Hey folks!

This is something I've been pondering for a couple of years now and probably have been experiencing for probably longer than I realise. Now to most I don't really come across as a depressed person and I generally am quite cheerful in my day to day life. Most of the time when I'm in good company I feel pretty good and I can laugh and merrily swap stories etc. But I do on occasion find people annoying for no good reason and find myself arguing with folk about stuff that doesn't matter just for the sake of it. Being a prick really doesn't suite me.

This realisation struck me hardest recently as most of the time growing up I'd have a big grin slapped on my face even if I wasn't feeling so great as it always made me feel better to smile as the world smiled back at me. These days the smile is getting less air time and a more blank expression seems to be taking the front seat. As people are used to seeing me smile, when I'm not smiling they always ask me what's wrong. I tell them "nothing" but the truth is inside I'm thinking 'I don't know'.

Looking at the more long term picture I'm pretty much going nowhere in life and haven't been for some time. If anything I'm slowly moving backwards. When I wake up in the morning I have no urge to get out of bed and have a very bleak feeling about the day ahead. Sometimes if I have something planned that I have been happily looking forward to, on first waking up on the day I have very negative feelings about it. Once I've been awake 8 hours or so I start to come round a bit. This leads me to not sleeping properly as I'm always at my best when I should be going to sleep but this doesn't happen as this is when I'm at my most productive. However when I do try to sleep as my mind is in better working order I find myself worrying about things that I should have been thinking about in the day. I'll lay there thinking about positive things I can do to sort my life out, but of course when I awake after sleeping all the drive to implement it has gone. Also on top of this my sleep cycles are very erratic at best so this obviously isn't helping. I probably haven't had steady sleep rhythms since I was 15. I'm now 26.

The bit that's bothering me the most is that I seem to be so overly critical of myself that it's bordering on a disabilty that seems to be routed in a very retarded form of arrogance. Very often I get folk telling me I have a very creative mind. My main thing used to be music/production but on many occasion I have been told I should write comedy/ be a chef/write a book. I always reply by slamming folk rather than taking the complement as if I know better than them and they are wrong. It's not even like I think everything I do sucks, but there's an irrational instinct inside me that tells me so and it's that instinct that holds the rationality on a chain. A similar instinct used to make me think people disliked me as soon as they met me, but that's becoming less prominent. Though this is irrelevant at the moment as in my current location it's very difficult finding like minded folk anyway so generally on meeting new people I have very little to talk about and I just end up listening = I know them but, they don't know me. It's almost as if I don't exist. This reminds me of another thing that I do which is just weird. If I'm thinking of something or doing an activity that reminds me of an old friend, I imagine a conversation with that person in my head about the theme in question.

I guess that's probably enough splurging as I could go on for longer but this isn't really the point of this post. What I'm asking is does this sound farmiliar to anyone?
For the last 6 months or so I've given myself a little statement to live by:

"Stop being a dick-head" (only the 'H' is silent as I say it in a yorkshire accent like an old friend)

Basically it means I know what the problem is now so I should just sort it. Just get off my ass and do all that stuff I should do. For a couple of months I almost had it in me. I started doing a bit more work with ayahuasca and that gave me a bit of focus and spiritual energy to be going along with. Then I came to the conclusion that there was no point using the vine anymore until I took those steps to improvement. I have noticed the afterglow of caapi isn't as much a chemical thing for myself as it is an impact it has on the more psychological part of the mind rather than the physical due to the way I could sort out my issues in my head in a nice and orderly fashion neatly filing away the avalanche of worry's.

Anyways I've started pondering with the notion of dealing with this matter through more conventional methods. My personal life is at a stage where it's critical that I can function adequately as a human and the problem only seems to be getting worse if anything. The thing is I feel quite strange about going to a doctor or whatever about this. I'm generally a fairly healthy individual and I have no need for them. Don't get me wrong if I got shot or had some strange disease I'd be over there without even thinking about it. I'd just feel like a complete tool sitting down in a clinic with a big fat smile on my face saying "Doctor, I think I may be depressed!". Especially as depression was something I always figured could be dealt with by ones self and I still do, however in my current circumstance I just can't seem to trigger the change. I'm equally concerned about what course of action your standard clinic doctor may take or if I'd even be taken seriously about the whole thing. There's still a part of me that thinks I'm fabricating this to myself as an excuse for being a lazy SOB, but that very well could be my critical side kicking in again and that's definately my biggest self destruct button if life has taught me anything.

