so i have been offered K many times and always turned it down. I just wanted to know what the nexus had to say, thinking about indulging but not k-holing sometime...

For me it was just for laughs, done it quite some times but maybe never again.
Dont really like that numbing sensation where your face feels like a plank of wood.
...best tasting (insufflated) chemical I've ever tried tough, tastes like cherries
with minimal burn.
No need to go down the "K-hole" if you dont want to, you can just bump smaller doses and
still have fun. I used to start with 50mg and then take 25mg bumps until
I had enough. (That could still send me to far sometimes, I'm very sensitive)
It's a relatively safe and short acting drug though
so if you feel that you dont like it, wait 40mins and you're almost back to
baseline.
Some people do get very addicted so keep that in mind!!!

k can be very psychedelic! it's not my cup of tea, per se, but it is very cool indeed! one can learn a lot from k. honestly, snorting k is a waste. it's best use is IM (intramuscular) but for a noob, just snort it, see how you like it. most people do enjoy it. most people even enjoy the k-hole. i like k but it's not for me. also, be careful...it can be very addictive. playing around a time or 10 won't hurt you but if oyu find youself liking the k hole, keep an eye on your use. have a couple buddies who've gone to far with it and are now hooked.

To me, K is a lovely whore. She'll show you a zillion things and doesn't ask for respect in return like the classics do. You can have a bit in any context and enjoy the feeling, or you can have a lot and wander in the k-hole. But ultimately, I wouldn't call k enlightening. It can be immensely interesting, but it's too fun and easy to provide real growth. Not challenging enough. I'm one of those people who have to be careful with it because it is indeed top notch recreation.

Ah, it also combines very well with LSD, MDMA and Nitrous. All 4 together are extremely uhm, "magical".

edit: one way it can be used in a "growth" context might be to use it with LSD. LSD can easily turn bad for me, but k gives me some detachement on my own thoughts and processes. It makes everything a bit less serious, and for that reason it's a great tool, though still not inherently enlightening, as with all dissociatives imho

I think ketamine should be sampled by those inclined towards inner exploration as it allows you to analyse aspects of your psyche in a dispassionate way which I think is useful.Ive mostly ever used it on its own via the IM route (sometimes with cannabis) and I think this is the best way to really experience what is has to offer.The beauty of ketamine taken this way is its directness in putting you out there and you are back to baseline 40-45 minutes later.I have often wondered what it would be like with say LSD but I doubt I have the stamina for that kind of mental exertion these days.

Ive heard excellent reports on using it with MDMA but its something Ive not tried;DXM with MDMA (which is not to be recommended for all as there is a risk of serious toxicity) was amongst the best 'highs' I have ever had.

Ket can be highly addictive - Got Lost in the Fairy Tale K-Land for years, did many hundreds i.m and i.v. injections, finally managed to crawl out of the K-Hole. Please...Watch out !!

Oh yes

THIS.


JBArk

I think it can be fun, but you do need to keep an eye on yourself. K literally sent me insane, something which nothing else has ever done (due to its addictive nature - was in a k-hole for about 3 months, got lost. Its gonna make you lose touch with this type of use.)

It can also be quite dark, and unsympathetic. If you do it, dont go doing loads in a club, you will get kicked out. If youre gonna do it, do it somewhere you can sit down, and I know its been said already but DONT GET ADDICTED. The addictive nature is one of its fatal flaws IMO...that and the darkness....

For me, I wont ever touch it again. Just not worth it - any inspiration or enlightenment you recieve is quickly forgotten, and you are left in a tranquilised, stupered state. The more you do it, the harder it is to gain any inspiration at all...just not really worth it IMO.

All i can say is that Ketamine from a hospital in a foreign country done IV is pretty INCREDIBLE-not that i would know. Apparently snorting is childsplay in comaprison......?!+_:

This is an old revived thread, it was made before the Discouraged Drugs policy thread. So I want to point out that Ketamine talk should be accompanied with the knowledge that there are added issues to ketamine use which arent present in the classic psychedelics we talk about here. There is considerable published long term damage from use, and the issues pointed by jdubs and herba luisa. Here's some more links:

http://onlinelibrary.wil...2-2042.2009.02361.x/full
http://onlinelibrary.wil...0-0443.2009.02761.x/full
http://www.sciencedirect...le/pii/S009042950700101X

Plus, for IV/IM use, there is the risks regarding the method of administration, so please make sure you all do it safely if so. Typical recomendations apply: make sure your product is really what you think, sterile use, have someone experienced inject for you at least the first time, start with low doses, dont share needles, etc.

Also, we hope that accompanied to any possible ketamine use (and talk about use here), there is also work towards integrating the experiences positively and constructively in one's life, like what we work for and talk about when discussing the other classic psychedelics. Fun is also an important part of life, but there needs to be a balance between fun and a more serious work and effort for personal growth.

