Recently my girlfriend had an experience like this on salvia. She is fine now but at the time it must have been somewhat traumatizing.

I've heard of this type of experience a number of times. Apparently TMK had such an experience that made him quit eating mushrooms.

I have had messianic delusions and feelings of the end of time but nothing so in my face like this.

However, the idea that life is void of meaning is something that I think about from time to time and would like to get some information on the subject from you guys. Possibly some firsthand experiences as well.

Thank you, and see you in hyperspace!

Yes. It is very very brutal. Very challenging to your sanity.

Please tell your gf that she's not alone, and she has my great sympathy, and I offer her love.

I'd say that life could be considered devoid of INHERENT meaning. The meaning it does have, is the meaning we choose to give it, and IMO this doesn't make it any less important.

Perhaps she should do a little soul searching, and try to create a purpose for herself. Whatever her particular passion in life is, whatever gives the most satisfaction to engage in, is probably the best place to start.

Also, Salvia seems to have a tendency for teaching very harsh lessons. Aya might be a gentler way to go in the future.

Yes, that's not usually a fun one to look at, especially on Salvia. But she certainly isn't alone.

When such traumatic experiences have happened to me, I've found it useful to acknowledge that it happened, done is done. And I didn't learn this the first, second, third, or fourth time. But, since it's actually over, all of the "trauma" that goes on afterward is just some form of, "I wish that didn't happen." That's why when you see that it did happen and there's nothing you can do, you realize you're free. Sometimes, however, healing is slow.



Also, this.

I like to use this image of the universe as a blank canvas, and we, who are the universe walking around in itself, are the painters. It wouldn't make sense if the canvas wasn't blank, you don't hear about anyone painting over the Mona Lisa. No, the joy is in the blank canvas, because you have full license to create whatever you want, as stupid or amazing or boring or beautiful as you can.

It's like, on the one hand we're so myopic that we blow up the problems we invent in our heads and make them a cosmic drama, and on the other we disqualify ourselves as worthless and insignificant. We exist as much as anything does! The meaning that we give to "the universe" is real meaning, existence gives itself meaning.

Best wishes to your girlfriend. Please tell her that patience and gentleness and self-love make all the difference with things like this.

Yes, and as stated above, these can be very difficult experiences to integrate. I was told by a group of entities that earth is essentially a high level (by human standards) science experiment used to determine how sentient beings react to different types of stimuli.

I also had a very profound vision where, at the end, a group of laughing and cynical entities were like, "haha, you thought that was a life changing experience?..., well then, how about this?... or this?... or this? (as they used their hands to manufacture new visions that basically replicated what I had just seen, in addition to other visions instantaneously). You do realize that we are simply manipulating your perceptions and are capable of making you think whatever we want you to, don't you?"

It messed with my mind for a while to say the least. However, I've had many, many more experiences that reflect life as an intricate and meaningful journey. Nobody knows for sure, but I'm going to spend my time trying to leave this place better than I found it, whether the truth be the former or the later.

Peace and Love, and I wish your girlfriend much healing.

Thanks. I like that. It actually helps me to give consideration to that perspective.

Really, solidly having that experience is...quite a whack. That's all I can say. Seriously.

The spirit seams to be telling me the physical world is an illusion, my/I and I's misguided creation, if I am not careful I might interpret this as meaningless. Love is the answer that corrects this, for me. Because I know love exists and the ego does not, the truth is to me I must be here out of love. Eternity perhaps trying to wake its self of the dream.

I've only tried Salivia once and it left me feeling quite dirty/discombobulated. That was in 2001 and I haven't felt the need to revisit that realm.

DMT on the other hand has shown me more about the nature of reality and how beautiful being alive truly is. I was an atheist before, but now I'm pretty positive there is way more going on than just physics and the 5 senses.

DMT has changed my opinion from thinking that life is somewhat pointless to seeing it as this enormously beautiful story that I'm a part of....have been a part for eternity. DMT has quieted a lot of the fear I have about life and especially death.

I'm so grateful to have gotten an invitation to life

I kind of like the way the movie Cloud Atlas illustrates this to a certain degree.

[]Deace

Here's what i think!

Life is just life. It's an adventure, and if it has a meaning it's because we have given it one. I guess in it's purest form that what we call life can seem meaningless, but i think that's because we are living in a meaningless and wrong way. True that what we know is really nothing compared to 'what there is' to life, and will never know. We only know what we allow ourselves to know. we build our own little nests of comfort to carry our spirit in our body safely through this experience called life.we also limit ourselves from getting close to the truth by our percieved limits that we have created. We are physical manifestations of the divine energy and are what we make ourselves to be. Even laws have been created to make entheogens illegal, making our connections to these realms of true meaning difficult. We are then forced to seek out meaning through overwork and other unnatural disconnected ways. It's no wonder that what we know as life is pretty meaningless, because it's a wrong and dumb way to live.

