I've been reading a lot of post about caapi leaf tea and I'm wondering how its daily microdosing could help depression. I had been using some sativa strain cannabis to control mine but running into legal troubles I've had to quit. I have some leaf just sitting around and I love teas so if anyone could inform me on the effectiveness of the tea for depression I would be greatly appreciative!

Its extremely effective. But i would get some vine, and some rue as well. but if you have just caapi leaf for now you can use that to. just make tea with 5-10 grams everyday or something...whatever you want really

there is a ton of information on this whole caapi/harmalas/depression topic

https://www.dmt-nexus.me...&m=411913#post411913
https://www.dmt-nexus.me....aspx?g=posts&t=8300
https://www.dmt-nexus.me...aspx?g=posts&t=23263

I found that simply mixing in a couple of caapi leaves (dried or fresh) into my morning tea to be extremely effective. Lower your normal dose of caffeine if you try it though as the stimulant effect is potentiated.

Yeah man caapi has a lot of potential in this arena.

One observation from my experience is that there is a small rebound effect 4-6 day's or so after discontinuing use so you might want to taper off. It's not a huge rebound or anything to be scared of, but it was noticeable to me personally.

Honestly caapi tea will kick marijuana's ass in the depression department... IME.

thank you for the links. I think i will try a couple caapi leaves in some tea in the morning I always need a little pick me up to start my day!

yea marijuana can be good for depression but only for certain people, and often only if used in a certain set/setting/context

in some cases/contexts it can actually make it worse though

yerba mate helps as well, i believe

Sceletium tortuosum has been said to be good for depression too. Can also be utilised as a tea. Mesembrine extract is often out of this world. Oh .. I just found this thread on it https://www.dmt-nexus.me....aspx?g=posts&t=2313

yea lots of things can help...its really good to not get too focused/reliant on one thing and take a broad approach

so things like yoga, meditation, healthy food, clean water, herbs/teas, harmalas, exercise, time in nature, reading/writing/making art, etc :]

i find the best thing for me really is to just keep my mind engaged in activities/books/ideas etc that i find fascinating and which give me a sense of wonder and reverence for the universe and existence

How do you utilise syrian rue, yourself, may I ask?

syrian rue i tend to brew up a 1-3 hundred grams and use the tea in a variety of ways. daily though i'll put .5g or less in a smoothy either before bed or in the afternoon. sometimes even the morning. i'll also use it with mimosa sometimes or just take bigger doses of it by itself or with cannabis once in a while

after a few months of that i'll extract whats left of the tea. with dosing the harmalas daily, i'll take anywhere from 10-100mg of harmalas everynight. sometimes a full psychedelic dose once in a while (closer to 200mg for me)

My first big batch of rue (I'm on batch #2 now) I made the HCL salt.
This time I just did a simple freebase extraction (Gibran tek).

For depression relief I find a couple of valid avenues.

1) Take ~25mgs daily as a micro dose.
2) Take ~150mgs once a week.

Route one has the benefit of almost not being noticeable...think SSRI's.

Route two will be very noticeable initially and then taper off.
BTW 150mgs for me is a full dose. I know others report needing around 200mgs.

I prefer route #2 myself with a small dose of admixture (sometimes just a single shroom as admixture) as opposed to route #1. just me though.

The thing to come to terms with (for me at least), is it's used as a mood stabilizer this doesn't mean put me in a great euphoric mood. Hell life could be throwing a lot of bad mood shit my way, why should a drug make me ignore life? That's not what I want. I just want clarity from an anti depressant. True anti depression comes from changing your life to a less depressing state. I'm not speaking of major depression. I also wouldn't recommend caapi for major depression...just wanted to clear that up. I'm talking about the daily, "My life is blue" sort of blues. I find caapi provides a nice little boost out of that state of mind, but ultimately it is on us, the users, to take that new found state and use it to transform the depressing state we are seeking relief from. Of course this is just my take from a very limited perspective.

Peace

Yeah I've had chronic depression since I was 10 . I don't like western medicine and instead I've turned to studying herbal medicine to treat my problems. Magic mushrooms, kanna, St. John's worth, Valerian root, and marijuana have all helped me. I had successfully used sativa dominate strains for a year to completely treat it, I couldn't use indicas though. I've never looked into harmalas as a treatment but from reading up it seems to be a good therapy.

The question is: Are harmalas just stabilizing your mood, or are they REALLY antidepressant?
There are many herbs out there capable of lifting you up. You might have heard me praising cacao for it's effect on mood. But i've come to differentiate between modd lifting and anti-depressant effects.

