Hi people,

I was wondering recently if anyone has read of a traditional shaman/healer who uses psychoactive plants trying freebase DMT (perhaps from a traveller/tourist). I wonder what they would make of it and how they find it compares to their own methods. Can anyone point me in the right direction?

Thanks

That's a pretty good question. With their cultural history, their interpretation of the experience would be an interesting read for sure...

its called virola calophylla.

Not sure exactly where, but this feller talks about it in this video: http://www.youtube.com/w...5&feature=plpp_video
He says the shamans he talked to about it say there are basically nine dimensions, and when you smoke dmt it generally plops you directly into the seventh, where entities and things like that are commonly experienced. They don't demean it, but it sounds like they believe you can ascend into all of the dimensions with ayahuasca, which is overall a more valuable experience. From my limited experience, I definitely agree that ayahuasca has much more to offer. A lot of this guy's story is pretty fascinating and worth listening to if you have the time.

Thanks for the replies. That's interesting to hear the shaman found it valuable; something gave me the impression that someone who used plants may disregard an extracted chemical as shallow or western science interfering with nature. But obviously to the contrary in these cases!

I remember listening to a talk with Mckenna, and he recalled a time when he gave a 94 year old Buddhist monk DMT from a pipe... the monk returned with a warm smile.

"Yes, that is the bardo. But you can not go any farther, or you will not return."

Even though it goes through an extraction process doesn't make it synthetic.

Wut?

yeah i'd imagine they'd be fairly forgiving of us extracting dmt in this day and age, considering western society lacks shamanism and general spiritual attitude so strongly. I think they'd just be pleased that we are getting in touch with these teachers in the first place- as the world is in need of spiritual healing. I don't think they'd like the idea of using toxic chemicals and tipping them down the sink too much though. but for every person who benefits from using this sacrament, i reckon their carbon footprint will probably be significantly lower due to their lifestyle and their attitude afterwards....especially towards consumerism. i'd like to think since using spice and feeling such a deep connection to the land, i have become a lot less toxic to the planet in my habits. But i am still learning.... was stuck in the material grind for most of my life growing up, and once i started using LSD when i was 17 and still going to school, my attitude towards the nature of reality changed dramatically. Now, just about to turn 21, my attitude towards the planet, myself, people around me, and the cosmos is completely different to a few years ago. I went from thinking the notion of spirits and "god" being completely illogical and just a way to make people feel comfortable about their impending death, to smoking these little crystals and communicating with the very things i used to think didn't exist!

I wonder if many shamans would be surprised at how fast and strong it comes on verses Aya. Then again, don't some northern amazonian shamans snort DMT snuff "Yopo", which I would imagine would be very close to a little 5-10 min hyperspace journey? (unless yopo lasts longer?)

DMT snuff would be awful.. can you imagine how much ground up plant matter you'd have to shoot up your nose to get an effect?!

I'm confused at your confusion...

Pretty sure extraction != synthesis, and therefore means extracted DMT is not synthetic DMT.

Merriam Webster's definition of Synthesis:



No chemical reaction we perform makes DMT, we simply extract and purify it...

Yopo is not anything like freebase DMT. It is mostly Bufo and comes on slower than I would have expected. Snorting Yopo feels like getting smacked in the nose.. The harder you snort it and the more you make it hurt the better the effects though.. I imagine a Shaman in my head getting quite giddy over some extracted Spice.

A shaman I interacted with smoked some acacia mixed with tobacco. He drew me a picture of a a face with third eye and excitedly raved about the tercer ojo and how the acacia opened it.

Knowing him, I'm sure he would at least HIGHLY APPRECIATE purified dmt.

He said it was "all good. all love all time." loved cocacola. tobacco.

You, as well as Walter D. Roy, are indeed confused. No one in this thread (until Walter brought it up) said anything about sythesis. The OP said freebase. Which can be extracted or synthesized.

I interpreted Walter's post as him adding a point to the discussion that it is no less "natural" due to it being extracted. As a point against any "shamans don't like unnatural things" type belief.

Not sure how a1pha interpreted it to make him reply with "wut".

Though I suppose I see the non-sequitur in Walter's response now, that contributed to a1pha's response.

Hm... could have sworn there was something else in this thread that gave me the impression I got.

super off topic......

i feel if they found out the great uses for it that they wld be able to find they wld enjoy it. but just like some of us i feel there more of a plant ingesting ppl and feel more comfortable doing that.

Thank you for the clarification between extracted chemicals and synthetic ones. My confusion came more from the wording of the statement, "Even though it goes through an extraction process doesn't make it synthetic." My guess is that he meant to say, "It goes through an extraction process and is therefore not synthetic." But this is just word games and way off-topic. Now that we have clarification from Aetherius Rimor on the MW definition of synthesis...

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Why do we suppose freebase DMT differs much from the DMT used in oral brews to a 'shaman'? Wouldn't it be the same difference I notice between freebase DMT and aya or do we suppose it has differing effects for a 'shaman' other than personal experiences?