In the mean time I've stopped using pysches, not as much to keep my mind balanced and sober, but I seem to have slammed into a road block on that one and I'd just feel like I was wasting them.

So err... opinions please?

For the most part, I could have written this myself. I have serious ups and downs, but the down curve seems to drag the up curve steadily downward. it has been 4 years that my career took a serious nosedive and I barely work at all anymore. I have a 2 year old son which is a double edged sword - it has taught me a new kind of love, a deeper, sweeter love, and it has taught me that true selflessness does exist.

However, when selfless the self soars - and the self suffers. I have no time to address the main problems, which affect my sense of self worth and personal accomplishments.

Enough whining on my end . What you want is advice. I am at the same crossroads as you. I have never considered seeking professional help and experience a deep (though surely unjustified) sense of shame even contemplating therapy. But I am about to make the plunge...

In the meantime I do everything in my power not to think about it. THE LOOP is what is to be feared. It is self-perpetuating and serves no useful purpose, but often seems impossible to avoid. I am starting to meditate (although shutting out the chatter is proving very difficult!) I exercise regularly (and increasingly more intensely) and eat well (ok, including the occasional guilty filthy domino's pizza...) and get out of the house more.

But you've heard all that before. the only piece of advice i can give you that might actually be original is: organize yourself; make lists.

LONG TERM
MEDIUM TERM
SHORT TERM
DAILY

The lists are things you want to do, from the concrete to the abstract. In other words, goals. The daily ones are the most immediate and most important in a way; At the end of the day, if I manage to get to the bottom of a (reasonable) list, I have a sense of accomplishment. The key is that the goals the lists set must be achievable, otherwise they feed the loop of negative self worth.

Anyway, this is my strategy and for the most part it works day to day, but I still am contemplating therapy to get at the reasons why I have to develop a strategy at all. A lot of it has to do with circumstance, but a lot of it has to do with who I am, or rather, who i have become. Time to find the old me, and change the things that made that me into the me I am now.

Find your old you.

Vined you're hold you.

JBArk

Im sorry that you find yourself in such a headspace Soulfood.

Usually with depression one tends to get psychic and secondary physical effects.Its most unusual to have 'depression' in the head without these physical sequelae.

These are:

1.Alteration in sleep pattern such as sleeping more or less.Often the depressed individual finds it hard to drop off to sleep, their sleep is broken and they often wake up earlier, such that they cannot drop off to sleep again.Hoever, some sleep more.

2.Alteration in bowel function-both reduced frequency of taking a dump or having more frequent motions are perfectly well recognised.

3.Changes in weight-usually weight loss but weight gain is also seen.This is a consequence of:

4.Alteration in appetite-usually appetite goes down but some begin to eat more.

In terms of the psychic effects, the depressed individual is anhedonic, ie derives no pleasure from the things which usually they found stimulating and pleasurable.They cannot see a 'brighter' future and they lack the energy to get things done.Others may also experience anxiety for no clear reason with all the physical effects which go along with this.As it progresses, in some individuals thoughts of not waking up in the morning, or more worryingly, thoughts of harming themselves.


Its important to make a full inventory of what is going on in your life as the usual causes of exogenous depression (ie as a reaction to shitty things going on which may or may not be under ones control) may include financial/relationship/health issues.

Its also important to refrain from psychoactives of all kinds including cannabis as it can be very hard to diagnose depression if the waters are muddied by chemicals.

If there are no clear precipitants for your symptoms then I think a knowledgeable doctor should perform the following blood tests, as a minimum, to rule out physical causes for the problems you are experiencing:

Full Blood Count and an inflammatory marker such as the ESR or CRP;
Renal function and glucose;
Liver function tests;
serum calcium;
thyroid function tests;
serum B12 and folate.

If these turn up any anomalies, and/or you have any relevant family history, then further follow-up tests may be required.Hope this helps.

