Have others noticed that lately it seems most threads degrade into jousting matches between egos?

I myself have been the cause of some of them but I will refrain from naming other names. I am curious what happened to our friendly community? When I joined it seemed conversations were deeper, more on topic, and certainly more respectful.

Honesty I think a lot of us , me included, need to focus on being respectful to others. It's often not what is said, but how it's said. We all know this, but many of us have been choosing to ignore it.

There have been a few insightful members, no names, that have migrated away from the nexus because of this. I actually pondered leaving for awhile to find a more like minded group of people...then I realized that you ladies and gentlemen are my like minded peers. We will never agree on everything...hell probably not even most things, but can we all agree to be respectful to each other? This doesn't just mean making your point without name calling. It means being aware of how your post make another person feel. we can all make points in a away that help lift another person up just like we all know how to make our posts sting, yet still remain inside the rules...

This is my appeal to the community. Please let's be respectful of each other in every sense of those words.

I'm starting with myself...who else is in?

I hear that other fora are allying with each other and sending an evil spell to dismantle this beautiful community. The recent re-incarnation+comeback of coatl is the first wave of attack, the messenger of doom if you may.

Just joking of course, I see nothing wrong with the things as they are. From time to time people have asked similar questions, well nothing is happening. We just cannot be perfect all the time. We got ups and we got downs and we also got neither ups and neither downs.

If there's something specific that really bothered you then you may pm the traveler or any of the other mods. But I really don't see something strikingly "evil" enshadowing the Nexus (unless you refer to the chat where I am not regular!)

Nothing evil.

Just a lack of repect for each other which seems odd for a community that prides itself on self awareness...

And of course we can't be perfect, but lately it appears that the bickering has increased. I suppose it could just be me...

Natural cycles

We've seen quite a few crazy troubled times over the years, and sudden influx of people who didnt coincide with how we work. Remember hysteryx? She/it? Joebono in his troubled times? Coatl? Fwaggle? 69ron in the heated moments? etc etc... And the sudden dramas in general that appear here and there with old or new members

I think what we have to do is deal with specific cases, as inf said. If you feel something is wrong, do your best to not give energy to it and do as you think others should. If you want you can talk directly to members that you feel are acting against the attitudes through a friendly pm, or you can make a reasonable post about it, or you can contact mods.

Thanks for the concern, shows you appreciate the community

I have noticed, but what I have also noticed is that this sort of things comes in waves - once about every 4 months. Not to say that we should not be vigilant in our respectful dialogue with others, just an observation of how things tend to cycle around here.

I have been making, and will continue to make, efforts in the direction of diplomacy and tact (I am generally a very tactful person to start with - to a fault, I am often told) . But to be honest, it often does not make a bit of difference. A segment of the population here are never happy unless you agree wholeheartdly with them, no matter how you word your disagreement. Which makes me wonder why they post - perhaps for approbation? Clearly not to be challenged in a positive way, but rather to have the reassurance that their views are espoused, and approved, by others? If you are not willing to have your words and ideas challenged (and I mean this in the "positive", debate and exchange and learn-from-one-another-mode), maybe you shouldn't post in the first place...

And when people make false assertions, I would be remiss (and occasionally be irresponsible) not to respond, albeit in the kindest, most diplomatic, friendliest nudgy kind of way. I agree that this is not the place to begin name-calling and making jabs at peoples views or intelligence - the problem is sometimes however, that no matter how deftly you avoid these traps, some will always perceive them in your words, and feel threatened - and ironically, start namecalling. While I admit I have allowed myself to become heated in the past, I have never resorted to namecalling, but have been called quite a few nasty ones in my time here (if you really knew me, you'd see the rich irony in this )

I will not kowtow - I refuse categorically to NOT disagree with people as a policy, as it is an important part of the learning process, and integral part of the nexus, and the main reason (other than spicy stuff ) that I hang out here.

From my end, if you were meaning me at all Joedirt (and please PM me if you were), I will endeavour to be even MORE diplomatic, but don't expect me not to disagree with that with which I find disagreement. I NEED to learn from different perspectives, and the mild conflict of a keen debate of words and opinions is how I most easily learn from others and grow as a person.

