Agreed.

All things are available to choose from, but the choice is never free.

If you want to see the physical nature of what I am talking about, all you must do is look towards Sentience Quotient - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sentience_quotient


The crux of the matter: there is no need to run around in wishy washy futile philosophical back and forth fluffy drivel that inevitably ends in "I don't know man, and you definitely can't know either because I don't and I can't imagine how someone would know" (sigh). Science has already answered most of this question.


According to this equation, humans have an SQ of +13. A human neuron has an average mass of about 10−10 kg and one neuron can process 1000-3000 bit/s, giving us an SQ rating of +13. All other animals with a nervous system (or all 'neuronal sentience' from insects to mammals, cluster within several points of the human value. Plants cluster around an SQ of −2. Carnivorous plants have an SQ of +1, while the Cray-1 had an SQ of +9. IBM Watson, which achieves 80 TFLOPS[2] (using 64-bit words) and consists of 90 IBM Power 750 weighing approximately 100 kilograms (220 lb) each,[3] has an SQ in the range of +11—+12.

The theoretical superconducting Josephson junction electronic gates could weigh 10−12 kg and process 1011 bits/s, giving an "electronic sentience" made of these components an SQ of +23.

(...)

SQ is not limited to sentient beings so far encountered by humans, but extends to all possible sentiences, defining an expected range.

The lowest SQ possible would have just one neuron with the mass of the whole universe (1052 kg) and require a time equal to the age of the universe (1018 seconds) to process just one bit, giving a minimum SQ of -70. It has been argued that under multiverse theory, an infinitely low SQ is theoretically possible, though Freitas is not known to have commented on this possibility himself.

The fundamental upper limit to brain efficiency is imposed by the laws of quantum mechanics: all information, to be acted upon, must be represented physically and be carried by matter-energy "markers." According to the Uncertainty Principle in quantum mechanics, the lower limit for the accuracy with which energy can be measured—the minimum measurable energy level for a marker carrying one bit–is given by Planck's constant h divided by T, the duration of the measurement. If one energy level is used to represent one bit, then the maximum bit rate of a brain is equal to the total energy available E = (mc_0)^2 for representing information, divided by the minimum measurable energy per bit (h/T) divided by the minimum time required for readout (T): (mc_0)^2/h = 1050 (bit/s)/kg. Hence the maximum possible SQ is +50.

There doesn’t appear to be free will. Not here, not anywhere.

The information you present is interesting, but I don’t think it’s correct to label it as “will” or “free”.

Please define "will". This is where miscommunication seems to be arising. We hold different definitions for the same words.


What you don't see is that you ARE experiencing all these potential realities simultaneously. Locally speaking (i.e. within the light cone) there is a precise finite set of potential realities, these are defined exactly by statistical mechanics and behave according to various laws. It all revolves around entropy changes.



The appearance of cold determinism is only seen when you're looking at the Book of Life, and reading that tiny little chapter called "Things that have actually happened and are happening right now".

This is the determinist:




To do this is to do the Book grand injustice. To truly understand Will, one must read the entirety of the Book of Life. Namely, the unfathomably large second book in the series: "Things that did not happen but could have occured". This set is HUGE.

The determinist points to the fact that X causes Y and says "Y could not have arisen in any other way". This is wrong. There are MANY ways to Y. And there are likewise, MANY points like Y. If you want to understand this, you can look at Richard Feynman's Path Integral Formulation of quantum mechanics; where we calculate the probability for a particular particle by summing over all possible paths it could travel through simultaneously.



Another demonstration is double-slit single photon interference, self-interference. This clearly points towards those dimensions of imaginary time. The photon wavefunction passes through both slits simultaneously but when we observe a single photon, the photon itself appears to just go through one.





We can deduce from these observations that there are dimensions of imaginary spacetime. This is the second book of the "Book Of Life" series as stated: Things that did not happen but could have occured.



Will does not work across time. It works on a dimension orthogonal to time itself. Which we would call "imaginary time". That's to say that your mind (and everything for that matter) projects out into infinity and calculates the best wavefunction to pass through. But all those imaginary situations that could have existed in real spacetime, they are happening exactly as imaginated in these orthogonal spaces. They happen in the present moment.

To understand how this works, you must wrap your head around the idea of there being more than one direction of time. How would it behave? Clue: you're experiencing it right now. As "time" is experienced as a projection of the 3D volume through a 4D space; so is imaginary time a projection of a 4D volume through a 5+D space. If time as we know it is "going forwards" then these axes of imaginary time are like "going across" - that's orthogonality.