I have found that so much of this type of thing is all in the head. That is, people are convinced they have a much bigger problem than they do, or that their problem is insurmountable. The hard part is taking the first steps. Getting through depression is like starting an exercise program. At first it's really hard. A lot of people are convinced they are so out of shape they couldn't possibly continue with such a rigorous program, and they give up. However, you will find that very quickly, if you stick with the program, the exercise will not nearly as difficult. In face, the exercise will start to become routine, and it will make you feel good instead of making you feel bad.

In many cases of depression, there's just a few key things in a person's life that are causing malaise, and these things need to be tweaked. You need sleep. You gotta do what you gotta do to get that proper sleep. Anyone chronically deprived is going to feel crappy. I know, I've had sleeping problems forever. You have to have the discipline to go to bed on time, early, take sleep aids, even if you don't feel like sleeping you gotta have the disipline to get in bed and stay the course. It might make you frustrated at first, but with practice you will come to learn to see your bed as a friend. And on that note I'll add that exercise during the day helps one get to sleep. Exercise.... HARD. Really hard.

Getting over depression is like learning a skill. It's very difficult at first, and people give up, and then never practice at all, and wonder why they stay depressed for years. You'll never get better at math, or tennis or boxing if you never practice. And you'll never get through depression cycles unlesss you take the steps.

Overthinking is a HUGE part of this as well. I have found that overthinking thinking itself is exhuasting. I might have absolutely nothing to do all day, but if I'm overthinking, the day will end with me feeling exhuasted and unable to sleep because my mind is overactive, but my body is not tired. Learn to let go of your thoughts. Do whatever it takes. If you find you feel like you just can't let go.... fight it. Stop everything and stare at a frickin wall and do absolutely nothing until that annoying bitch of a mind understands that you're not going to give in to its cycle of overthinking. You won't feed it with material. Deprive it of everything and don't let it start up again until you both agree that you're either going to think or do or feel something more positive, or you're just going to stand still.

About general malaise with life, I have found this is the result of life not meeting your expectations, or things turning out not they way you hopred for, or envisioned. People often think of their lives as smaller than they wanted, less meaningful than they wanted. You may find that if you relent on your expectations, your life will open up, perhaps reveal a path you had not considered taking, and you may find the new road to be much more fulfilling. Afterall, if you release your expectations, you will be open minded, and so any path that opens from that point will be a natural opening. In other words, the path that naturally opens is the path that is destined for you. It is your path. I find that a lot of people, depressed people anyway, want to be big heroes, and if they aren't acheiving something enormous, they aren't satisfied with acheiving anything. Come to terms with the possibility that you may always be an average person, not acheiving anything in particular. Then you will begin to focus not on what you don't have, but the special gifts you do have. You will learn to work with the cards you have been dealt, and not wasting your energy hoping to be dealt different cards. You will work with what you have, and that is the best you can possibly do because the cards you have are the only cards you have.

Learn to let go of expectations of what life should be. Perhaps it is not your place to be a big hero, or make a big impact. Maybe your place is to make little impacts that will pave the way for someone else to make a big impact. Almost everyone wants to be an olympic gold madalist, but that champion wouldn't be a champion if it weren't for the many people, trainers, family, people of guidance, who lead that champion to greatness. Maybe the whole point of your existence is to reach just one person, or creature, who will in turn, play a key role in the unfolding of the universe. The only reward is living in harmony with what is, what has been given. And you may find this reward more fulfilling than all your previous expectations.

About getting professional help, I wouldn't recommend taking their nasty medicines unless you are on the verge of suicide. Consider that medicine as a last resort because often times, it makes people feel worse than better. Research the statistics for the effectiveness of anti-depressants. It's pretty awful. And the side effects are unpleasant, and if you think you have a hard time sleeping or functioning now, wait until you experience withdrawal. It's pretty surprising the things they will allow to be legal, and something beautiful like mescaline, isn't. The government must have a really messed up sense of "safety". Heck, they know very well people have reported increased thoughts of suicide on anti depressants, they know about all the side effects, they know about the nasty withdrawal.... and the stuff is still legal. But, the government has gone out of their way to tell a native American it's illegal for them to practice their spirituality by taking peyote, and that act could be punishable by 10 years in prison. They've banned the plant itself! Sorry, getting off topic in to psychedelics.

