Hm. Was SWIY able to actually feel the effects of THH with a 15mg sublingual dosage, or did they only notice a difference in the subsequent DMT experience?

Merry XMas, all! I hope this bizarre season was trouble-free for all of you.

69ron, this is for you in particular. I was thinking about your comments on the empty stomach's reaction to alkaloids. If there's any merit to that, while this may seem frivolous, I think it's also well worth trying out.

http://forums.mycotopia....rewires-your-senses.html

It'll be a fun experiment in any event, but I'm definitely going to have SWIM try this with our bitter friends and report on what benefits, if any, are to be had.

SWIM has used these...they work to a certain extent but anything TOO bitter and it just doesnt cut it...SWIM tried to use them with T. bridgesii cacti..and the only thing the berry did was make the apple cider he was drinking with it taste much sweeter..but the cacti was still the same:/

That’s something I’ve not heard of before. What a fascinating fruit. I’ll have get myself some and try it out!

Yeah, while I've yet to play with them myself, I'd wondered if that would be the case with substances that contain no sugar content or other more appealing flavors. The action of the protein is to simply block your tongue from perceiving flavors typically classified as unpleasant, allowing all other flavor to seemingly increase in intensity. However, if the substance in question contains nothing appealing in terms of flavor to begin with... well, I'm still gonna' have SWIM give a shot. Per 69ron's hypothesis, perhaps it could enhance the nausea-reducing effect of light, tasty snack foods consumed prior to, during, or after alkaloid ingestion. But my god, do they have to call it the Miracle Berry?

If anyone's interested, SWIM should have some more reports soon with regard to DMSO and other combinations... after SWIM decompresses a little bit from the Christmas madness. Cheers, all.

I was fortunate since I have no family to worry about for Christmas. It was a lazy day, starting out at 6am with my first ayahuasca experience. Very touching, moving to say the least. I really enjoy learning from this board.

Of course the ayahuasca part only happend in a dream.

!

Man, that's one way to do Xmas. I'll look to that as an inspiring approach for any holiday!

Do we know this stuff is pure and clean and good and all? I still worry about putting chemicals like this in my body...

How do you know the mimosa you've extracted wasn't grown in a toxic waste field and full of all sorts of toxins? Well since it's NOT sold for consumption it could legally be grown in a toxic waste field and kill you, and because you broke the law to ingest it, it would be your fault, not the mimosa seller’s.

I’m just saying that because the same thing applies to plants, not just things like theobromine and THH.

As for the THH SWIM bought it says right on the container: "Processing method used: FOOD GRADE". I also contacted them and asked what the impurities were and they said they were all food grade non-toxic chemicals and some of the original plant matter. They also said the only solvent they use is pure drinking water. So it’s basically food grade. Regardless of their THH being food grade, it is "NOT SOLD FOR CONSUMPTION" the same as the harmaline tincture, and the same as mimosa, San Pedro, etc. It’s the FDA that enforces this, not the sellers. The sellers would love to say that their mimosa is sold for ingestion, but they cannot without getting into legal trouble.

SWIM reports having taken 300mg THH orally, dissolved into ~30ml of water. SWIM waited 20 minutes, then swallowed 20mg unrefined DMT from a mimosa extraction, dissolved in a solution of lemon juice and water.

After about 30-40 minutes, SWIM definitely began to feel the effects of the THH (similar in nature to those reported by others) - very slight dizziness, relaxation of the extremities, slight imbalance, etc. Relatively subtle but noticeable, not strong enough to be unpleasant.

No other effects were felt by SWIM. SWIM doesn't understand why his experiences with THH and now THH+DMT seem to be so much weaker than those reported by others, and reports feeling kinda' frustrated. The DMT SWIM consumed, while not purified, is most definitely active when smoked, so SWIM doesn't believe that to be an issue. Any advice anyone has for SWIM in this regard would be welcome, before SWIM capitulates to frustration and starts gulping down unwise quantities of both substances.

No wisdom for SWIM? Hm. Don't be shy, folks.

make sure you take the stuff on a completely empty stomach..and it helps SWIM to eat something light after taking the dmt..some bread, cereal, crackers, even a beer will work..this will help your stomach digest faster and may also reduce any nausea you may feel from the alkies..

also its good to test out how much it takes to effect your own body..because everyone is different and some people only need small amounts while others need more..also it seems to help to take a mix of THH + harmine or harmaline

SWIM likes to take 100mg THH with 40mg or so of harmaline...the harmaline helps with some of the energy that they THH gives you..and also really helps the MAOI action..its possible that the THH just doesnt cut it for you completely...and instead of using lots of THH..you can use a combination and use a lot less of both..

Can SWIY get effects from the same amount of DMT orally when used with harmaline instead of THH?