If anybody wants to continue ketamine discussion, please try to question yourselves if what you want to say really adds something new and beneficial to the community or if its a new relevant question, with a careful respectful attitude, or if its just one more neutral/unconstructive post that brings more attention to a drug we dont really focus on.


Christian, saying ketamine snorting is child's play is misleading and potentially dangerous "advice", and that general way of posting pretty much goes against exactly what I said about having a more careful way of approaching discussing these substances.

Thanks for the consideration

Man a gram line insufflated is not childs play lol. (Not that I would in ANY WAY suggest this is a safe, or wise, path to take - it may send you insane eventually if not worse). Dont get me wrong, you can get to dizzying heights with ketamine but...wheres the love there???

--pOINT uNDERSTOOD, Endlessness, thanks.


-Of course i mean Ketamine administered in sterile hospital type conditions is supposed to be "heavenly" psychadaelia compared to the incredible psychadaelia of insufflation...well someone told me so, anyway..?

IMO K has been of great benefit to me. I have only ever done lines of K and I have not abused it as i know of its addictive nature but...

I have seen some wonderful things and have also felt incredibly good also. I always do it at home, in bed, and with music. You need sounds that will take you away...

I like the duration of K and I also like the zero comedown and on intense trips i have had an after-glow lasting up to 5 days..

As others have said beware the dark side with K but like most things you can do to much...I have had a friend do to much LSD (ended up in a psychiatric unit) and i have had many friends addicted to weed...so moderation is crucial.

Peace

Due to the general discouragement of talk about Ketamine, I never voice my opinions on it.

Since this thread appears to be progressing in a "respectful manner", I suppose this is my only opportunity.

I am well aware of the negative side effects, and I practice moderation in all I do (with exception of Mushrooms, but they have always been kind to me, and I still use them responsibly with regards to setting).


I treat K as having a very specific purpose in my personal use. I ONLY use it in a safe environment (on a couch or bed). I ONLY do at most twice in one sitting, and I will space out usage of it so that addiction/consistent use risks are minimized. Also only insufflated, I have a thing with needles, no thanks.

I'm not quite sure what other people experience from it, as very few people I discuss it with have similar experiences as myself.

Mushrooms make me feel apart of a greater whole, and I feel more aware of my place in everything.

Ketamine, performs the opposite, and in my opinion, can be very scary to those unaware of what they're getting into (supposing they go to the "K-Hole" rather than stopping at tipsy drunk feeling).

At first, I forget I'm human, forget everything. Then, I exist, and I'm the only thing that exists. I feel as though I am the entire universe. Then, a person comes into existence, and I realize that person is myself. It does not feel like myself yet, so I see this identity, this physical form, and can look at it from the eyes of a third party completely unbiased. I then realize "Oh... that's me? Hm... wow, why am I -that- person? What are they like?".

Memories start coming back to me, the most important people in my life first, and I question my actions, feelings and stances towards them. Contemplate why I'm doing the things I'm doing, whether or not it's a good idea, and how it affects these people who are apparently so important to this identity I have assumed.

Memories start flooding my mind, of all the things leading up to this point in my life, as I'm still not quite sure I exist yet, but I'm regaining the sensation of reality.

I then begin to dance to the music I gifted myself prior to this event. I am celebrating a rebirth, I feel as though nothing existed before this moment in time, but I know this entire history prior to it. It feels exactly as I imagine being born would be, a world exists prior to yourself, and you are now in it.

Over the next 30 minutes, I continue this celebration, afterwards to ponder all the thoughts that came to mind during the rediscovery of myself.

One other combination I will do, is same setting (safe in room, no hazardous objects, soft comfortable spot). Consume several grams of cubensis, and wait 3 hours for it to start kicking into the most powerful part of the trip, and then perform the same ritual as above. It adds... a different perspective that I can't quite describe. Separated from everything, yet connected to everything at once...

=================

Out of respect for the rules, I shall not discuss this again after this post, assuming this one is even appropriate...

My use of Ketamine has to remain a secret even amongst some people in real life, due to the negative stigmas associated with it... so rarely do I get to discuss the experience I go through.

If a DMT Nexus approved psychedelic can invoke the experience I receive from K, I am highly interested in learning about it.... but I know of nothing else currently.

I strongly suggest anyone with an interest in ketamine read the book 'Ketamine: Dreams and Realities' by Dr. Karl Jansen. He is a consultant psychiatrist in London and the world's leading expert on ketamine. It presents a completely unbiased view on the substance, with half the book dedicated to the positive aspect of the substance and the other half related to the negatives.


I do understand the need to keep ketamine a substance of limited discussion on the nexus due to it's high potential for dependence. Through long term heavy use, it can cause chronic depersonalisation as well as lead to irreversible bladder damage. I do feel though that it shouldn't be regarded as a substance that has no benefits as I believe it has tremendous potential in modern psychiatry. Dr Evgeny Krupitsky in Russia has had a remarkably high success rate in the treatment of alcoholics through the use of ketamine in what has been named 'death-rebirth psychotherapy'. Patients are administered a large dose of ketamine combined with a stimulant (to increase the patient's lucidity) which allows the therapist to get to the root of the addicts problems and allow 'rebirth' into a sober existence.