If you're seeking talk therapy, then the best they can do is help you to identity your problems and encourage you to take the steps to do something about it, and suggest things that will help. However, you have to be the one to actually do something. Counselling may be helpful. I personally don't like anti-depressants, but that's just my opinion, and many others share my opinion. You can google anti depressants and "side effects", or "withdrawal" and read the countless nasty stories yourself. But, anti depressants probably won't kill you, so whatever. If you're desperate enough I guess you could take them. But the effects of anti depressants can be bad and even make things worse, which is why I don't suggest them unless you think you might kill yourself, or you're really desperate. Don't mess with that stuff just to try it out. Say no to drugs.

Hi soulfood,

I have a very close friend who experiences exactly all of the things you mentioned (bar the conversations with friends on recalling them as far as I know). She was diagnosed with severe depression several years ago and has been on a variety of anti-depressants which seem to just numb her. They don't really help make her better, just make her not care about things as much. But the symptoms she shares with you are perhaps more visible while being on the medication than before she started.

A doctor would probably diagnose you with depression (as this is what happened with my friend with your symptoms), and what you need to remember is that anti-depressants can be very difficult to come off. I think if I was in your situation, given what I know from experience, I would leave the anti-depressant medication as the last option. However, your doctor may be able to refer you to a councellor or psychiatrist. You may not think you would have any use for a councellor and that you wouldn't know what to say to them, but they are generally very well trained and experienced to bring things out of you and put things in perspective from an outsider's point of view. I believe a councellor would help my friend if she gave it a serious go. I have used one myself and found it to be very theraputic to put things into perspective.

That being said, it's important to remember depression isn't always caused by psychological problems or a traumatic past, but can be due to a chemical imbalance in the body and/or hereditory.

From what I have read about psychedelics though, they do appear to be something that may help. However, I've no experience so I couldn't comment.

I know from experience with my friend the stigma associated with, and lack of understanding of, depression. I know that depressed people can feel like maybe it's just laziness, or could be perceived as a cry for help. The truth is you shouldn't feel this way, because it is a real illness/disease/condition that needs treatment one way or another. Unfortunately what I can't help you with is how to cure it or even help it.

As I have said, anti-depressant medication doesn't seem to cure it (although the doctor said it would replace the lacking chemicals and over time the body would learn to replace these itself), neither has it seemed to help much as my friend has expressed being numb is often worse than having mood swings or feeling something.

If you want to ask anything, feel free to PM me. As I have quite a lot of experience with someone who is suffering from depression, I hope I may be able to answer some of your questions.

Best wishes.

Im thinking such experience and such realisations are very common to psychonauts. I have been there too, and in a way, i still am. All humans are, but most dont know or dont want to be confronted with this. As you point out.

Whatever you do... it is what you should do. It is really as simple as that. Try to live by this and things will pick up mysterious momentum. You are part of the puzzle and i do think you underestimate your role. You are not anymore or less in/significant than any other-where-ever. Pick the life(style) that suits you, not the one that you think looks good.

I know it is not easy, but it sure aint crap

Apoc got some good advice.

Taking compliments is crucial. Also accepting stuff from others. If you accept good things from others, you might come to the conclusion, that there must be something about you that is not wrong!

A daily routine might help, but if you are sabotaging yourself with your own thought patterns, it won't help. You have to train yourself to recognize faulty thinking right on the spot. Then you can take measures against it. A while ago i've learned to re-interpret negative things. So if it's raining i think to myself "Oh, what a nice refreshment" and if its still bugging me after that thought, i try to laugh it off.

You can do it. Do you know why? Because you are already doing it, just the other way round!!

Everytime someone makes you a compliment you rather think "He doesn't mean it...he can't mean it" instead of accepting it in your heart. If you accept it with every part of your being, their positivity will bounce off you and people will start to notice.

I'm struggling with the same issues and its a fight for me, because i neglected myself for far too long. The sooner you start shaping new neural pathways, the better.

Oh, and I always enjoyed your company very much, so get out of the bed and live more (and post more )

Looks like there is some signals of depression and anxiety in your history. But by reading your posts you do not looks like a person severely depressed or severely anxious. Far from it.