To have your depression lifted is like feeling your head expand. Suddenly, there is this airy feeling inside you and you're able to speak, talk and think more clearly. You're also able to do things such as sharing ideas and you do not ponder it's immediate worth - you just do it and it feels so naturally. As if this was part of your identity as a human.

With mood lifting herbs i notice that i feel better and might be more productive, but only because the weight of negative feelings has been partially lifted. This frees up some ressources...but there is no expansiveness and no feeling of being free.

What does caapi do? I've tried microdosing it a while back and do not really remember its effects but i believe it was more mood altering than anti-depressive.

I really would like to find something to treat a heavy depression.
I believe most people do not think i'm really depresseed, because i can smile and actually feel "good" at times....but there is no freedom inside. I can't really be a human.

I know this, because i know how it feels to be "normal".

Harmala makes you feel 'safe'. This isn't something you tend to get from mood stabilizers IME. I don't know how to explain it other than when you live life with harmala imbued in your cells, you stay away from negative situations that you'd be normally drawn to.

This gives you a sense of surety in your footsteps and you feel stable on your own two feet. When depressed you would second guess your every move and ask if it is worth it (it tends not to be for whatever reasons) but on harmala you have faith in your movements & your ability to respond.

Obli, i think its safe to say caapi can work as anti-depressants for some people. (Other MAOI have been used by pharma for a long long time btw...MAOs metabolize serotonin, so inhibiting them would increase serotonin levels). I think its unclear what caused it, but there is a study showing aya can upregulate serotonin uptake sites, which could mean people are then more sensitive to serotonin therefore less prone to depression. But thats just one aspect of how it can help

"To have your depression lifted is like feeling your head expand. Suddenly, there is this airy feeling inside you and you're able to speak, talk and think more clearly. You're also able to do things such as sharing ideas and you do not ponder it's immediate worth - you just do it and it feels so naturally. As if this was part of your identity as a human."

I get this from harmalas ^


But as i said in my first post-
its really good to not get too focused/reliant on one thing and take a broad approach

so things like yoga, meditation, healthy food, clean water, herbs/teas, harmalas, exercise, time in nature (btw i think mushrooms im nature can greatly help if done carefully, even in low doses), reading/writing/making art, etc :]

i find the best thing for me really is to just keep my mind engaged in activities/books/ideas etc that i find fascinating and which give me a sense of wonder, gratitude, and reverence for the universe and existence"

Universecannon

Truly beautifully said...


Much Peace and Respect

You both have convinced me to give it another try. I'm a lot more depressed this winter and the thing i didn't do was take any psychedelics. Someone in my family died and i wanted to mourn without taking any psychedelics. It just didn't feel right to me. Usually, i tend to drink ayahuasca during winter, at least a couple of times. It might very well have been a contributer to a cleaner mindstate in 2011/12. But now it's time to get back on the road and microdosing caapi is something i want to try again. I think the last time i felt rather weird after a couple of days, but lets see how it goes.



If you are really depressed, you do not have much motivation or interest in ANY ideas besides laying in your bed. I went through times, i even found it too hard to empty out the dishwasher - i forgot where to start and it seemed pointless. This is the real problem. In the last 5 years, i've had maybe a month in total in which i really felt alive and with purpose. Most of the time i'm just trying to somehow pass the time and to do at least SOMETHING. All these things you mentioned are vital to ones health, but if you do not have the energy to do anything at all...they're far out of reach. That's ehy i'm so desperate for pharmaceutical agents. I remember the time 3-4 years aog i refused to take any drug to help me with depression - these days i see them as potential lifesavers!

I believe the first Western use of harmine and harmaline (in the early 20th century?) was to treat depression.

See this and Google “TriRima” as an example of how modern synthetic RIMAs are used.

I dont find caapi to be as good an anti-depressant as when tryptamines are present. A fuller dose with admixture once a week is more more useful in the end in my experience. Then go out and find some sort of purpose for your life durring the week between sessions..daily dosing is interesting but weekly full doses with sober integration(meaning actaully doing something in the world not just sitting at home meditating, watching TV or w/e) seems to keep me much more fulfilled.

DMT and psilocin have some anti depressant effects that harmalas definatly lack. They are best combined.

I basically agree with this, but I do find caapi to actually be pretty good on it's on...

Cappi leaves (small handful) and 1 green tea bag. SHREBANG. Great mood, full of energy all day long.