Ketamine has also recently been discovered as having remarkable antidepressant properties. It has been found to not only improve depressive symptoms within hours of administration but actually restores synaptic connections between brain cells that have been damaged by chronic stress. These properties caused 70% of severely depressed patients resistant to other antidepressants to improve dramatically.


From personal experience I believe that the occasional use of ketamine in the right environment can be greatly therapuetic much in the way other more traditional hallucinogens can be. The right environment I believe is in a dimly lit room with only close friends present and pleasant music playing. Journeying in this environment I have learnt things about myself that I could never have known without it's help and since I used ketamine I have undergone tremendous personal and spiritual growth.


That being said it's dependant properties cannot be argued with, and anyone with addictive tendencies should exercise great caution. Dr Karl Jansen advises to never repeat dose or inject IM or IV for this reason. Only very occasional use should ever be considered. also I believe the environment in which it is taken is crucial, as too many people take it in a nightclub or rave while under the influence of alcohol or other substances and this can leave one very vulnerable to ill psychological effects as well as dangers of falling and injuring oneself.


Like all psychoactive drugs I believe one can use them in the wrong way and cause damage to oneself either psychologically or physically. However I don't feel ketamine should be swept under the rug as it does have great therapeutic potential.

Ketamin is a very fun drug that ive choose to only do at festivals in other countries, why? because i really really like it, and during the high all i can think about is doing more K...

Ive never ventured into k-hole land only done small bumps with friends while at a party and laughing and having fun.

I did smoke some changa with it the last time i did it and it was a very deep and spirutual experience, they wen´t very well together i must say.


I don´t know anyone in my country who sells it and i don´t wan´t to either.

Well, with Trav's new policies in effect, I suppose that I can chime in here...

[Please do not regard any of this as an endorsement or suggetion that anyone should take up the usage of any of the substances mentioned below. Anyone even considering using anything mentioned should do an inordinant amount of research before even taking a half a baby step... but this should be said for any entheogenic substance anyway and anyhow.]

SWIM finds the dissociatives to be extremely useful and benefical in a number of ways. First off, in pitch blackness, one can completely go to other spaces that are persistent in ways that other drugs can not match. This allows for a very in-depth exploration of specific zones. The sense of space can be phenomenal.

Also, the detachment dissos provide allow for a nearly complete counteracting of the more annoying parts of the classical psych experience, and as such, he finds that using them together can provide a perfect balance.

They tend to potentiate other psychs in a way that allows one to conserve on materials and get a lot of bang for one's buck (no one should be paying for any of these things, this is just a metaphor).

Dissos with spice almost entirely counteract the pre-flight anxiety, extend trip durations, and allow for a very clear witnessing of the experience. Also, the breakthrough amount needed goes WAY down. Even tiny puffs can give OOBE breakthroughs... because you are already mostly OOBE anyway.

SWIM should say the K is not his favorite disso, though. He prefers DXM for going deep, and MXE for being more functional. K feels more toxic, but that could be due to purity issues. DXM & MXE being legal are more likely to be 100% pure (make sure of this, and do not trust any RC dealer to give you what you ordered). He has no experience with PCP, and has no desire to gain any either.

The short duration of K and its ROAs might contribute to its perception as being highly addictive. Perhaps people who are already highly addictive types are more drawn to it. This is not to discredit the warnings to be extremely moderate. SWIM never had any desire to do it more than once in a sitting. And he would turn it down half a dozen times or more before accepting it once or twice a decade. Of course, with the very easy availability of DXM which he vastly prefered anyway... why bother?

Be careful y'all. Don't mess around, and do not think for a second that just because dissos are not classified psychs or thought of as entheogens that they are not trippier than Shulgin sweat. SWIM certainly thinks of them as entheogens. They can very easily blow normal psychs out of the water... only spice and high dose salvia can top the visuals.

i prefer to combine ketamine with a quality tryptamine. it can throw a floodlight on some of lady k's more underhanded maneuverings...
(needless to say IM is the vastly superior route of administration.)

ketamine + 4-ho-mipt shot me all the way back to the Creation of the Universe, in which i was allowed to participate.
it was the only time i ever 100% believed that i had literally Died & would not return to my body.
on the way back, flying at hyper-light speed, i saw vast umbilicus ropes streaming past, embedded with countless trillions of pods or capsules... in each pod was an individual life - humans, animals, plants, other - every life that ever existed.

hyperspace fool, you have fine taste in dissociatives.
though far from user-friendly, dextromethorphan has provided some of the most exquisitely mystical & sublime experiences i've known...
it is magickal obsidian elixir, the dark matter of the entheogenic universe...
(and best used sparingly...)