The simptons you mention seems more like an existencial crisis, some neurotical symptons plus the signs of age and the difficult to live in a society which sometimes is really crap. And how not feel depressed or at least disappointed with so much shit in the world?! These symptons are much more common in our society than one can suppose but are not the kind of "disorder" curable by antidepressants and others classes of drugs (not efficiently, not permanently), though able to produce some depression and anxiety.

But the best part is that you are searching for a response, a very positive attitude, a very good sign (btw, uncommon in depressive people, as well pointed by corpus callosum).

I think you should search not for a doctor or a psychiatrist, but a psychologist, a psychotherapist or a body therapist. They are advanced in guide the pacient to access the the depths of his psyche, through understanding and feeling, body and emotions awareness, body and mental health improvement and so on. Also, they are able to guide you through a psychiatrist or a doctor in case you really need the help of one.

Good luck! I think you are in the correct path.

Thank god im not the only person who does this, I thought I was a freak lol maybe psychs will after all turn me and you into schitzos because I do this a lot. Sometimes im in the bath or shower and I will imagine these conversations with friends and speak out loudly, then im like wtf am I doing The mrs heard me once and I explained it to her, the look on her face!

Drs will offer counselling and dodgy ssris, you have cappi which can be used in low doses for depression, then theres the possibility of iboga, which ime does works great in low doses, worth a try! I went to counselling twice, I really didnt need it I was homeless and it was offered but it made me feel great, was just like a wee psychological pat on the head that said im ok and it worked! It doesnt sound like you work? Maybe you need a routine to force the issue of getting out of bed, having a job works wonders sometimes.

You could maybe get back into your music, set yourself targets and get up in the morning like you would a job and get tore in, swear sometimes im bored and peed off then I get into making stuff and I feel great afterwards, ive been productive and done things rather than doing nothing, like reading this site lol. I think if you had really bad suicidal depression maybe something like ssris would be needed but you dont so id go for all the obvious ones most people have mentioned, good luck!

I have a feeling this could become quite a long thread.

I don't really have any advice to offer, but my experience is different from anyone who has posted yet, and I have found a cure (for me). It has quite an interesting ending, so I think it will be worth wading through!

First I do think it is important not to confuse depression with chronic unhappiness and dissatisfaction with your current life. If the unhappiness comes from your current situation, then I should think there is a good chance that you can work your way out by gradually changing and improving that situation - although obviously that will be hard if energy levels have already dropped.

What made me realise I was in severe clinical depression (i.e. where the actual brain neurotransmitter chemistry is so shot that you are incapable of ever feeling happiness) was when I realised that everything about my life was exactly how I wanted it (lovely little house, perfect wife, 3 healthy children, useful and enjoyable work, enough money to live etc) and yet the moment people left, all I could ever do was sit in a chair thinking how to kill myself.

Realising that there was nothing really wrong with my life (and so nothing to work on changing), I took myself off to the doctor and told him that story. He put me on the magic pills, and I have to say my life was utterly transformed. Far from the numbing effect which most people describe (?? possibly those who take them who aren't really depressed??), I suddenly could feel emotions (above all happiness) which I hadn't experienced at all since I was eight. I remember being with my four year old daughter, and her giving me happiness for the first time ever - how awful is that!

So to be brief, I have been on the pills for 12 years, and it has allowed me to lead a useful life, bring up my children, and help a lot of people, which would have been quite impossible otherwise.

Naturally you always want to come off them - and it is frighteningly difficult (but I look at it that I quite simply would not still be alive without them, so...). Over the years I have tried so many different kinds of flakey treatments to get cured, none of which worked. But just two months ago I actually found the answer - and I have come off the pills and feel better than I ever have before!

So what was this cure? I found that there is a fully initiated (Cuba & S. America) shaman living less than a mile from my house. I went to see him, and told him nothing about my life (actually he didn't want me to tell him anything). So he gets into the trance purely with a rattle and drum, meets up with my spirit helpers and power animal, and they tell him what is needed is (and then carry out) what is called a 'spiritual dismemberment'. God knows what is involved, but although I felt fine when I left, the next day I felt like I was badly bruised from head to foot, and had to spend a whole week in bed recovering! Given that he hadn't laid one finger on me in the session, this was pretty clear proof that something dramatic had just happened.