Sorry for the delay in my reply; I was away for the weekend. Thanks for responding!


I've read that harmaline can have a somewhat stupifying or disorienting effect - would you say that's true, Jorkest, and would you recommend harmine + THH as a better combination? If so, how much harmine is considered a reasonable dose (orally) when combined with THH? And yeah, SWIM tried ingesting on an empty stomach, and chased the solutions with a small volume of tasty drink.


SWIM doesn't atually know. SWIM has never tried pure harmaline or harmine... you might recall my post a while back about SWIM's misadventures with a weak rue tea; since then, SWIM has wanted to proceed cautiously when playing with MAOIs. SWIM is very interested in dosing DMT orally, and is very willing to try a combination of THH + harmine/harmaline, or even all three.

SWIM does not seem to be affected very strongly by THH alone, so any recommendations in this regard would be most appreciated, i.e. preferred combinations, dosages, etc. Thanks again, guys; be well.

SWIM recently tried 50mg Harmine hcl and 50 mg THH sublingually dissolved in lemon juice and water. About 40 min later he took 20mg Chali jungle spice (STB/FASA) in a similar fashion. About 1 hour after taking the spice he was definately above baseline with a lot of colors but not quite strong enough. He then smoked 20mg MHRB jungle spice (STB) which put him into the sweet spot for about 15 - 20 minutes afterwhich he was back to just above baseline and fairly quickly faded back to baseline. He definitely feels the Harmine much more than THH and it is a pleasant feeling. No nausea has been encountered with either thh or Harmine. He next plans on doing 120mg Harmine hcl + 80mg THH + 40mg spice in a similar fashion. Elsewhere on this board he read that this dose is close to the content in a true Ayah brew but it will have to wait a week. He tried 100mg THH alone and also 100mg Harmine alone to see how they effected him. The Harmine was definately more intoxicating in a pleasant way so this is what he believes people are talking about wiht the stupifying effect.

Hm. My thread subscription must not be working properly... so don't think I'm just being inattentive, memo! Thanks very much for sharing; that should give SWIM a good base from which to begin playing with harmine/THH combinations. Now SWIM just has to wait for his harmine to arrive...

I know this line of inquiry is leading further and further away from the original thread topic, which was focused specifically on THH alone. Is there a more appropriate thread for me to be posting the questions of SWIM and the results from his further adventures?

Actually it's the MAO-B specific ones that aren't dangerous re. 'the cheese effect.' MAO-A is what's in the stomach and liver. l-deprenyl, for example, is fairly specific for MAO-B, and doesn't require any special diet.

The fact they are reversible just means the risk is short-lived. And remember, it's "risk" not "certainty" we are talking about. Most likely you could eat some aged cheese in the middle of an aya journey and be fine. But if you do you are playing russian roulette. Even with the old irreversible MAOI's it's not like people were getting a hypertensive crisis every time they had a cheeseburger. They were prescribing those things for years with relatively few incidents before they figured out what was going on and instituted the dietary restrictions.

But please don't be the first person to kill yourself on aya. BAAAADDDD press! Not to mention the rest of us would miss out on your wonderfully informative posts.

No.

Xlplytsym, you are spreading misinformation because even those RIMAs effect MAO-A and tyramine is attacked by MAO-A, tyramine displaces RIMAs allowing MAO-A to attack the tyramine! Therefore RIMAs do not affect tyramine metabolism!

So, like I said, no diet is needed and they are VERY SAFE when used in the proper doses. And YES you can eat aged cheese and all that stuff when taking RIMAs. RIMAs do not block MAO-A metabolism of tyramine even though they are MAO-A inhibitors. When tyramine is ingested, it removes the RIMA from the MAO-A enzymes and attaches to it, thereby releasing the RIMA. This is a scientific fact. If they blocked tyramine metabolism, they would be normal MAO-A inhibitors and would not be classified as RIMAs.

Please look up what a RIMA is before spreading misinformation like that.

http://www3.interscience...ct?CRETRY=1&SRETRY=0

I know what a RIMA is. I also know it is MAO-A inhibitors that are responsible for the "cheese effect." Moclobemide has been studied in this regard and appears to be safe, but as far as I know harmala alks have not been so tested. Do you know of any such tests?

Plus it's a case of risk/reward. The likelihood may be small, but the potential harm is NOT. And for what? Is it that important to eat aged cheese in the midst of an aya journey?

Why do people post this old inaccurate information over and over and over? WHY?

It's a fact and I'm not about to search for the reports yet again. I've had to correct people posting that kind of misinformation like 100 times already! Will it ever end! I'm so tired of it. Do the research yourself.

Harmala alkaloids are RIMAs and they do not interfere with tyramine metabolism.