so clear this up for me....
If in a week someone discovers 2cb in a plant will you feel better about it or not?

good and bad technology, more elementary-school reasoning.

you can put a machinegun on a table, and it's not going to act out badly. same with scawy chemicalz, oh n0es.


but wait..don't we have evil plants that put out ricin? we should shun them!

I do prefer psychedelics that are found in the biological environment. I have definatly had spiritual moments with MDMA and LSD, but I only used them a few times and stopped a few years ago..because personally for me they never touched my soul the way psilocin, mescaline, DMT or ayahuasca has. Even LSA I found to take me deeper than LSD. I dont know for sure why it is this way for me.

I also dont feel safe with RC's and weird vendors from china etc..though I would experiment with 5meoDMT from a vendor if I lived somewhere where it was still legal..and I would totally experiment with synthetic DMT if some chemist who I trusted gave it to me..some with psilocybin and mescaline, ibogaine etc..

This doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. I'm sure many people enjoy synthetic drugs in nature. I have had some very spiritual and beautiful nature trips with LSD.
Also drugs are made for different purposes not for "a different kinda brain" IMO



Why separate these things? Why not mix it up a bit?

I really like electronic music mixed with "chanting, drums, etc" for example, and why not a ceremony in nature with electronic music while tripping on LSD and smoking DMT?

Haha, not so fast!... Nature never intended humans into all this "big talk", modern day society did that!



Jamie, i 100% agree with this edited statement, and actually have understood that LSA is an extremely organic experience where one can literally become frightened that they will accidentally tread on a weed in their footpath on the way to their daily duties!!



To be honest, i used to be pretty much much in agreement with your way of thinking. BUT, when i was in the Gambia, in Africa, hearing live drumming acts with dansing, that all changed. To me now, in nature, Electronic music has no place. Still, each to their own.

come on now...

how can science be a product of the ego, when everything in scientific literature is written objectively?

Not sure I understand the response Chris

To me now, in nature, Electronic music has no place. Still, each to their own.

such blasphemy, nature is teh queen of electronic music. The birth mother.

Snozzleberry and Purges, i've re-edited my post, so that there's no country issues, or misunderstandings regarding what i was trying to say with "big talk"



Haha, i certainly think that nature is where electronic music gets all it's inflence from.!!

It was the "big talk" part I didn't get...

By "big talk", i meant the way that things are "bigged up" in the modern society. Take stardom, take boasting, Take my car's got more hp than so and so's, etc. All aaspects of the ego that man loves to exhibit when he has a platform to bounce off when he's seperated himself from nature.

Natural stuff tends to feel right.


I can purchase a bunch of 2 x 4's and plywood....


Once living material that has had all sense of individuality stripped from it in, uniform, goes up fast, has very little soul.

But I feel better surrounded by rustic furniture, natural environs, entheogens derrived from plants, accoustic real music. natural simple food.


I've had my fill of Big Talk in this lifetime. I'm not making any value judgements, just a matter of personal preference. Extensive studies have shown (I mean anecdotal experiences in my subjective life) that the natural stuff is just better all around.

one can argue that everything in the universe is natural. know why?




















































































































































because matter is neither created nor destroyed.

everything is natural..not everything is congruent with the rest of the ecosystem on this planet though.

I'd rather cut off all my hair, including eyebrows, than get rid of my chemicals.
there's just no point. It's like asking a chef to get rid of all his/her condiments and spices.

Looks like you really stirred up a hornets nest with this one I think its a great idea to trash all your synthetics. If you believe it will bring you closer to understanding yourself then rock and roll. And another thing about LSD, ecstasy, etc... If you don't know exactly where it came from you have no idea how competent or cautious your chemists are. Congrats on the spiritual maturation.

Oh my, where is my puke bucket. This topic made me laugh.

First off, there are no BAD chemicals. Things are not evil in themselves, it is man that makes them evil.

Also, most psychoactive chemicals are no worse for you than biologically created psychoactive chems, especially taken in moderation.

Finally, chems are extremely valuable tools that help you obtain products that would otherwise not be feasibly obtainable. Most of your everyday items were created with BAD chemicals. I pity those who think chems are BAD but I dont blame them. I blame the media, common stereotypes, and the tendency for people to shun foreign things they dont understand.

Like Benzyme, I would be very reluctant to throw away some fully synthetic chemicals that I have.Chemistry can undoubtedly make some natural products quite alot better, and can also lead to the development of fully synthetic compounds which have only a passing resemblance to the natural starting point but exercise the relevant receptor-system in a way that nature ,as far as we presently know, hasnt matched.

i think a lot of u misinterpret what im trying to say, not saying these chemicals are bad in the way they are evil or bad in themselves, but bad for u for ur mental and physical health. In other words doing u more harm in the end than good. You might enjoy the experience and have u know one hell of a night, doesnt mean that its good for u/healthy. Just as u might enjoy watching tv, doesnt mean its doing u good. How about another argument, do these chemicals feed the ego? with many of these chemicals i think mayb during the experience ur ego might be temporarily diminished but after the experience is over i think something else is happening. like said before anything that makes u feel shitty for days following is already saying something, unlike the plants that make u feel amazing afterwords. the more i think about it the more it makes sense. Christian and cosmic butterfly had very good points, "that they are made for a different kinda brain, a more rigid one, rather than relaxed one" and "U dont hear of plant influenced science. science is the product of the ego.". terrence mckenna said that these chemicals (tricksters) are doing u good in ways that u may never suspect. I think theres very good reason y he in his entire career NEVER promoted not one of these chemicals-lsd,mdma,research chemicals..and for very good reason. He on the other hand talked non stop about plants that i believe are here to heal us and the human condition. We need to learn to respect and listen to the great thinkers of our time, hey myb u might learn something, ignorance wont get u far in this life, unless ur goal is to be an egomaniac

http://www.youtube.com/w...;list=PLDBC68AF4C0475A4A