To hold determinism is to disregard the process of truth seeking. The universe is a truth-seeking machine. This is its entire mode of operation, it is nothing but an information processor at heart. It is contemplating across imaginary time, and writing to its memory/journal. The journal is what you are experiencing here and now, that which is made real. But you cannot disregard imaginary time, because to do that is to blind yourself to the true reality.

There is a fuzzy reality where all of what did not happen here, did happen over there. There is a reality for each and every possibility. It never breaks the law of Tao though. But the key point is that when you change your frame of reference to a different point along the imaginary time axes, THIS reality here and now resides in imaginary time. Let Z be THIS reality, Y be an arbitrary reference frame somewhere else along the imaginary time axes (this reality is also a point in imaginary time, keep in mind). Now we let X be the past moment, that leads to two choices: Y and Z.



The determinist in this reality, would look at that reality Y, from this world Z and think "pfft, how could that even be. Everyone knows this reality is deterministic, there is no possible way for X to go into Y, it's clearly the "Z" I am experiencing right now".

The determinist in that reality, would look at this reality Z, from that world Y and think "pfft, how could that even be. Everyone knows this reality is deterministic, there is no possible way for X to go into Z, it's clearly the "Y" I am experiencing right now".

You see what I mean? This is the determinist:




Get your head around imaginary time and you might understand where I am coming from. This is relativity of simultaneity.

I define will as “the act of choosing”. So free will would be “the act of choosing without constraint”.

The absence of determinism does not imply the presence of “free will”. Free will is no more possible in a nondeterministic multiverse than it is in a deterministic universe.


How is a machine “free”?


A reality that never breaks the law of Tao is a reality with constraints. To be constrained is to not be free.


Free will is an abstraction – an illusion. Isn’t it?

I see where you're coming from. Yes, free will is an illusion for us human beans. We DO have a set of choices. To make some analogies -

Determinism: They can have any colour they like, as long as it's black.

Free will: Any colour you like, even if it's not actually on the EM spectrum whatsoever

Tao: Any colour you like, as long as it's one of those in the visual spectrum.


There is freedom. The freedom is YOU. YOU are the ghost in the machine, YOU are free of it all. See these words I am writing down? I'm programming this machine. Just like YOU. I am YOU. I AM the words on this screen you are looking at. I'm looking at YOU right now. You're looking at me. Now I'm rippling around inside your brain. Now you're thinking of what to write back. To who? To you, to whom is Me.


The freedom arises in that we can freely choose the constraints of the future. If the constraints of the future can be chosen then by symmetry, the constraints of the past have been chosen!

Once a constraint is set, there is no breaking it. This is the very fabric of the universe itself. What we see in front of us here right now is actually these constraints. All you see is a constraint upon the Clear Light of the Void. Destroy the puddle, the reflection of the moon disappears. The Moon remains.

The constraints are the puddle. The reality we see, is the reflection of the Moon in the puddle. The Moon is untouched. The Moon of the Clear Light reflects on every puddle. Every puddle contains a reflection of the Clear Light. But not a single puddle is the Moon itself. Destroying the puddle does not touch the Moon.

This reality here and now is this: The Clear Light shining through one set of self-imposed constraints amongst many, a multidimensional resonant cavity shining into itself using the poles of Duality.


After all, how do YOU look in the mirror if there is no Other?


A little word on "here and now": As opposed to this reality, here and now, we have... This reality there and now; there and relatively simultaneously now. I'm at my desk. You're at yours.



These constraints (what we call 'facts' or 'truth' are only valid for this particular coordinate in imaginary time. In other reference frames, some of what we behold as evident fact is not true and vice versa.
The facts of relevance here, are the actual happenings. They are not the inherent nature of the process by which things evolve: they are not Tao. The Schrodinger equation would be invariant along imaginary times - this is Tao. But the wavefunction (i.e. facts, aka 'what happened in the past' would change and we plug that into the Schrodinger to get our result.
These constraints are like lots of tiny little mirrors in the resonant cavity. Light shines out from Source, bounces through the myriad faceted mirrors of Truth & Falsehood, and shines back into Source.
The orientation of these mirrors are adjustable. In imaginary time, we have the entire base covered such that there is an unconstrained reality at a certain point in imaginary time for every constraint it imposes upon itself at every other point.
Thusly, the Clear Light may explore the world of paradox. In one world, you said Yes. In its mirror world, you said No. These are a paradox in 4D. But in Imaginary time, the paradox dissolves. We can say "Yes" in this 4D manifold over here, and "No" in that other 4D manifold over there.