The second and last time I went to see him, he went into the trance, found the helpers, and they took him off somewhere to show him a part of me that I had deliberately sent away at the age of seven! (which they then brought back and blew back into me). When he came back, he asked me rather embarassedly "Is the church important in your life..? Because I was taken to a church to wait for your soul part". An amazing question, because the whole story of my childhood was of fighting against the religious indoctrination from my parents...and then I was sent away at the age of eight to board at an ultra Christian boarding school for 10 years. The soul-part apparently eventually made its appearance as a shaft of sunlight shining through the stained glass window above the altar - wonderfully camp and ironic! The story he had been told (by the helpers) was that I had put the soul part away deliberately, knowing I was about to be sent away and also in reaction to knowing (even at that age) that what I was being taught was just wrong, wrong, wrong.

A sad story really, and yet ever since that day I have felt utterly wonderful - like I have bright light inside me shining out at all times. The 7 year old soul-part stayed down around my belly button for about a week, but then suddenly moved up into my heart area, and has stayed there ever since! It's actually really cool having a 7 year old to show everything to - makes you realise how dramatically better life is as an adult (well, than my childhood anyway )

So, sorry that was so long, but it is a fairly unusual story, and might just help someone else in the same position.

Incidentally, the 'helpers' said that when I was cured I should train to 'do the work' myself...so that is my intention (if I'm capable of it ).

Good luck to all those who find themselves suffering from this illness - you can get away from it eventually.

Liméni

look around you..do you like what you see?..

When you concider the implictions of the current western paradigm do you find it to be at all balancing..does it make you feel centered?..

..When I sit and ask myself these questions I find that I dont agree with the motions of this society, nor do I find it even remotely grounding or balancing..I sure as hell dont feel centered in the slightest going along with the presets of this culture.

We are poisoned daily..we are lied to, brainwashed and force fed the same bullshit every day that our parents were fed so that they could in return feed it to us..expecting us to feed it back to our children. Alot of people blindly believe it and respond defensivly when you take any stance other than a mainstream one, becasue it creates a hole in the story they have been taught and makes them insecure. It is NOT abnormal to find alot of people annoying, and dealing with them energy consuming. I feel the same way. Doesnt mean I decide to blame them, or be angry with them..I just dont feed like I owe them my time. I have better things to do.

Our culture is a dead end road..society would be(and is) completely delusional if they think that this road is going to take us anywhere worth going. Every road leads to somewhere, but at some point you have to stop and ask yourself where it is that YOU want to go.....so, where do you want to go?

We are forced to "do something"..to "be something"..to get this and get that..your never good enough as you are in the eyes of society..

We are forced to slave away for 8 hours every day, 5 days a week doing things we dont want to do, alot of it unnecessary things at that that the world could easily do without. On top of that, we do this in order too make other rich lazy people even richer as they look down at us throwing pennies....still not even a bit dissillusioned with society?..you must be one of those guys throwing pennies...

We are robbed of our childhoods by structured insitiutions who seek to build robotic armies of complacent human slaves who, by that time are too numb and dumbed down to even ask crutial questions..we are allowed maybe 10 years to dream, to imagine before that is stolen from us like candy from a baby by self repressed, left brain dominant men and women who dont dare to dream...

We walk through a "logical" world based on ideals of dominance and controll orchestrated through fear..this world is dead. There is nothong wonderful, nothing elegant about it. It's a corpse that is slowly being burried..

I actaully am starting to think we are experienceing a sort of collective soul loss..the dreamer, stamped out long ago is now absent from the picture, wandering off in some now foreign land we were taught to deny..in a world without dreamers we no longer dream with cosmos..the great archetypes no longer recognized and syncronicities to guide us are not tangible to the waking...we are actaully TOO awake..we need to retrive the dreamer.

In this world people who start to wake up and question are quickly shot down and critisized as lazy, nutjobs etc..and we are. We are lazy in the western sense..we are unproductive in the western sense..becasue we arent good for western idealism..it's the cogs in the machine falling out of place, one by one.

