There's currently a large gathering of some Religious group at my leisure centre. Everyone is dressed up in suits, and is groomed to the hilt, and trying to look important. It got me thinking...

What did i think?, I thought these people were lost, and extremely un enlightened. Don't they know that they are already divine beings? Why do they feel like they need to follow some religious sect in order to be connected to their God? Actually, I felt like it was more than just that. They were well groomed, had an air of being "superior", and obviously were trying to be something different than regular folk. It wasn't about divinity as much as it was about being in a certain type of "cult of superiority".

How long would it take for these people to truly find their "divinity" through such a religious organisation? I guess it's "their" duty to "string them along" with dogma, because if they knew they already were divine beings then that religion would lose it's power and cease to exist, and a possibility of people control, and cult organisation lost.

Of course we all know that entheogens are a fast track to self realiization with the right intent, set, setting, dose. Indeed maybe these religious types would be perhaps better to get connected directly to "god" through their own direct channels with the help of sensible entheogen use rather than the quirky, indirect ramblings of a dogma based religion that has it all worked out for their benefits of control rather than simple truth??

Surely all one then needs to do is state " I am a divine energy expressing myself as a human being", save all the pomp and tedium of stuffy religions?

I guess many of us feel this way. I mean once one has had an enlightening experience it does make one wonder why people bother with religion. If you have no fear of death because you know that we are more than our bodies why would you need the comforting of a religion that does not cater for the individual, rather the masses?

christian wrote:


- How long is eternity anyways?



Entheogen use? I highly doubt their delicate egos would withstand anything stronger than alcohol, coffee or doughnuts.



I personally believe that organized religion today is primarily just something that is used to control and manipulate the masses. I believe the purpose of the disharmonious practice of modern religion is to sow chaos and discord into the world.(Thanks to lyserg for pointing this theory out.) I believe a lot of the "upper class" religious people find religion to be nothing more than a "good old boy's network" where they can establish important political and business connections.

As far as I am aware the number one thing being preached in American churches today is various forms of evangelical Christianity combined with dispensationalism. Which I personally believe is a bunch of spiritual snake oil nonsense:
(en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dispensationalism


I believe that the "church" has over the centuries worked to actively conceal the connections between entheogens and the Bible. I personally find great value in ancient scripture but I find no value in having someone who has no idea WHAT a mystical experience IS try and tell me what ancient scripture is saying.

Thank you, Eliyahu!

Your response resonated in every aspect possible. The "old boys network", is such a perfect illustration. You know as i left the leisure centre i had to get past these people who had employed mean looking security guards, and even looked mean and sullen themselves.

It's pretty obvious it's a load of BS, but there's always gullible people or rich influential people looking for some kind of base, they can bounce off i guess....

I believe it was P.T Barnum who said "there is a sucker born every minute"

Well lots of people take that seriously and they based their own religion on the idea.

I believe what they are in essence trying to do with T.V Evangalism, besides rake in $$$ is to create an army of ultimately gullible people who can be manipulated into doing just about anything in the name of their "Jesus".

Very true, Eliyahu.

These organisations are powerful and know just how to use it and all that stuff. It's pretty spooky when you realise just how they can squeeze into getting their way. Bad Caapi snakes they are.... Oily ones!!

I short, I feel that spirituality is a most natural state of being and is an open field of unity betwixt body, mind and heart. Religion is the organizational crust of the true reality, which so appeals to the masses, who lack any direct awareness of Spirit. Entheogens are Sacred Medicines, though often mistaken for entertainment, can be a bridge for many souls (whose true purpose seems to be to guide us home, back into THAT which we once were, in full effulgent splendor, before our material emergence).

As assuredly, can meditation, concentration or contemplation... and to a lesser degree, deductive reasoning. They each can facilitate specific aspects of such awakened states of mind. So while religions are born of truly inspired revelations, their organizational structure, regulations and dogmatism are often irksome to the free-thinking spirit dancers of this material world.

And yeah, I guess I've got somewhat of a problem with most organized religious thought. It's just too damned conceptual and so limited by subjective interpretation of scripture. I've a similar but opposite problem with modern science and rational academia, with it's refusal to accept the reality of the Unified Field of The Godhead (a vortex of indivisibility).

When I want to phase into awakening mode, bring my consciousness-awareness-being to a plane beyond the known, thus to literally see God... I look at the appearance of the world surrounding me, let it's myriad forms dissolve back into the Clear Light of the Void, then surrender my fixed, transient mind-set to the emptiness within. We are each called awaken to this lovely moment, this living present. Right here & now, as expressed through our unique perception. Thus it seems so immanent, that we are one current within many dreamscapes, unified by this cosmic balance we all share.