And, if we are to make an effort at this end of the scale, perhaps the other end can learn a little from the duck, whose back beads and repels water - IOW, don't take everything so personally. Debates escalate and denigrate to disputes almost always due to both sides of the wall.

Cheers, peace and long live the new diplomacy!

JBArk

Perhaps you guys are right and it is a cycle.

Also I guess I need to remember why I joined....which is to discuss the entheogenic nature of these compounds and to explore my own personal spirituality and to get feedback from other like minded people. I guess I need to be better at avoiding the conversations about things like politics and views on hawking as these conversations could be better had in more appropriate forums on the net....or not. Maybe if I just focus on the threads that really pertain to my own personal reasons for joining I will not notice as much. After all even the Nexus isn't immune from break down in conversations around politics and religion!

Well if nothing else maybe other members, like me, that have found themselves in these situations lately will rethink the nature of some of their posts...and for sure im not saying dont disagree with each other! Lol. Lets just do it rspectfully.

You are correct as it's always good to step back and recognize how our posts effect others. I for one can always use a good kick-in-the-ass to remind myself of this.

That said, I feel you took offense to some of my posts recently and I truly think you were mistaken. I am fairly young and still exploring this world and trying to figure her out. I make mistakes and try to correct those mistakes. In doing so over the years I've discovered I don't know shit. Every time I think I'm certain about something the Universe slaps me on the face and reminds me how mysterious it all is. That's just her MO.

So, instead of telling you all what I think and why a certain poster was mistaken blah blah blah - I simply asked the poster to elaborate and support the given position. I would do this of anyone, including those who I feel aligned with. It's just my nature - I question everything. I would rather explore someone else's reasoning and see if maybe I can learn something to correct my own flawed understanding.

I spent a number of years in University studying the Socratic method, and I'm sorry but it just stuck to me. This method pisses some people off and makes others think I'm acting out of an air of superiority (look what it did to Socrates) - but I assure you I'm just a simple person sitting behind a computer screen hoping to learn a thing or two from you all. Who knows, if you're points are valid and you use reason to justify your claims I might even hop on board and vote with ya!

Generally I shy away from religion and politics, but if you're going to jump into these waters then please have something more than one line of ra-ra and a YouTube link. I don't think asking for substance is high and mighty. That said, I will head your advice and do my best to be diplomatic and friendly.

I think that many of the heated debates are happening in non-entheogen threads. When people start to debate politics or religion (or CT's!) then you get to a place where your belief is more important as rational thinking.

The heat seems to come in waves indeed. At a few instances it is needed to cool things down, then again, most issues though seem to resolve themselves.

I do think that it's important in any debate to stay polite and refrain from any pitfall like name calling and false arguments. If I see a thread where that reminder is needed then I will move in.


Kind regards,

The Traveler

I have seen threads like this occur from time to time on the DMT-Nexus. The Nexus is growing. I personally see this as a good thing. Cheers, Joe!

I know that I occasionally and unintentionally contribute to the negative vibe that periodically arises, and I’m trying to change. I make a point of always being respectful (and, I believe, only very rarely do I fail to be), but I do sometimes become forceful and tenacious when discussing certain topics.

(If you want to get my post count up, start a controversial thread about free will or consciousness!)

Anyhow, I try to avoid arguing just for the sake of arguing, and it seems that some members get satisfaction from that. I don’t. If an argument or debate sheds light on new ideas and perspectives, then it’s useful. Otherwise I’ve decided it’s best to steer clear. My approach now is to leave a thread when it’s clear that my participation is no longer contributing in a positive way.

Before making a post in any thread, I usually ask myself “Will this post contribute in a positive way to the thread?”. It’s only when I fail to ask myself that question that I get into trouble.

Couldn't have said it better myself. I haven't been around long, but I've been picking through all the threads and the more heated ones certainly seem to touch on those subjects, and those subjects are often the catalyst for debates becoming disrespectful, name-slinging arguments. It's in our human nature to bicker about those things.