Then they lable you, melancholic..depressed etc..you are sick and you need medical attention. You are brocken and you need to be fixed. Of course..they will fix you.. they will put the cogs back into place, and the machine will run on..

We are force fed poison most of our lives by the institutions that apparently love us so much so that we are partially incapable of evenb feeling the joy and bliss we are wired to experience..we are cut off from our birthright. Our food is our sustainance..it is what gives life, and it is deficient.

How great of a picture we have painted!

Be you. Go where YOU want to go. NEVER EVER base your progression on societies standards. You are NOT marginal. I definatily dont blame anyone for feeling less than enthusiastic at times about the world we are living in. We are pushed and pushed to the point of breaking, forced to grow up before we are ready, grow up into a world based on infantile 2nd circuit consciousness..Leave the ideals at home kids!..they have no place here!

It isnt a surprise that people are waking up to the lies and looking desperatily for somethign else..anything else..something more than this..this is discusting..who would CHOOSE this?..

This is just a stage..sometimes things seem slow when in transition..look at animals, some freakin hibernate for god sake!..they sleep for an entire season!..

There is nothing wrong with you. Dont let anyone tell you there is. Just be you and let yourself feel whatever it is you need to feel. The ideal eden that alot of people are realizing COULD exist is still a myth in the minds of children that is stamped out eary on..our road to eden is one that we must activly pave..society is NOT going to do that for us. This is a destination of which self fullfillment is the only route. Feeling lost is normal, and it is okay. It's just a part of the journey and the down time is to be expected.

..like mckenna once said.."the first thing we need to do is tell society to fuck off"

I need to stress that I am not saying life sucks..like is freaking amazing, so NEVER EVER take it for granted. Just dont let anyone else dictate to yoou what life is or should be. Live in YOUR world, not someone elses.

If you're having a serious depression, the best thing you can do is see a shrink. The reason why this is such a good thing to do, is that if you have a good psychiatrist or psychologist, you have someone who knows how to deal with it proffesionally and who can guide you through the healing proces on a regular basis for as long as needed.

It might help for some types of depression, but certainly not all - I feel sure it would have been no use whatsoever for me.

It is not exactly about the depression. It is more about the individual than anything else.

Wow!

Lots to think about.

I guess first and foremost I should say that I'm not at this point considering anti-depressants. When I talk about professional help I'm just talking about approaching someone more in the know who can either tie me down or tell me I'm a pussy and I need to get over it. I'm not here for assistance in a self diagnosis because... well that would just be silly. But the idea of taking something daily that I've survived this far without doesn't yet appeal to me.

Much special attention payed to jbark (as always) and Apoc I found your post to be very reassuring. These are the kind of ideas I've been applying in the past, only not to such a high level of organisation which usually in the end I lose the will power to follow through... I'll just keep trying I guess. Maybe a change of strategy is in order.

Corpus callosum: I found a lot of your info very reassuring and for sure I don't feel like all is lost and I still find pleasure in many tasks even if they are highly tinged with frustration 95% (not an accurate figure) of the time. I still get a tear in my eye when listening to a beautiful piece of music and a sense of pride watching my cacti grow.

My college room mate had been diagnosed and medicated and it wasn't pretty. He was the first to suggest that maybe I was like him but I was just having a shitty time... misery loves company I guess.

Fractal Enchanment: This is definately something I have been struggling with and have even considered giving into. However if I can't integrate with the world then how can I expect to change it or even take a piece of it for myself to save at least? I just haven't been raised with that kind of warrior mentality. I'm far too tolerant... or spineless. One of those anyway.

Infinite I: I also should have mentioned when I do this I always sound like a know-it-all twat, though I guess the artificial entity can't physically bring anything new to the table.



This is the thing. They could draw me a diagram until the truth is right there in my face but something inside tells me I'm doomed to failure even though I think I know that's not true. Like I say it's an instinct rather than reason. It almost makes me feel dirty inside like...:idea: if what they say is true I have no excuse to not make it so and I AM just lazy...

Cheers for that



phew!

I'm glad you were able to sort this out. How does one go about finding such a shaman? I presume they don't advertise, perhaps I'm wrong. Is it through word of mouth?

Secondly, do you mind mentioning what medication you were on (for comparison with my friend's medication).

