Most of my mushroom experiences and all my LSD doses were in a social environment. Not at a keg party or anything but I like the way mushrooms allow you to connect with other people and pointing at moving stuff and laughing with your buddies is extremely healthy I think

this.
a superior attitude is not indicative of a superior education.

Don't most old world shamans incorporate alcohol and tabacco into their psychedelic journeys?

where do you mean when you say "old world"?

Since this is about dmt, i guess i'll assume you mean the amazon..in that case, afaik, no.. most definitely don't incorporate alcohol into it, although some for sure do. i think most do use tobacco though. But this isn't ordinary tobacco. its mapacho.. which contains harmine, harmaline, and even a little bit of thh -if i remember correctly

I don't even want to mix loud music with DMT!! Seriously. More power to anyone capable of maintaining while mixing this stuff, but I'm too scared!!

I do like mixing alcohol with some other mild psychedelics like 2ci-nbome or high dose MJ. I would never mix it with LSD, mushrooms, or other brain-fucking chemicals because I need a little inhibition when my mind is trying to convince me that I can run through the wall and hang out with the girl next door.

i believe the general standard is the americas are the new world, whereas eurasia is the old world (idk what category islands like aus fall into)

I have yet to use d without drinking, I always needed something to settle my nerves, and I'm and alchoholic. I've had the most intense, immersive oev godhead experiences drunk off my ass. Dmt completely overrides the alchohol for me. But I've recently quit drinking, and in recovery, so one day I will go into it sober and see what happens.

The one time I tried it it was pointless. DMT is about 100x more clear and profound when not drunk..for me anyway. I dont enjoy alcohol to begin with much anyway so I am biased.

There is a part in me who wants to drink Aya and act like Bender in this little clip.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=...ature=related#t=0h01m02s

Yeah, thank god this part has nothing to say.

I tried to drink a beer lately, a week after the ceremonies and after 4 weeks of abstinence. It tasted horrible, the effect was boring, my body didn't liked it, and i drank only half of it. That was with my favorite brand of beer.

I'm going to agree with the posters who have said it all depends on the person partaking in the experience and what they're trying to get out of it. I have the utmost respect for all entheogens and I believe they can be used for many purposes, including fun (however I rarely dose for fun anymore). When I did dose for fun, it was always a pretty mild/low dose in a social setting or at a concert or something.

I mean how many of you don't know a single person that has ever taken a psychedelic at a concert? I know it's possible because I've experienced it, but generally dosing in that setting isn't going to bring on a deeply introspective, enlightening spiritualistic type experience. Is that the "wrong way" to use psychedelics? I don't think so. In my personal opinion someone would be severely limiting the potential of what said psychedelic had to offer if that "party setting" was the only time they ever used it but that's just my opinion. Some awesome people I know are truly happy with their lives as they are now and aren't at all seeking any type of enlightened state or new spiritual experiences through psychedelics but still use them. This is fine by me, as long as they do it safely and responsibly. These people, however, are reminded by myself that there is much more that these chems have to offer pretty regularly.

If I'm looking for a deeply introspective or spiritual experience, I usually won't be mixing alcohol with my DMT at all and I generally won't be dosing around a lot of other people. However, I have taken a couple shots or downed a couple beers a little while prior to dosing and had deeply introspective, insightful, spiritual experiences. I know people who drink much more often than myself who could probably do this with double that amount of alcohol or more. I would never try to blast off shitfaced though personally. I know how I feel when im shitfaced (which is rare) and I dont see it mixing well. I've just come to respect the spirit molecule on a totally different level and it would almost feel like disrespect to try to blast off with my head that clouded. Since we are on this topic, I feel compelled to tell a short story.

About three weeks ago I introduced a good friend to Dimitri. She is an alcoholic (albeit always pretty laid back) but was sober the first few times we smoalked. Well, one night shortly after her introduction we were all "partying" (drinking more than I normally do). She had the liquid courage thing going on and asked me to please pack a fat bowl of DMT. I advised against this and tried to reason with her. She wasn't hearing any of it and actually started getting a little upset that I was trying to "control her" in the state she was in. Finally I told her she was grown and could do whatever she wanted. I figured if nothing else, she would learn a lesson pretty quick. I watched her weigh out a 60mg dose and pack it up, shaking my head the whole time. She took a few really fat rips back to back. Following this I watched her start to freak out and could tell by her facial expressions and slight moaning that she was having a rough time and was in the middle of something extremely intense. I was mad at myself for allowing this at first but was also trying to calm her down by telling her to just roll with it and let go. She finally either calmed down or hit a place where she was completely unaware of her surroundings.