Mostly, I would just like to see the focus kept on spice and other entheogens and topics that have a very close relationship with those subjects. A conversation can end up in a totally different place when those subjects are brought into the mix.

Amen.

This is the same argument used by the mods against CTs - but then people complain information is being suppressed by the powerful high-and-mighty Nexus mods. There's no winning, but Traveler and the others do a pretty good job of it. I don't envy their position.

IMO, one problem (that is widespread among most people, not just Nexians) is that people become confused in distinguishing between their IDEAS and THEMSELVES. Ideas should be (and ARE) abstractions, so it would be best not to associate emotions with them.

If person A says: "The universe was created by pink sharks. My mother told me this, and later I confirmed it was true in a vision."

And if person B then said "My mother told me the universe was created by a purple elephant, and the first thing I ever saw in hyperspace was a purple elephant as big as all creation!" Is person B being "negative" by telling his story, that conflicts with person A?

What is person C doing when he says: "Different mothers tell different tales; and people see things of infinite variety in visions."

Is person C being "negative" or just..."accurate?"

The truth is, from the most foolish and callow member here to the most wise and sublime, ALL OF US are attempting to GROW and perceive NEW and hopefully more REVEALING realities and truths. And such experiences are often rough on one's ego. People want to be RIGHT, but they often forget that the implication of being a searcher is that they inherently suspect they are NOT right, and are SEARCHING for what IS right. If you have FORGOTTEN THAT, it is time to recall it.

The process of growth usually involves some pain and even some embarrassment. Ask any teenager.

That said, there are inevitably some TOPICS which themselves seem to generate disputation--and almost nothing else. I think that The Traveler was correct in his "no more conspiracy theory topics" insistence. That would probably include religion and politics.

...and on a related note: I've seen before forums where everything was running smoothly, AND THEN subfora were added where general topics could be discussed--and within weeks everybody was at everybody else's throats! Maybe, in fact, we could do well WITHOUT "hyperspace tavern" types of subfora...

I suspect that if we were discussing only psychedelic experiences and techniques, arguments would be extremely rare.

EDIT: So, I think the question needs to be asked: should this forum be a compendium of our BEST moments and most FAR REACHING experiences....or the same crap everybody deals with and argues over every day? I would go with the first, and with keeping the content quite STRICTLY limited to experiences, techniques, and suppliers.

Here's an example: News stories/opinion pieces about legalizing drugs. Surely, we all AGREE substantially on this topic. What effect can discussion of it have OTHER THAN just stirring up emotions and strong feelings about "ideas?" So does something as "innocent" as that really have a good use? A good excuse for existing here?

I have also seen this and I suspect you are quite right with your last statement...




Interesting/intriguing idea. Would you limit it to experiences, techniques, suppliers, and entheogenic/spiritual/shamanistic use as well?

Or course we could just put the burden on ourselves to avoid certain threads! I for one could certainly stand to just avoid some threads because for whatever reason I always find myself aggravated with them. Politics being one of them. I can talk issues with someone all day, but as soon as it gets tainted with 'politics' I find my feathers ruffled....it's a character flaw!

Everything is the way it should be.

I think the fact is that forums begin on a small topic, where lots of goodwill is generated between the members, because they all love the topic and feel basically the same about it. With such good spirits people think "Hey, I'd love to discuss OTHER STUFF with my now close chums!" And as soon as that happens, the people realize they aren't as well aligned as they THOUGHT they were.

The sad fact is, if the Nexus were so limited, posting would decline substantially--and that's why there might be a reluctance to go that route. But the fact is, a better spirit might arise from it--along with a little boredom perhaps.

In life, the really IMPORTANT STUFF happens when we're alone, and inside our own heads--not on forums and social convocations. But we get bored, and want to interact with people...and clashes can happen.

In the past perhaps there was lower volume but higher "quality." People see that, and want to EXPAND IT--and it turns into crap because it was expanded into OTHER THINGS.