Meditators would say that we should 'just be', as in align ourselves to the greater, because our earthly things are merely for existence to enable ourselves to connect with these realms. I believe our duty is to seek the truth, and since birth to death we start in this quest to grow into this physical world and experience it, and to seek the truth which is to seek out the states of transcendence, or the psychadelic realms. This is where the true 'paititi' exists, the real beauty and riches.

Forget about a mansion, sports car, top job, for those are 'needs' that were created for you to want by the consumer culture which is about as natural as silicon boobs! The consumer culture wants to trap you into these earthly traps, but they are ugly and meaningless. There's no real riches to be found in materialism.

> I would say a nice way to put meaning into ones life is to spend more time with family and loved ones, go out into the nature alone or with friends. Make music together, paint, travel in this world, try and find work that makes your heart sing. The truth is aligned with happy vibes, so if it feels good then you're on the right track. Take your time, and don't rush through life, and don't fall for the consumer culture and be a slave to it's fashion. Stick to a simple life and focus on the higher ground.

.... isn't everyone seeking something deeper?..Isn't that what we are really here for? You have started on your quest...Good luck!

Just a few early morning thoughts.

christian:
You just managed to put into words what I thought but could never express. Thanks for that.

(you wake up at 6am on a Sunday morning...rain outside...wrapped in a duvet...and fill your head with gems...I Nexus)

Thanks Cyb!

I totally agree christian. Very well put

i had a meaningless experience on mushrooms when i was a lot younger. It was one of the key trips of my life, cathartic and beautiful. The mental weights were lifted from my shoulders and i wept and flew.
However i am a bit of a neuropath so those sorts of things usually do me good

nahh

Salvia can be existentially terrifying indeed. There was one occasion that caused to me rethink using it twice when I became the couch. I thought to myself, "I'm just a couch. I have no friends. No one to sit on me. I'm just a couch..." It was scary, depressing and confusing indeed, but of course it turns out I'm not the couch (at least not entirely ) and as for your girlfriend, I hope she likewise finds that the world and life is far from meaningless.

Let's start simply by thinking about what creates "meaning". Meaning is established through connections and is perceived as connectivity between two or more things. Psychedelics tend to be associative and to enhance these connections through juxtaposing ever-more diverse visual elements, thoughts, concepts, etc...Salvia on the other hand is a dissociative which tends to destroy connections, so it's almost not so surprising that she would arrive at such a conclusion. Meaning is reaffirmed through synchronicities. You should have her read or watch some videos on sacred geometry and still try to see the universe as chaotic, haphazard and meaningless.

what does meaning even mean? i think its an artificial problem.

survival and reproduction appear to be honest, though.

i suppose that in a popular context, every experience i have ever had reinforced the absence of meaning, purpose, point, truth, teleology, goal, as long as they are at all metaphysical.

I came to this conclusion a while ago. For some reason I found it oddly comforting. it really hasn't bothered me.

I guess I look at it as a possibility. My head is full of possibilities, but hardly ever do I decide that anything is concretely true. Also, I really view it is life has no inherent meaning, as Crazyhorse said. I think we give it meaning by deciding what meaning it has.

Really, that is a lot of power to hold, isn't it?

Good luck on figuring this one out. Psychedelics help the mind to create new problems, and it is our duty to learn to solve them, or at best live with them. In the end the user gets the benefit of having a more complex and agile mind.

I disagree that psychadelics create new problems.

Psychadelics are tools to help enlighten people to the truth, that the ego tends to cut them off from. Indeed to 'go with the flow' is what life is all about, and 'problems', should be renamed in a more positive light like 'learning opportunities'.

IMO, it's our duty to live right, and that means getting the basics sorted so that we can devote our energies to the real good things that we were born to do...

I like the "blank canvas" analogy a lot.

I think that part of the struggle comes from our cultural mythology. We are taught that the universe was made for us, we were given a purpose, the bearded guy in the sky has drawn out a path for us. Even those of us who are raised by atheist parents are surrounded by the essence of this cultural mythology- in short, that meaning is a thing that inherently exists. So it can be a real shocker to find that the opposite is true, and that meaning is entirely up to us. As Global said, synchronicities can affirm meaning because they illustrate the deep connections we have to the world around us, our position within the great life story. And love, of course... That needs no context to be meaningful. We should never doubt the validity, depth or reality of our own feelings. We are immersed in them; they are about as real as real gets. Unless you require some kind of universal real, in which case you've got quite a struggle on your hands.

To become comfortable with the blank canvas, to become empowered to write your own meaningful story and live it to its fullest... That is true liberation. Which can sometimes be a little scary.

Absolutely, on mushrooms I have gone into a complete blank depressive state where I was like wow life really is completely and utterly meaningless and if I die this second it will not even matter at all.

I am so grateful for that revelation it helps me see things in perspective so well to this day.