She laid there not moving much at all and without saying a word for the next three hours....long after she was back with us. She was very apprehensive with spice while sober and wouldn't have even tried to smoalk even half of that amount. She explained some of what she experienced and it sounded pretty insane. For the past four years I've known her I haven't seen her go more than a day without drinking. She spent the next day going to doctors and getting medicine for DT's and from what she tells me and from what I've seen (we live together) she hasn't drank since. I ask her to explain what changed her views and she either just won't or she doesn't even know....but she's different now in many ways for sure (and we both agree that it's for the better). I don't know if this will last, but it's been pretty awesome to witness. I know it's not exactly what this topic is about but I thought I'd share.

I think the most important thing to consider is that everyone reacts different to any psychoactive chemical, be it alcohol, weed or DMT. I, myself, really enjoy alcohol (mainly red wine or absinthe) in moderate amounts a couple times a week, I find it is a great creative opener and loosens the analytical mind just enough to allow creativity to blossom. I have never combined it with DMT up to this point but might in the future, and to imply that it is wrong for anyone to do this is rather sanctimonious and elitist.

One of my general rules to life is don't interfere with other peoples ways of life if it doesn't interfere with yours in any significant way. Of course, if someone is breathlessly wasted and wants to smoke DMT in your presence and all signs point to disaster then yes, intervene (this happened to me awhile back, me and a friend were pretty drunk and he started bugging me to let him smoke some DMT and I didn't because I got a bad vibe... he thanked me the next day for it). Otherwise, let it be and enjoy your way and they'll enjoy their way. As Neitzsche once said:

“You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.”

Never mixed the two, but after reading Orion's post, I'm tempted to try a little red wine to deal with my preflight jitters.

It's not about what substances you are using so much as the state of mind you are in. At small doses under the right circumstances, alcohol can facilitate a place of calm openness. I can see how this could be useful. I smoke a lot of weed before taking off for that same reason... But I'm certain that it dulls my recall.

As far as psychedelics being fun vs sacred: why not both? Remember that many of us started out tripping for fun before inadvertently discovering their more profound effects.

For me....

Alcohol and smoked spice don't work for me at all. The alcohol grounds me and the spice simply doesn't work. I always end up feeling lousy and have to wait for the spice to pass.

MJ and spice is a mixed bag. Sometimes I smoke some mj and it makes me wet with anticipation for the upcoming spice launch, but then sometimes it clouds the spice.

A light dose of shrooms and spice is VERY powerful. Shrooms potentiate dmt to the nth power.

Mix of smoked dmt and saliva extract sometimes works amazingly, but often the salvia blocks the spice.

Different strokes for different folks....

I typically don't use alcohol before dmt because I've never really gotten into drinking. But the couple times that i've had a beer before smoking some changa and it was quite nice. Definitely strips away much of the "anxious/worrysome" nature of the mind beforehand.

Although I tend to like the pre flight anxiety..I usually go farther than if I were to drink beforehand then smoke.

Fucking well said, Korey. My thoughts exactly upon reading that post, yet I had a hard time codifying them. You said it perfectly. Your next post was just as on the money. You sir, are a well spoken person. I'm glad you decided to speak out. Peace to all Nexians. Nothing like a good bit of discourse, eh?

I have a question: I see a couple mentions of alcohol being used in conjunction with ayahuasca in the amazon.


So......Caapi + booze, no big interaction to worry over?

From reading the above, some of you need to think more broadly about alcohol according to its context, and similarly for visionary substances.

Already in the West it has a number of contexts. Party drug. Social lubricant. Habitual intoxicant.

In traditional cultures it has many more contexts although often social. (The Tarahumara use is quite interesting - by some accounts, nearly all social relations happen during drunken binges.)

In syncretic traditions, as you'd expect it's a mix. But then, look at what other psychoactive substances they are bringing to the shamanic table. Are they all serotonergic psychedelics? Far from it. Apart from alcohol - tobacco and Datura are amongst the most important teachers in various South American traditions.

There is something to be learned from all psychoactive substances. Drunken debauchery isn't the only or by far the best circumstance to learn something, but that doesn't mean that alcohol is without value as a learning tool.

Alcohol = fearless. Bring on the spice!

In all seriousness though it's an awful combination. Maybe there could be a sweet spot where the alcohol isnt as noticable? For Me however? I'd say its the worst thing you can add to spice. Hyperspace becomes bad analog TV signal-space and my one truly bad spice journey involved over consumption of alcohol.

Yes i agree different substances do react differently to different people, i have a friend that when drinking and vaping spice he gets anxiety and its overwhelming, but i have another friend who when drinking and vaping he says it kills any anxiety, its kind of like a nip it in the butt kind of thing for him.. although for me no matter what i do i always get a little anxiety but we all react a different way so yeah..

"nip at the bud" Rob. It's a gardening metaphor. You cut something off at the bud and then it can't grow. Alcohol nips that fear right at the bud. Nipping something at the butt, well, if you pinch somethings ass, you just excite it more.