Anyone tried this legal substance? it´s very closely related to psilobin and seems to be safe to use.

Ive read alot about it and have not found any bad effects so far, it is one of shulgins creations and seems to be very interesting.


Also has anyone tried or heard anyone combining it with caapi or rue?

4-ho-met is probably an analog, just giving you a headsup on that. It's also closely related to psilocin, not psilocybin. You put the two works together, I think.

It's highly visual, and most seem to enjoy it and it has less anxiety than 4-ho-dmt anecdotally. There have been a few reported negative experiences though. But, in one of those case it is suspected to not be 4-ho-met since the physical and effect descriptions are vastly different than what they normally are. 4-meo-pcp is suspected as a mix up.

One experience I have seen with an MAOI said it was kinda rough cardiovascularily speaking. Slight tachycardia and their face flushed. They did not record their blood pressure but vasodilation wouldn't be unbelievable. I personally have tried this substance and my vitals stayed about the same. I recorded respirations, pulse, and blood pressure. The only one to go up at all was my pulse. I'm usually bradycardic but it went up to mid 90s in the comeup and then slowed down to mid 70s at the peak. Perhaps a first pass metabolism?

i've had about ~15 experiences with 4-ho-met, at various doses.

it is quite pleasant, with generous visual frosting... however this became problematic as often it seemed there was far more frosting than cake!

it can certainly lead one into some very weird & wonky territory, but for me there was always a sense of disconnection, detachment, apathy, sterility... immersion but little engagement.

this is probably an idiosyncratic response, so take it with a grain of salt, but as my relationship with metocin developed, its personality crystallized into a playful, teasing, somewhat frivolous 'princess'... a delight if refined fun is your goal, but most irritating for those inclined to intensive integrative endeavors!

i gifted some to a ballsy friend who injected 30 mg intra-muscularly. his report of this rather hefty dose was consistent with my experiences: intense visual distortions, but little to no insight or useful conceptual expansion (tho that was quickly remedied with the next shot of ketamine, he hastened to add)

other reports have suggested richer potential than what i experienced - so as always, Your Mileage May Vary

Ok ive ordered 250mg of this stuff for some testing...

Ive heard that 30mg is a good starting dose, would this be equal to about 2,5-3g of cubensis? Sounds like a good party trip since it seems less serious than the fungi.

Also does anyone know how it would work to refill it? i´m one of those guys who likes to trip for a long time so i usually take lsd with a few refills during myt trip.

i would always start low, very low, for first few times of anything to check for idiosynchratic reactions. for all you know, you're allergic. And, typically allergies take 2 exposures to show themselves. Also, many people find 30mg to be a high dose. It's approximately the same potency as 4-ho-dmt, and 30mg (even of the fumarate) is on the high side.

The time I did it, i hope to repeat the experience soon, i was able to do a booster.

So i tried about 20mg´s yesterday...

It gave a nice tryptamine buzz with some visuals and preety heavy but nice chills down my spine.

After about 1½ hour after intake i got the urge to smoke some changa, it was overall nice but the first 2hits i just felt the dmt going wtf id this stuff in your body? "i don´t know this guy!"

I tried explaining that it was related to psilobin and the dmt seemed to be ok with it in me


I have a hard time telling if the combo was better or worse than a normal changa sesion, i did have a hard time breaking through and staying there since the 4homet kept reminding me of having a body, but i had som very nice sub breakthrough time,


Although after a few hours i got a headache which wasnt to bad but it locked on and i can still feel it a bit the day after.


Ive heard some people getting headaches from 4homet but honestly i think i´m preety dehydrated aswell since ive been working outside in very cold vinds for 3days, and know i have´nt been drinking enough fluids...




As for the 4homet/metocin buzz alone i would give it 8/10 it is preety close to psilobin but without the weirdness and plant spirit, although combining it with harmalas and dmt gave a very strong spiritual feeling. The only drawback for me was the headache but like i said i don´t know if the metocin is to blame. will try again in a few weeks with a bigger dose.