Thanks

Yes, I was taking Sertraline (Lustral) initially, and then switched to a combination of Fluoxetine (e.g. Prozac) and Mirtazapine. The effect for me has been like you said - rebalancing the brain chemistry, and so, over time, re-educating the brain to function properly. I have nothing but good things to say about the drugs - well I would cos they saved my life. But they definitely are hard to come off - you need to take the capsules apart, empty some powder out and reassemble. That way you can reduce the dose very gradually over months and years. It sounds like some people don't benefit from them, but for me it was wonderful.

Several years ago I picked up a leaflet in our very alternative health food shop about this local shaman chap. I think he was trying to organise some sort of group event, and so had made these leaflets to promote it. I thought at the time that I ought to get in touch with him, but it took me several years until the time was right. He's very interesting, because his real job is as a tour manager for loads of very top-name music acts. I think he only bangs the drum as a 'calling', and you can only get him on the rare occasions when he's not away working.

Good luck with your friend - if you're in the UK I could put you onto my man, but otherwise I think there is a website called shamanicteachers.com which apparently lists recommended practitioners. It's an astonishing ability they have, and definitely 'for real'. There were loads of confirmatory details that I didn't mention in the story (so as not to derail the thread too much). e.g. He had told me that my helper spirits had told him that the second session would be a 'soul-part retrieval' session, so as I was lying there (you don't do anything yourself except lie there in the dark) I decided to just concentrate on sending up a really bright golden beam of light from my solar plexus, as a sort of welcoming beacon for the new soul-part. So when he was describing the journey to me afterwards he said "The soul-part appeared as a shaft of golden light through the church window, and you had a perfectly matching shaft of golden light pouring upwards out of your solar plexus!" Yikes!

Liméni

Well, about antidepressants i can be short: for most people with just mild symptoms of a depression it's better to avoid them, but for serious depression (and i don't think anybody of us can judge the seriousness of your problem without knowing you in daily life) they do help and should never be easily dismissed as 'just another buck for the farmacuetical industry'. I know many people here are very negative about anti-depressants and like i said, for mild depressions this is a right attitude and they are most certainly being proscribed way too easily and advertised too heavily by the industry but...for people with a real serious depressive disorder they DO statistically reach better results than both placebo as all kinds of therapy's without medication that exist out of just having conversations. It is also a fact that in those cases, a combination of therapy and medication is significantly better than medication only.

The reason i say this is because people with a depression often tend to be of the 'care-avoiding' type: they think they must be able to solve their problems all by themselves and blame themselves for being weak if they fail in this.

There are people who run to the doctor to ask for antibiotic's everytime they've got a cold and there are people who are the opposite of this. People who just carry-on whatever happens to them and often when they visit a doctor he would tell them:'you moron, you should have come here waaay sooner'.

Point is: try to be open for what an expert (psychiatrist, psychologist) will have to say and not dismiss the problems you have. You don't help yourself with that. If you feel that a diagnosis from a psychiatrist or psychologist is not right, go to another..but be open for their expertise.

There are many antidepressants that actually work and don't have too nasty side-effects. And most often when they do have side-effects, these effects will last only for the first few weeks and then gradually dissapear.

There are also many light herbal remedies like saint johnsworth or rodiola.

I've been depressed for a few years now, I can't offer advice on how to overcome it since I'm stumped myself.
I can relate to some things that you've said though like finding a lot of people annoying, and arguing just for the sake of it even though it's not accomplishing anything. Not wanting to get out of bed in the morning and extremely screwed up time schedules.

Try to get yourself back into a daily routine, waking up and sleeping at the same time everyday (I know, easier said than done).
It can make a huge difference in regulating your system and mood, or at least it did in my case. I've read somewhere that having a chaotic schedule with different wake/sleep patterns is similar to being jet-lagged 24/7.

I also resonate strongly with this, On a 4-aco-dmt trip I hit a similar roadblock that basically communicated to me
"You've been tripping non-stop without taking time to integrate, Your physical life needs attending to before this realm will open any further, unless you want the same trip to occur indefinitely it's time to get things in order."

I am still depressed so take what I say with the entire shaker of salt if you want lol.

However, these are the things that have at least allowed me to cope without having to resort to medication or therapy.