For example, in our world humans see on the visual spectrum, something like a bit less than the range of 300nm to 800nm. But across the dimensions of imaginary time, there are worlds where we have humans with vision in the x-ray range. In this or that range. With their own aesthetic, their own Art, with their own idea of Tao. We like high cheekbones on our faces over here. Another point in imaginary time, all the humans like low cheekbones and see in the visual spectrum. Yet another point, all the humans like low cheekbones and see in the x-ray range.

The Clear Light wears these constraints like a pair of glasses with colour filters. These constraints are not the Clear Light. What's more, it is wearing every single possible pair of filter glasses at once. And using them to constantly churn out new ones.

The Clear Light is infinite, eternal, unchanged, ever-living, and Absolute. As it is Absolute, it is free of all things. When we know that the Clear Light is timeless, the phenomenon of the timeless movement of the Clear Light occurs through imaginary time. Thus, it is neither within time, nor without time but encompassing both yet free of all.


One common thing between all filtering glasses We wear (aka imaginary time points/realities): The Tao that can be told, is not the real Tao.
Ultimately, that is where this thread will lead. So consider that sentence as my final response to all things, done and dusted.



When we go into higher dimensional spaces, these notions of free will become irrelevant. An understanding of the physics will dissolve all of these paradoxes.
Just as the idea of a 2D character finds it impossible to leave his house without breaking his door off, so do we find it seemingly impossible to think beyond this constraint. But extend our 2D dude into 3D and he is boggled to find he could have slipped around his constraints before. Like so for us. Our constraint is the imagination of free will.

This is what physics is brilliant at, dissolving paradoxes and showing their fatal flaws. It's great at disproving theories of existence too. We can cut the wheat from the chaff easily.





"What is physics? Physics is nothing but the laws of harmony that you can write on vibrating strings. What is chemistry? Chemistry is nothing but the melodies you can play on interacting vibrating strings. What is the universe? The universe is a symphony of vibrating strings. And then what is the mind of God that Albert Einstein eloquently wrote about for the last 30 years of his life? We now, for the first time in history have a candidate for the mind of God. It is, cosmic music resonating through 11 dimensional hyperspace.

So first of all, we are nothing but melodies. We are nothing but cosmic music played out on vibrating strings and membranes. Obeying the laws of physics, which is nothing but the laws of harmony of vibrating strings." - Michio Kaku

Here is a resource that explains this all brilliantly:

Wikibooks/Consciousness_Studies/The_Philosophical_Problem

..while still taking in this thread, i feel like commenting:

really, is there any will other than the Will..?
is there individual will?

on the one hand we have chaos, and on the other order..

order seems intrinsically linked with consciousness..

the 'will' allows observable order amidst chaos..

all that need by set in motion is the basic order of the universe..
the 'will' 'chooses' an aesthetic (it is a very beatiful universe)
from this all actions are inevitable..

ps. science can be just as much a prisoner of dogma as religion..

That's precisely it nen888.


I presented the ever-expanding chessboard analogy earlier in this thread I believe.

Essentially there is one way to be correct and a myriad ways to be incorrect, this applies to all equations & flows of energyinformation (IMO, energy & information should be condensed into a single word containing both meanings, e.g. Tao).



So of the possible "What IFs", the Self chooses a single IF and performs the entropy expanding operation on it, that is to say we choose an aesthetic out of a wardrobe of possible clothes (imaginary time/possibility space).


Please keep in mind that entropy DOES NOT mean "decay". This is a delusion propagated by those who hold that the universe is meaningless & purposeless.


Decay is a subset of entropy, in the same way as growth is a subset. Notice that as time goes forward, everything becomes MORE intelligent? Then wherefrom arises the notion of a decaying universe? This is a proud misunderstanding and it will condemn all those who believe as such to perpetual suffering whether they like it or not.



The fact that the neurons in your brain are intelligent right now means that all the stars distributed through the universe must themselves be resonating in tune with your intelligence; if they were out of line then the necessary boundary conditions are not there for neurons to develop! So all of these stars you see in the sky, each and every one is positioned with perfect finesse to create the experience you observe today.



Why do we not intuit this normally? Because compared to the universe's age, let's proportion it such that 13.7byo => 80yo, the average lifespan, a human exists for roughly 11 or 12 seconds. A mere flash, a blink of an eye. We cannot see the glacial movements that permeate the grand cosmos, we cannot hear below a certain frequency nor above it - the ultralong and ultrafine wavelengths are of particular interest, a world we are wholly unprivy to!