I feel like people take this subject very lightly, and can almost make fun of these kind of people easily. Because we have experience a mystical experience. Of course it makes sense now! Why follow a religion when you can see god in every blade of grass?

I am slower to judge these people, not that I agree with them. Just slower to judge. If religion did not have a place in the world. Then why would it be around for so long? This is not to say that what religion and how it uses dogma is something good now. But that the idea of religion, a disciplined life, is a natural and almost needed ambition.

Religion just presents the idea of a dedication to something other than the self. It is an anti-ego weapon so to speak. Just like dmt, lsd, or shrooms can be. It is meant to strike down the ego with a force, leaving the person in light of God. Or in a sense, themselves. This would all be good, if each "church goer" would have great and spiritual insight into why they worship their god. But man does not work like this. As Nietzsche says, there is the slaves, and the enslavers. Not every man is going to be a great thinker, or great spiritualist. So they must rely on a higher knowledge to guide them. Is this not the function of the church? They lead the masses, as Jesus did, like sheep. There are two kinds of spiritual realization. The first kind is through an intellectual understanding of ones faith. Through experience with their own mind, they come to understand the truth of God. Take Thomas Merton for example. The other kind of realization is the passionate one. Where a person does not know, but unconditionally loves God. And is willing to devote their life to them. Not to create stereotypes, but take the old lady in the front pew at mass on Sundays for example. Or the man that speaks in tongues. The churches duty is to guide the passionate ones in the path of God. They do not know, but they feel "the burning in the bosom". So what I am saying is that there is always going to be these kind of people, the people that follow along and need guidance. And we can't blame them! Were we not children once? Who did not know right from left?

So do entheogens therefor bring everyone above this step? I do not think so. I have heard a few people on the Nexus speak of how the experience is hollow and how entheogens do not bring you anywhere. Of course I think this to be rubbish. But each individual must contribute if we are to put everyone under scrutiny. So why is this? I feel like the same philosophy is to be adopted. The only difference is that the psychedelic experience is so Powerful, that for most people. You cannot deny the connection with the higher power. It is hard to not become spiritual after experiencing dmt. The experience itself so powerful, it moves you. But I would like to compare this to speaking in tongues. Or meditation. The spiritual experience can be achieved many ways, and all these ways are through dedication. Discipline. And ultimately I feel that every religion is trying to achieve this. God is a being outside of time, and in his presence time does not exist. This sounds like a a great psychedelic experience to me, but it also sounds like a great meditation session also. The only difference with entheogens is that they almost force you to move to that point of "no time" with god. So when the majority begins to say that entheogens give you a great spiritual experience regardless of anything. Then we begin to believe this. But we do not account that small percent who says no. Those are the ones that need guidance. That must have some sort of discipline to experience the healing properties of entheogens. This then could become, in itself, a "religion". People find it so easy to place religion in the same context as a government. Due to its common preaching of things such as charity. We lose sight of the real purpose.

I am in no way defending these spiritually dead people. But I just wish to say, that we must not be so rash in our judgement regarding religion. We find it easy to blow off as something stupid, because we understand intellectually the misguidance of most churches. But again I bring up Thomas Merton. He experienced true Catholicism, and not the governing church that corrupts peoples minds! We can become to caught up in our open-mindedness, that we forget how close-minded we have become.

Sorry for the long post, hope it stimulates some thought!

Walter

elements which had a strong influence on the evolution of our minds. I could not imagine what our world would be without imagination.

^ yes well imagination is what drives the root of religion right? I mean look at Nordic myths, those are some of the most creative tales I have heard.

Thanks guys for your fantastic responses. I think you've all got excellent points. I just found out that this religious group were Jehovas Whitnesses. They attend meetings at my leisure centre yearly and come from all over the world. They are impeccably dressed in suits and as i passed them i got some powerful unwelcoming stares from them, and i did not find them in any way warming.

Funny, in my last flat i remember they would knock on my door and try to get in so they could convert me. Luckily my new flat has a security door so i guess it keeps them out.

I'm not against people choosing religion of their own free will, but when it's "pushed" and "wierd" like this, i have to ask why?

Sorry to break it.

entheogens, spirituality, and religion are simply mere tools used by whoever runs this show to study us spirits use and possession of magick or also known as god light.

We are imprisoned in these meat sack simulations for the one purpose of extracting and dissecting god or magick, which will always remain unexplainable guaranteeing this existence.

I'm not sure why these aliens are so bent on this. We must of been captured at some point.

How long will the study last? Will they ever acquire their goals?

Never...

Too much downtalking

To say that would imply that we were at one point free

Agreed! There are many ways to reach god



Where are you getting this information you speak so firmly about from?

Not saying you are wrong, but you seem really convince about this.

I apologize Walter, nothing I say is certain. I should of stated that this was just an off the wall idea I had while heavily induced on psychedelics, nothing more.