Regarding usage methods...take yourself as an example: I have particularly enjoyed your experience reports because you have couched them into yogic/meditative backgrounds--background intentions that mirror my own. But it was done in such a way that nobody seemed to feel the need to begin to discuss that BACKGROUND stuff (to any great extent) over the EXPERIENCE. So there's a fine line. If such reports are framed in such a way that the thread begins a discussion about the pros and cons of Kundalini yoga, then that would probably be the wrong path.

You can usually tell by the way something is FRAMED what the real intention of discussion is. So...no, I don't think there is a problem with fleshing out experiences by mentioning INTENTIONS for entheogenic uses. But I certainly don't think discussions about the relative value of Tibetan religion vs. South American religion, for example, would be a useful topic....while discussing one's EXPERIENCES from a framework of such things would be OK.

Well...should we "burden" ourselves that way?

For example, as you know, I was just involved in some heated discussion in a thread about telepathy. To sit by and tacitly watch the discussion implies that I CONDONE the topic, and condone the unstated implication that it RELATES to entheogen use and cultivation of entheogenic experiences (since that is the central area of this forum).

It's all a fine line...

A) If someone in an experience report said they "knew what everyone was thinking in the universe" who would feel the need to confront that? I don't think anyone would. I certainly wouldn't.

B) If someone after an experience reported that "They could sense other people's thoughts and intentions" would there be a need to insist that "they really couldn't KNOW other people's thoughts?" Not really. Not if the implication was that the experiencer felt "hypersensitive" to people in general, as a result of their experience. But I think you will agree that if someone reported that they were GOING AROUND READING MINDS--and where going to start putting all their money into the lottery from then on, that people would begin to suggest to them that they should re-examine their understanding a bit.

C) If someone started a thread that "ESP IS REAL!" I think that's an invitation for others to RESPOND with whether or not THEY think it's real--and of course, WHY they think that way. So starting such a thread is EITHER 1) An invitation for a convocation of believers (for which, I'm sure, there are ESP forums serving such interests), or 2) An invitation for DISCUSSION about whether or NOT ESP is real--which would HAVE to involve disputation, by its very nature. But is the question ever raised that the very INITIATION of such threads is an invitation to disputation? I think that's the question that is relevant here, and that it relates to the topic of CT threads, and why the easiest way to avoid ALL problems is to exclude ALL such topics, and instead concentrate on the CENTRAL AREA of the forum: all issues surrounding the use of entheogens, with particular interest in DMT.

i will apologise to all those who have felt bad because of the negative posts by me (quite few really )
i will personally try to be more evolved ,

have you nexians also noticed that these heated posts sometimes are very funny , considering how heated it gets at times , sometimes i write sometihing funny in these heated topics and it does feel good considering everyone is trying to throttle each other and how words can cause so much grief

forgive me if the above does not seem to be funny

I think vovin's thread originally brought attention to this phenomenon. In my opinion, this "bad energy" can be avoided by simply adhering to the attitude of the Nexus and working on communicatory skills by reading Enoon's thread on the subject of communication.

Hey guys, it's all good. We're all mature adults here. A good debate is healthy. Life would be boring if it was all peace and love and agreement. Obviously there's a line though, but to be quite honest I haven't seen much evidence of it being crossed here.

I've only been back on the board a week or so and it seems pretty much the same as it was before. Man, I remember even a couple of years ago people were saying that it had changed etc etc. There are some people not around who I had hoped would still be on here, but that's the nature of internet message boards.

It's up to us, as the active members, to make sure that we retain our culture and identity and I think we're doing that.I think this is still a nice corner of the net where we're not trying to be cool for 'taking drugs' or show that we know best about something.

Also, sometimes when you write something you can't quite get across your sense of irony or sarcasm. E.G a few years ago someone wrote that they had a plan to grow a certain amount of opium, so they could smoke it and finish it and wouldn't get addicted. I sarcastically commented "a foolproof idea" and someone else thought I was being serious, when clearly (in my own mind) I was being sarcastic.

Anyway, let's not take ourselves or each other too seriously and we'll carry on having a great community.