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I would advise him to get a new friend ! ...One who doesn't dose him high and irresponsibly...

Do some reading...

probably the stupidest thing I've read yet...

Even if the dosage is massive, one can still 'fight' the experience regardless of how 'incapacitated" they are. Thats exactly what your friend did.

This substance/experience deserves the utmost respect and caution. Start small and work your way up. This molecule and the experience facilitated is not something to be taken lightly.

tat

Probably around 60-70mg...

Screaming, suicidal thoughts, can't remember much...

Well, I'd say that sounds like your friend is paying the price for too high a dose, and not having any preperation.

I think if your friend knew more about the effects and about letting go he would not have had such a bad experience.

Read, read, read...

Guys, as I wrote, for him the experience itself WASN'T BAD.
It was disturbing from the outside, that's all.

The only problem now is that upon waking up he is having some sort of trip-like dreams, that's all, during the day he feels fine, and the trip wasn't "scary" or "disturbing" in the traditional sense.

The suicidal thoughts occured only after the two trip-like dreams that he had.


after a lot of failed attempts at breaking through I tried such a high dose myself (actually more) since the exeperiences were really mild. My friend tried to vape (actually it was me handling the pipe) a little less than that and he didn't even feel it.
I figured that our technique was just really bad, so I was trying to slowly increase the dosage.

So I didn't just "dose him irresponsibly" out of nowhere.

sorry, double post.

You DID dose him irresponsibly. You gave HIM a high dose based on YOUR previous failures to breakthrough.

I'm not trying to beat you up here, but really... of all the things to consider when dosing someone else.... you missed A LOT.

Mistakes happen, but read up on dosage and technique for your own sake as well as your friend's.



Maybe the "experience" wasn't bad, but the aftermath sounds pretty shitty. You don't get to separate the two in order to vindicate your lack of thought.

Then you probably have not smoked it very often. Screaming, grunting, crying, making all sorts of weird noises...body movements which seem like convulsions - all perfectly normal and almost part of any decent dosed experience for me. I have filmed me once and it does indeed look very disturbing.

Pulp Tentacle: What I did sounds pretty stupid to me regardless of the dose to tell you the truth.

Right now I'm just asking for advice on the trip-like dreams (two of them so far). He feels weird and uncomfortable when he wakes up.

He feels like he's definitely getting better, but still: do you have any advice on that? do you guys have ever had such a thing?

Come on cyb, does that really help anybody?


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This is definitely not the stupidest thing I have ever read. People make mistakes, honestly i cant see how you could have known better if you haven't seen it for yourself (Now you might have some perspective). This is why I personally don't trust other people with dosing my drugs.
Doesn't mean you could have used some common sense, like dosage information on the forum. BUT, too late now. Mistakes happen.


As you can see, DMT is extremely unpredictable. No one reacts to it the same way. Screaming, convulsing, seizures, can happen.

I used to want to show others DMT, now, I don't like to as much.
DMT has shown me some terrifying things, things I wish upon no other person.


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I've come to the conclusion that there is no 'right' way to give somebody DMT. There is no 'safe' dose.

I've seen this happen myself.

DMT is something that should be seeked out and experienced by yourself, not forced upon you by some other person.

DMT is serious s***

You cannot expect DMT (or any other psychedelic) to have no effects on you when the trip is over! They represent a permanent change in your life, the magnitude of this change depending on many factors. Either a positive change from the beginning, or positive after managing to integrate the experience. I am not saying these dreams will continue forever, merely that a trip cannot be regarded as an isolated period of time.

You may interpret this any way you like, drinking a glass of water also has a permanent effect on you (although generally different from psychedelics), but my point is everything you do has an effect, and all your experiences make you what you are now. So instead of trying to get rid of these dreams, embrace them if it feels appropriate, try to understand them, learn from them... it is very important not to be afraid or reluctant for the sole reason of still experiencing effects hour or days after the experience. Understanding this can make it not uncomfortable and weird, but instead a nice thing.

..yes the screaming part on a very high dose (which is what 60mg+ is) is not unusual..

the DMT folklore around 15 years ago included: 'people think they've died' etc..

as other respondents say it should be treated with the upmost respect and caution..

if a culture of expecting a 'good time' or buzzy patterning is developing, then this is not healthy..

..spirit molecule, right?
that doesn't sound like bongs on a saturday night, or a casual experience to share..
.

I would not even load that amount for myself, let alone someone else who has either not had smaller experiences or studied up on what this is. Start small as in ten mg, if it does not work you are doing something wrong. Clean the pipe and start over with holding it in your lungs longer or get a different pipe. If you can not get another pipe because it is late just wait until next time.

The dreams after a breakthrough can be difficult. I remember after waking up the first night after my breakthrough it was like waking up through a mandala into a new life but it was difficult to sleep being aware of so much activity going on with my eyes shut. It was difficult to "melt" and "let go" into sleep.

If it is difficult to get to sleep I would recommend drinking some night time tea, going to "sleep" maybe an hour early, putting on a suitable binaural beat with headphones and humming to it until the onset of sleep. I would try to stay away from alcohol or sleeping pills. If your friend becomes conscious of a DMT like experience in sleep tell your friend to focus on it instead of waking up. Hope that helps your friend....

What they all said ^


And the trip-like dreams are nothing to worry about so long as they don't cause problems. DMT and psychedelics have permanently altered my dreamlife, and i love it. It'll most likely fade over time or he'll get used to it and learn to work with/enjoy it

"he completely came back probably after 30 minutes or something, wich is unusual."

with such a large dose, and chaotic trip like that, its not unusual. Chaotic trips take longer to feel centered after. And 60mg in one hit is very very different from 60mg taken in 3 hits btw

That's exactly what I was thinking as read this. That, and what an asshole.

Don't be cavalier with the brains of others, people. And don't play tour guide if you're not familiar with the terrain.

Mindlusion, Valura, voyaj, thank you. That's the info I was looking for.


As I said, I have no problem admitting that I did a stupid thing, the whole thing was stupid, but it had to happen.
My friend is just fine now, the trip-like dreams are practically over, they don't cause problems anymore.
He says he's grateful it happened, but he feels he doesn't need to repeat it.

This happens way too often. Anyone that isn't experienced with DMT should be dosing way lower until they have the technique down. Tossing in that high of a dose because you want to breakthrough is not smart. What happens when you figure out your technique during a dose that you overloaded like that? Learn technique before tryijg to learn to breakthrough.

I've dosed 50mg before. Infact it was the last dose I've done. Having a hard time dosing again. I'm greatful for the experience but it took a long time to integrate. Learn to drive before you enter the race.

Wait... I'm getting a sense that dosing three to four times of a breakthrough dose to a first time DMT user is not a good idea????

(Thick sarcasm if you missed it)


Be careful out there!

I'm glad you learned from this experience super. I disagree that it had to happen though. Large doses like that can have severe psychological effects on a person for months. I went through weeks of dealing with an inability to fully accept that this reality was real. I consistently had thoughts that I would never be normal again. And truthfully, I never returned to my normal self. I AM different. Luckily none of the differences I percieve as being negative or hindering. I am a different person now and it took a long time to cope with being different.

I hope that those new to DMT or new to dosing other people can see the lesson in this. If you dose someone you need to know how to go about it. I believe an introduction dose is important. Somewhere around the 15mg range. That way you know how it will effect you. Increase dosage accordingly. If you know your technique isn't quite right, increasing dosage is not the proper way to compensate.