Can anyone compare ho-met to 4-ho-mipt/miprocin?

i can, and will

do keep in mind that these are simply my own experiences... so when i say 'miprocin is this' or 'metocin is that', feel free to insert '(for blue lunar night)' as a qualifier.

my take on metocin appears a few posts up in this thread.

fortunately my response to miprocin is worlds apart. it is likely the synthetic psychedelic that i most treasure & revere (excluding dissociatives).
many of the issues i have had with various synthetic Tryps & Phens are not to be found here.
these issues include:
-lack of focus & intelligence
-unbalanced
-qualities of sterility, apathy, hollowness, brittleness, & flat-lined neutrality
-low resolution: pixelated visual presentation
-etc

i have not encountered these synthetic-specific weakspots with miprocin.
its energetic frequency is high-toned, electric, very cerebral, with shocking conceptual depth and exquisite aesthetic refinement. a light-speed launch through fractal paradox. it has upgraded & expanded my cognitive capabilities. it is mystical and pure. it teaches.

metocin, in accordance with my partial perception of it as a playful princess, might be considered somewhat more 'shroom-like' (tho to compare the two would be like comparing pearl and plastic) in that it is murkier, dreamier, with enchanted fairy-land qualities... a synthetic presentation of an organic style. one of my more memorable metocin moments involved transforming into a magic troll creature of some sort...

in contrast, miprocin is clean & crystal clear, opening a space where the hyper-precision of Techne has merged with the healing superabundance of Art & the purity & truth of Spirit. It has successfully asserted its synthetic origins as a badge of pride rather than shame.
it is glossy, futuristic, & deliciously alien.

in buddhist terms it can unite the trikaya: nirmanakaya, sambhogakaya, & dharmakaya.

one of my miprocin experiences involved every single one of my selves - past/present/future, non-human, alter-dimensional, etc - coming into some kind of 'alignment', which acted as a sort of channel for me to access my 'Seed-Self', or Higher-Self, God-Self, etc... the Self from which all others emanate. i understood that i had been there many times before, and would return many times again.
Yet it was not a unitary experience in the sense that i merged with all beings - this was clearly a network of avatars in which 'blue lunar night' was implicated, and there are many such networks, many 'Seed-Self' entities with their associated nodes of consciousness/identity distributed throughout & perhaps beyond space-time. @ 22-24mg/fumarate

another experience involved my astral body being attacked by insectoid psychic parasites.
another experience involved inadvertently peeking my head into a private godspace of some sort. there was a group of highly evolved entities... i had the sense of being a small dog or more likely a bug at their feet. they reacted towards me with a mixture of disdain, annoyance, pity, & amusement. like, 'what is this little critter and how did it get in here?! somebody throw it back outside so we don't have to step on it.' @ 22-24mg/fumarate.

i have felt the presence of spirits in my physical environment in all of my miprocin trips. one time, @ 16 mg, i even distinctly felt an invisible hand run through my hair... of course i was alone in the house at night too... it can be very spooky...

miprocin has blessed me with some key teachings regarding the emptiness of self. it has a rather dramatic way of causing everything, particularly oneself, to appear as a hologram. to deeply feel & know & experience oneself as a hologram is a powerful thing.
it has also enhanced my ability to detach my locus of awareness & being from my body while awake. for example i can shift my node of consciousness outside of my body, usually not much further than ~20 feet, and float around near the ceiling or something. i haven't worked on this aspect very much thus far, but no doubt it can be taken further - remote viewing, etc.

somehow i've tip-tap-typed all this text without even mentioning miprocin's astonishing intensity!
well... it is extremely intense! finger-in-an-electrical-socket intense!
and yet also perfectly smooth, with minimal anxiety or confusion. (this is with cannabis smoked during ascension; can't speak to how it might be otherwise...)

an alien metallic green and a mystic potent purple seem to predominate in miprocin's chromatic presentation...

one thing about which i am adamant when it comes to miprocin: music is a necessity, specifically rhythmic and melodic music, carefully crafted, mentally stimulating, & of positive & mystical sensibility. high-quality goa trance fits the bill for me, and i have found that the trip simply won't fully manifest without it. silence is unsettling in the extreme (i usually prefer silence with fungus...). any trace of coarseness, darkness, or negativity in music will be amplified a thousandfold, compelling the listener to lunge for the STOP button in a state of high alarm.

as always, beautiful nature is the best setting for a miprocin journey, but ensuring that random people are not going to wander into the scene is of paramount importance. additionally, i am unusually wary of taking miprocin in any but the most secluded locations, because it creates an extremely high probability of sometimes testy & distressing synchronistic occurrences - on various experiences outside i have endured ordeals of:
-being closely tracked through the woods for 10-15 minutes by 2 huge & very aggressive rottweilers who appeared ready to tear me to shreds at the signal until their owners called them off;
-having a small swarm of shady-looking & un-identified visor'd LE agents randomly appear with vans & walkie-talkies at my location in a small state park
-walking on a path through the woods and, just as i was about to peak, discovering that my pants were completely covered with tiny baby ticks. i was compelled to remove my pants and hang out in my underwear on the very public walkway until i was capable of walking back to my car, awkwardly explaining to the occasional passerby my predicament.
-and of course the always popular freak lightning storm

these incidents among others demonstrate the need for caution & careful consideration when choosing a location with potentials for intrusion.

