With tastier I was saying that good falafel > bad processed meat, any day. I like meat, but the mass-produced, heavily processed meat-like animal derivatives that find their way into food these days are what I really don't like.

I do agree that it'd be better to make processed meat-like animal derivatives out of a vat than out of a factory farm...
HOWEVER, I think the best possible option would be to rid ourselves of the desire for processed meat-like animal derivatives altogether...

Thank you so much for all your thoughts... Indeed this is a tricky issue to say the least. I truly think that anything created within a process which is separated or removed from the natural flow of life never is a good thing, though this has the potential to alleviate countless animals from suffering i still think its greatly important if you do eat meat to take responsibility for that choice. It’s of the utmost importance to educate yourself where your meat is coming from as being conscious about what you are putting into your body is vital.

Even though I’ve been vegetarian for 13 years i don’t think that this option is a viable one even if it’s going to prevent animals from suffering, nothing positive can come from removing accountability and creating food artificially as i feel very deeply that as it is our food is already too far removed from the natural order of things.


Much Peace and Happiness

I know this is a fairly common argument, Aegle, but even if I agree with the spirit, there is a contradiction we have to deal with here. When we talk about the "natural flow of life" or the "the natural order of things", we cannot arbitrarily remove humans from the picture. We are part of nature. Our deeds are part of nature. And at the same time, we will all agree that the action of mankind is affecting that "natural, pristine" order of nature. But where should we trace the line between the natural, "acceptable" (here comes the judgement) quality of our actions and the unnatural and unacceptable?

Is planting and harvesting acceptable? We would say so. Then, is it acceptable to use the results of our harvesting? When does that use become abuse? It's not easy. But wherever we decide to trace that line, we agree that there IS a limit between use and abuse. And I would say that limit has to do with how our actions interfere with the evolution and wellbeing of the rest of the ecosphere. As always, as everything, it is a difficult balancing act.

I disagree with the fact that creating something "artificially" necessarily goes against the natural order of things. Whether an action is acceptable or not depends on its outcome, not in the fact it's produced by human action and human technology. In that technology, in that artificiality, nature is also implicit. So the way to judge should be another one.

I recently asked my cat if he would eat this man made meat, and this was his answer.

Aegle;

I have to agree with Vodsel's reply to you. That things are made by us doesn't automatically make it bad. Lots of things that are created without our influence in nature can be horrible, dangerous things. Natural disasters causes death and incredible suffering, lots of toxic chemicals exists all over the place that can damage or even kill us and other species, radiation from the sun and other natural sources can be harmful and cause cancer. The list goes on and on. In fact, we pretty much live in a universe that seems bent on destroying us.

With that said, we humans certainly have a negative impact on our environment with much of what we do, an impact that often ultimately bites us back. But at the same time we are totally dependent upon solutions to solve these problems, solutions that come from ourselves, such as better technology and more knowledge. While staying a bit natural and conscious of our environment is very good and beneficial, it is also important not to resent technological solutions and progress that can help better our condition here on earth, as well as the condition of our environment and other species that live with us. Artificial meat is one of these solutions, and the attitude of yours that nothing positive can come out of this is essentially not a very rational or informed view I think, for reasons I have specified already in earlier posts.

And what, exactly, is it with this process that is so separated or removed from the natural flow of life? In order for us to produce artifical meat in a good and controlled manner, we must know a hell of a lot about biology and the different processes that govern the production of tissue. We are essentially doing the same things nature does, or copying it, as we do with a lot of our technology. Our deepening knowledge of the underlying processes and mechanisms of nature enables us to copy and take control of them, and the more we know often the better and less dangerous for ourselves and the environment our technology becomes. This is why we need education about science and technology, this is why we must be clear headed and rational when it comes to these things, so that we can decide what to support and engage in rational discourse about important things in politics and technology that affects us, the environment and other species.

I hope you can reconsider your position, Aegle.

Peace

Human Mammal Human Hunter

The difference from where we have come from and where we are today is deeply sad and disturbing. It is this removal or disconnect from our very own connection with life and nature that concerns me. Only ignorance can grow and flourish if we continue to try and remove ourselves from being connected, while absolving accountability...





Much Peace and Respect