cop out... and if you feel like a monster then do some thing about it... if you want to sit around feeling like a sad sack of shit well join the club we are all sad sacks of shit... but we are also the power and the glory of it all... sacks of shit made of star dust... so you have the power to change so do it and stop being so damn self indulgent. people depend on you the entire biotic community depends on you to be empowered so do it.

as far as aya is concerned... there was a first person that did ayahuasca... a few probably... and every person that does it does it for the first time even if they have a cultural back ground with it... besides some rue and mimosa extract isnt even aya its something else... the first person that discovered aya did not have a supportive context... he or she had a need... just like you do, and SWIM will tell you this SWIMs studied and drank with lots of ayahuasceros and swim was better off before he had any interaction with their cultural relationship with that medicine... IMHO people are much better off discovering their own relationship with these plants and chemicals then trying to imitate the cultures that allready have a relationship with them. To me your just making excuses... i mean to be harsh here because thats life... a mother bird will throw its young out of the nest and if it dies then the entire forest benifits from that because they need strong birds to make a healthy forest... be strong, jump dont get pushed out of that proverbial nest. stop coming up with cop outs and excuses and take a deep breath and just do it.

if you want support... aya has a voice you can talk to it and it will guide and teach you... just like it did the first person who ever took it...

You need to learn to love and appreciate yourself. If you do that then you don't worry about what others think. You gain self confidence and people sense that.