hmmm well surely there's much i've forgotten, but since i've been at this for an hour now, i'll let it rest here & encourage questions if anyone has them

Thanks for the review, great report blue lunar night!
Yeah I loved miprocin, I sampled it 3 times at the lower dosage area 15-25mg. Saying it's smooth is an understatement! To me it was like "Tryptamine LSD".

From what I gather ho-met seems to be more like mushrooms minus the mindfuck, which is appealing in itself, but there are other compounds similar to mushrooms whereas miprocin is kind of unique.

Man, Tryptamines are like pokemon, "gotta catch-em all!"

So me and my gf tried about 50mg of this stuff yesterday and it was very freaky to say at least,

We had a blast just laughing and joking all night long, with the visuals being 3steps above to much, at times the entire room started to spin and i could create objects at will!

I could definetaly feel the relation to psilobin with this one but instead of a plant spirit showing and teaching me stuff it was just all me!

My imagination wen´t out of control and i could create anything i wanted just by thinking about it..

The overall feel of this drug is playfulness and childishness, sometimes the visuals were borderline cartons with teddy bears in underwear and smiling genies..

Also the headspace that it left me kept me preety sobber compared to psilobin or lsd.


Another though with this drug for me is that it´s 100% party, usually when tripping at home i like to get to a mystical and spirutal place and think about stuff but with this i just wanted to play some psytrance and flip out!

My conclusion so far is

Positive:

Most visual entheogen ive ever tried, the ratio to the mindfuck gives me a toy max out the visual part of the trip, i could probably take 100mg without getting to weird compared to psilobin.


The ability to paint pictures of my thoughts was very interesting, i actually felt very smart while on this and could get a very deep understanding of all kinds of concepts since i could visualise them very clearly.


very happy drug with me having very much fun and loving alot. my gf had some negative side effects but for the dose it was under control most of the time, compared to lsd and psilobin which usually escalated if the ship get´s turned in the wrong direction.




Negatives:

Very dehydrating, i got very dry in myhead and had to drink alot and piss alot, alot of people seems to get headache from this but i think if you hydrate properly there should be no problems.


Empty and meaningless at times, not all the time but at least half of the time all of this felt pointless and just like a freaking circus in my livingroom, no mystical fell to this at all, more like a psychedelic cartoon.


Glitctes in my brain, this actually felt weird and unhealthy at times, best way to describe it is like a needle that reads from a harddrive that looses it´s tracking which led to thoughts getting blurry and a hard time to speak and some stuttering.

wow,thanks for the report,swim was searching a psychedelic like it,most of psychedelic we know are entheogens

SWIM looked up the price of this legal product.



EDIT: NEVERMIND THAT, the CAS number was from a bad source. 4-ho-met doesn't have a CAS :/

Well, we're not supposed to talk about prices but that price is impossible, it costs about as much as other 4-ho/aco tryptamines.

Yeah it´s preety cheap, i will probably stock up before it get´s illegal.

anyone has ever ordered from china suppliers of alibaba? are they legit?

dunno if you can stock it for a long time since it's very close to psilocin maybe its molecule is oxidizable as psilocin

Well, 4-ho-met is 4-hydroxy-N-methyl-N-ethyltryptamine so there is no way it could turn into 4-hydroxy-dimethyltryptamine

ah sorry,maybe i write wrong..i wouldn't say it could turn into 4-ho-dmt but that it could be oxidable in the same matter that psilocin could be oxidable

I have used it for a almost 4 tripps. Before I have only tripped once with LSD on twice with 4-ho-dpt. My experience is that it is extremly visuall and fells much better then DPT. As I ussually ends up in some type of meditative state where I close my eyes and start to focus on my closed eye hallucinations I find it attractive that the trip only last for about 2-4 hours.


The only draw backs I have encountered are the extremly bad taste when snoorting and that it in the begining is so strong that I almost get sea sick as the whole room starts to vibrate and pulsate.

Got curious about 4-HO-MIPT now..